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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Surestart centre giving whole grapes to babies and toddlers

161 replies

delicioso · 17/11/2011 17:44

I've been to my local surestart centre a few times and they often have a snack table.

Sometimes there's a formal snack time and other times the table is just left ouf for children to help themselves.

They often serve whole grapes as a snack - I know they maybe don't have time to cut the grapes up but I have a friend who is a paediatric nurse and has seen more than one fatality in children who have choked on grapes Sad

I'm probably going to be told IABU because it's the parents responsibility to cut them up. I do bite them half for my 15 month old, but today as I was sitting with her distracted talking to someone the surestart lady held out the bowl of grapes to her and she took one and started eating it and I had to fish it out of her mouth.

Lots of the parents don't sit up with the children at snack time and I guess I just think it's a bit dangerous if one of the little ones chokes on one. I just wonder why they don't serve something else instead if they aren't going to cut up the grapes.

OP posts:
halcyondays · 17/11/2011 20:14

Yanbu, I've been to lots of different groups in my time and pretty much all of them cut the grapes up. It's not hard to do and could prevent a child choking to death.

Rational · 17/11/2011 20:18

Is this childcare or is it a drop-in service? We don't have them in Scotland.

If it's just a drop-in centre then I think it's reasonable that you might have to prepare the food yourself for your own needs. Not all children will require their food cut up.

noyouhavehadawee · 17/11/2011 20:20

Tomorrow i am going to cut my lunch short to cut all the grapes in half as i have already bought this weeks fruit, you will all know who i am if tomorow at BF if the grapes are cut Grin. Then i will do a tidy little risk assesment on grapes - i am so excited already ha!

Feminine · 17/11/2011 20:24

noyou Confused

itspeanutbutterjellytime · 17/11/2011 20:24

rational it's a drop in centre that provides various groups, including baby massage, messy play and bf support groups.

Rational · 17/11/2011 20:27

Thanks Smile

Meh, she needs to sort her own grapes out then.

Really, is this what people get upset about?

Groovee · 17/11/2011 20:28

Do they have a suggestions box? You could pop a suggestion in the box about the grapes. But I don't get why you won't just speak to a manager. Surely it could then be passed on to the other rooms.

Tianc · 17/11/2011 20:29

noyouhavehadawee, could you do what would might also work for the SureStart centres, ie ask an adult visitor to cut up a batch of grapes up so they can be put out?

Two birds one stone: solves the labour problem, educates parent that this is a job that needs doing.

The missing part of the equation in the OP seemed to be the centre knowing this needs done. Which the OP was wondering whether to address and if so how best.

Lovethesea · 17/11/2011 20:35

Grapes are ideal for choking small children. As someone already said, perfect size and shape for obstructing their airway and the skin is tacky and almost impossible to dislodge with back slapping. Other food would come out, grapes won't move.

It doesn't take a moment to cut or tear them in half and if there really isn't time they shoud provide something else. I would hate to be at a group trying to watch both my kids knowing there were whole grapes in their reach. I am not risk averse, but I have read enough of the science and statistics of grapes and choking to see them as a lot worse than other food.

Yes, a small child can choke on anything - but IF it is a whole grape they are at much higher risk of brain damage or death. It is worrying that a sure start group leader doesn't know that.

princessofpersians · 17/11/2011 20:38

Maybe Surestart centres aren't allowed to have knives on the premises for safety reasons? :)

My dd loves the moment she crunches into a super cold grape, she'd be upset if she was denied the pleasure - but she is always supervised when she does so.

AngelofTheLordiscomingDown · 17/11/2011 20:42

Risk assessments. Soon, children will not be allowed to have 3 foot slides in their gardens or even - God forbid - swings.

kumquatsarethelonelyfruit · 17/11/2011 20:43

Any Surestart centres round here serve whole grapes. I noticed immediately as I am quite paranoid about them too. I never make a fuss, just bite DS2's in half. My friend told me recently about a friend of her's having a child who nearly choked to death on a grape. I am similarly paranoid about balloons, especially burst pieces.

bonkersLFDT20 · 17/11/2011 20:45

Do Surestart Centres have to be Ofsted regulated? If so then I'm pretty sure they would either be advised not to serve grapes or have to 1/2 them.

My DSs nursery does not even serve grapes (not sure whether it's due to the choking risk or some other reason).

