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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

100% attendance certificates at DS's school, aibu?

362 replies

BoobleBeep · 02/12/2011 10:57

DS's school has just announced they will be giving out certificates to children with 100% attendance in an assembly at the end of term..... This basically excludes any child who has been ill at any point throught the year, needed dental treatment or has parents who can't afford to take them away during expensive term time. Aibu to be a bit pissed off about this?

OP posts:
NonnoMum · 09/01/2012 22:50

I think they are brilliant. My (not academic) DD has just got her first one (in Year 2) and it gave us a moment to reflect on her good fortune at no illnesses, funerals, broken bones that have blighted her other terms at schools.
Yes - those things were unavoidable but it did make her think how lucky she was that she could just concentrate on learning and enjoying school last term.

Attendance makes a MASSIVE difference in life. Not many Barristers have a day off for period pains, do they?

EndoplasmicReticulum · 09/01/2012 22:52

My children didn't get one last year, they didn't miss much - just a couple of days each with chest infection / unspecified lurgy - probably passed on by one of the 100%ers coming to school ill and spreading germs.

I'm a bit pleased to say I would get one for last year though. Not one single day off (polishes halo, and is very grateful that my lovely parents look after my children if they are ill so I don't have to miss school).

Joolsdawn · 09/01/2012 22:53

Tethersend - to exclude children from a large fun event like a trip or a disco would be more like a punishment for those who don't go. A certificate is just a piece of paper to make them feel proud, it is not taking something away from other children to do this. I do not think that getting a sticker for getting all your words right is a "bizarre reward" I think it is common practice for teachers to give them out (it was gold stars in my day) my point was without the support of parents the children would not learn their words, have a positive attitude to school or behave well. Their is a cycle of contempt towards schools and education within some families that needs to be broken and making children proud of themselves surely can do no harm if not help this to be broken.

NonnoMum · 09/01/2012 22:59

BTW - perhaps some of you don't realise this but there is a significant number of parents who do not take their children to school because

  • it is raining
  • it is Friday
  • it is the child's birthday.

I shit you not.

Joolsdawn · 09/01/2012 23:04

Nonnomum - the other day a mother from my child's school said she didn't take her children to school because she had been out the night before and didn't get up in time. ( although I am quite enviouse as mine children would never let me sleep late even on the weekend)

clam · 09/01/2012 23:05

"it did make her think how lucky she was that she could just concentrate on learning and enjoying school last term."
She could reflect upon that? At six years old? Really?

Joolsdawn · 09/01/2012 23:08

Anyway I need to get to bed so I am not too tired to get up and get my kids to school/playgroup in the morning... Where is my reward? Oh yeah a couple of hours peace... Bliss! :)

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:08

"Does it really do any harm to the children that don't get these awards though? That's the whole point surely, if you are going to disagree with it."

Brilliant Grin Kitchenroll, you get to decide your argument, but not mine.

I have posted about 50 million times on this thread, outlining my arguments against these ridiculous 'awards'. I actually don't think I have the energy to repeat them all.

Please go back and read some of the posts from parents of children with medical conditions, along with some of the arguments against these rewards. There are many.

Jools- "I do not think that getting a sticker for getting all your words right is a "bizarre reward""

I didn't say it was- in fact, I cited it as an appropriate example of rewarding a child for their achievement. I was referring to rewards for uniform etc. as 'bizarre'.

"my point was without the support of parents the children would not learn their words, have a positive attitude to school or behave well. Their is a cycle of contempt towards schools and education within some families that needs to be broken and making children proud of themselves surely can do no harm if not help this to be broken."

This is so, so, wrong. Those parents you speak of who are completely disaffected with education rarely change because their child is excluded from a 'reward'. They need specialist support (fat chance, but there we are). Children from these families rarely get the chance to feel proud of themselves through attendance awards- in fact, the exclusion from school trips and other related rewards serves to compound and perpetuate the very disaffection which you claim they combat.

I work with children in care; often, children in abusive or neglectful homes have very poor attendance. When they are placed with foster parents, their attendance improves dramatically. What exactly is it that they have done which deserves a reward?

NonnoMum · 09/01/2012 23:10

Well - she loves school and was very grateful that she didn't have to be rushed to A and E like she has done in the past. Or go to two funerals in a week.

So she appreciated the certificate and all the standing up in assembly.

2ndtimeblues · 09/01/2012 23:20

Just calling an award "ridiculous" doesn't make it so. So far the arguments seem to be:

  • it's unfair on children who have serious medical conditions.
  • children can't help their attendance.

Well, children can often help their attendance. They certainly can in secondary school. And any kind of award might be deemed unfair to children who, for whatever reason, don't fulfil the criteria. Unfairness only really comes into it if you think it's an entitlement that is being unjustly withheld.

I don't think people are entitled to rewards just that there should be lots of scope for them. Lots of opportunities for small children to go up on stage and collect a certificate. I like lots of rewards in primary school. I think there should be more of them not fewer.

2ndtimeblues · 09/01/2012 23:22

As for the children who've been placed in foster care and now have improved attendance - brilliant. It's a sign that they now have a chance. I'm all for it.