It's not a new neurosis, I remember my Mum (RIP) cutting up grapes for my younger sisters.

I would mention it to the staff.

mrsjay · 17/11/2011 20:46

Hiya i work for homestart not the same but similar to surestart and at our group i DO cut grapes for the littles although if the grapes are tiny i dont children do need to learn to chew Wink however the monster grapes i did recently i had to quarter they were mutant , so i dont think you are being unreasonable , ( ive not been here long i dont do abbreviations Grin )

gahhteenagers · 17/11/2011 20:59

Well done OP for highlighting this issue. Cant believe some peoples attitude. Windpipes are round ! Malteasers are also dangerous as they melt into the windpipe. You sarcastic ones might like to have a little think on that one. Nearly lost both my DD'S as toddlers one popped a conker in her mouth and the other was given a round sweet by someone. it is not something you want to experience believe me.

dikkertjedap · 17/11/2011 21:05

YANBU - the problem is a lot of people lack a basic awareness of safety and totally lack common sense.

Grapes, peanutbutter without butter/margarine and hot dogs are major choking hazards for young children. Our grandparents knew these things. Many parents nowadays don't have a clue and don't want to know.

OhDoAdmit · 17/11/2011 21:10

Grapes should be cut up.
I am on the benign neglect end of the parenting spectrum.
But I work in the community with young children and you would be utterly heartbroken if I could break confidentiality and tell you what I know.

Cut up grapes. Just do.

OP -- just mention gently that you are worried that the grapes are not cut and suggest that they should be.

They might think you are being precious but they will cut them up.

mrsboombastic · 17/11/2011 21:45

I work in a children's centre, we would always cut grapes in half due to the risk to small children yanbu! If they are run by the local authority then you can ring them to ask that they review which foods they serve and how the food is served in the centres in that area, they should take you seriously. I would also call that particular centres manager and explain your concerns which are valid.

mrsboombastic · 17/11/2011 21:47

And children centres are ofsted regulated.

jellybeans · 17/11/2011 23:21

YANBU Grapes should be cut up. One of my DSs choked badly on apple twice but luckily I was able to dislodge it. Grapes/hotdogs etc are pliable and able to mould to the windpipe and expand to fit it exactly. I always cut mine until my DC were much older than toddlers. I have noticed a group I do also give full grapes so I may mention it to them as well.

Ripeberry · 17/11/2011 23:26

One parent years ago before I became a CM said it was dangerous to cut grapes in half as it was smaller. I just looked at her and said it was the shape that was important not the size.

Scary! So many stories about babies/toddlers chocking in shops because parents think it's OK to give them a grape Sad

BertieBotts · 17/11/2011 23:32

They should cut them up if there are one year olds routinely at the table. Once they're 2+ it's less of an issue because you can teach them to bite the grape before swallowing it but little ones don't always get that. At our sure start group it's a bit of a free for all and there are babies as young as 6 or 7 months joining in with snack time. They don't often have grapes, more often banana/apple/pear with the odd satsuma, but when they did I think they chopped them.

Sometimes though they have new volunteers in who are students and have never worked with children before and just don't know - we had one give them full strength squash until I mentioned that they normally dilute it a lot more and she didn't mind me saying at all.

StealthPolarBear · 17/11/2011 23:45

Surprised at this thread. Most "grape" threads on MN are almost unanimous in the need to cut them up for toddlers. Sure Start centres are, I thought, supposed to be a safe place for parents to go with their children - this seems on a par with "no hot drinks", which most also have.
The OP was expressing surprise that parenting professionals do not know this, she mentioned it at the time but recognises she is not there every day, and wondered whether mentioning it centrally as a follow up might be more effective than trawling round all centres.

And yet most responses are of the "do it yourself, your child your responsibility" type. Well yes, but what about other children?
And if anyone says anything about them being their parents' responsibility, I will trot out the old MN favourite: "takes a community to raise a child"

Towndon · 17/11/2011 23:55

YANBU. If they don't have time to cut up the grapes, they should serve something else as a snack.

TheFrogs · 17/11/2011 23:56

I've always wondered why this is such an issue. My mum fed whole grapes to my dd when she was younger, refused to accept they were a choking hazard despite my requests and it did really make me angry.

My response was that come on, how long does it take to cut/rip them up? Mum, even if you think its tripe, it takes a few minutes to cut the things up...humour me. Why even risk it when its such an easy thing to do?

grape-chop, done.