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:26

2nd time, I have stated numerous times that I am referring specifically to children of primary school age. Children at secondary school have a great deal more control over their own attendance, therefore it makes more sense to reward them for it.

"Just calling an award "ridiculous" doesn't make it so. So far the arguments seem to be:

  • it's unfair on children who have serious medical conditions.
  • children can't help their attendance."

I don't think i have mentioned 'unfairness' once; please correct me if I'm wrong.

Primary aged children are not in control of their attendance, therefore it is ridiculous to reward them for it. I'm not sure why you dismiss this argument out of hand.

"I don't think people are entitled to rewards just that there should be lots of scope for them. Lots of opportunities for small children to go up on stage and collect a certificate. I like lots of rewards in primary school. I think there should be more of them not fewer."

I agree with this; I just think that it is possible to reward every child for something they have actually done.

IUseTooMuchKitchenRoll · 09/01/2012 23:27

I have read your arguments Tethers. I see your point, but I don't agree with it. My opinion is that the only valid reason to not like the awards is because it might upset children who have no chance of getting one because of medical stuff or parents who can't be arsed to make sure their children have good attendance.

I don't think that perceived unfairness to children who cannot get the awards is a good enough reason to take them away from children who do get them, because some children will never get awards for plenty of things and they just have to deal with it.

I understand that children often think they are fairly worthless awards and that could be seen as devaluing other awards. But I think children have more sense than that. Older children aren't bothered about the awards either way, and younger children are generally capable of judging how worthy an award is based on how the adults around them act about it.

I think it is worse for children to see another child two is often badly behaved get an award for something they do every day, and that is why all these things need to be properly explained to children. If all the awards given are explained properly, I don't think attendance awards have the potential to cause any real upset, and if they do, that is the fault of the adults handling the situation.

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:28

"As for the children who've been placed in foster care and now have improved attendance - brilliant. It's a sign that they now have a chance. I'm all for it."

We all are, it's great. But actually, they deserved the reward more before they were taken into care, not after, as they were putting up with so much more.

Please explain what it is that they have done to deserve a reward for improved attendance?

IUseTooMuchKitchenRoll · 09/01/2012 23:31

They may not have done anything, but they are still getting the message that good attendanceis important and that helps to instill a good work ethic.

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:31

"My opinion is that the only valid reason to not like the awards is because it might upset children who have no chance of getting one because of medical stuff or parents who can't be arsed to make sure their children have good attendance."

Ah. Well, my opinion is that you are completely wrong. But my opinion is not valid, is it? Only yours is. Hmm. If you could just let me know what counter arguments you will accept, that would be great Smile

I have illustrated my arguments- you have just ignored them and argued against what you believe to be the only valid counter-argument. That's a very strange debating tactic.

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:34

"They may not have done anything, but they are still getting the message that good attendanceis important and that helps to instill a good work ethic."

So it's appropriate to reward a child for something that they haven't done? Confused

IUseTooMuchKitchenRoll · 09/01/2012 23:35

I never said that your opinion isn't valid Tethers, just that I disagree and don't think it holds enough weight to make it worthy of getting rid of the awards for the children that get the pleasure of receiving them.

Of course a lot of it is about what the parents do, but parents are influenced by their children sometimes. If a child's disappointment about not getting an award prompts a lazy parent to take their child in to school when they fancy a lay in next term, then that's all good.

IUseTooMuchKitchenRoll · 09/01/2012 23:37

They have done it Tethers. They just haven't had control over whether they did it. Just like the naturally bright kid with a photographic memory doesn't have much control over the fact that they pretty much always remember all their spellings without any effort.

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:37

You did, Kitchenroll. You said: "My opinion is that the only valid reason to not like the awards is because it might upset children who have no chance of getting one because of medical stuff or parents who can't be arsed to make sure their children have good attendance." My objections to the award are other than the ones you have cited; ergo my arguments are not valid.

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:38

"They may not have done anything," / "They have done it Tethers"

Make your mind up Grin

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:43

Off to bed. Goodnight Smile

IUseTooMuchKitchenRoll · 09/01/2012 23:45

Fair enough, sorry! I didn't mean to come across like I meant your opinions weren't valid. I can see I said it like that but I didn't mean it!

I just mean that I can't see why anyone would be that upset about the awards unless their child was upset that they didn't get one. Schools give out lots of fairly pointless rewards ime. One of the classes at my school has a medal that is given out for good effort. Every child gets a turn at having the medal whether or not they have made an effort. Teachers will look for the tiniest thing and focus on it just so that every child gets the bloody medal. I think that's sillier tbh, because in those cases the child really has done nothing. At least turning up every day is something, and I do think that showing good attendance is important is, well, important.

IUseTooMuchKitchenRoll · 09/01/2012 23:46

Me too, dh is bugging me and cant believe I am having a such an important converstaion about something so trivial! Grin

tethersend · 09/01/2012 23:50

Oh Christ, don't get me started on bloody 'effort rewards', I'll be here ranting all night Grin

DEFINITELY going to bed now!

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