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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think this woman shouldn't be volunteering with this level of prejudice?

114 replies

QueenOfFlamingEverything · 17/11/2011 16:49

I am doing a preparation course to become a HomeStart volunteer (for anyone who doesn't know, that will entail visiting families with young children in their own homes to befriend them and offer support).

The course is all women over 50 (except for me), many of whom (but not all) are quite old-fashioned in their attitudes but generally open to discussion and not prejudiced.

On the first week, one of the women, when we were discussing reasons why families break up, said she thought it was 'very selfish of women to take children away from their father' and that she thought that relationship counselling should be compulsory, even if the relatonship was violent/abusive.

A few sessions later she said, during a discussion on abortion, that the feelings of the father should be taken into account and that he should be able to prevent the woman having an abortion and raise the child himself if he wanted to, as it was selfish of women to deprive men of the chance of fatherhood.

Then, this week, she said that gay couples shouldn't be allowed to adopt because (and this is verbatim, I am not exaggerating here) 'there was a risk the child could be interefered with' Shock Angry

I (politely) disagreed with all the above statements btw. I cannot quite believe the course supervisors are going to let her loose on vulnerable families though... Would you say anything?

OP posts:
LRDtheFeministDragon · 17/11/2011 17:20

Sorry, I'm not sure which bit is sarcasm and which is not MrSpoc - are you serious about the abortion comment?

I don't see what is one-sided about it TBH. It is not really difficult to buy and use contraception if you do not want children.

MrSpoc · 17/11/2011 17:23

MumblingAndBloodyRagDoll - same argument then that is SHE doesnt want kids she should also make sure contraception is used by both cause if the MAN wants the kid, he will not wear a condom. its works both ways yet the women holds all the cards.

MrSpoc · 17/11/2011 17:23

my sarcasm was about gay people having children.

Fluffycloudland77 · 17/11/2011 17:23

The local homestart here helped dhs exp go bankrupt to the tune of £50k gave her all the advice she needed and represented her in the small claims court.

She didnt have kids, step kids but they were teenage.

So their not whiter than white.

MrSpoc · 17/11/2011 17:25

LRD i am not saying if the man does not want a child her should wear a condom, i am saying if the woman gets pregnant and the man wants the child but she does not, the man should have some say in it.

thisisyesterday · 17/11/2011 17:26

no MrSpoc, i'm afraid I couldn't see the sarcasm. the internet is funny like that

MrSpoc · 17/11/2011 17:27

never mind, i remember not to use humour here in future.

hellsbells76 · 17/11/2011 17:27

fucksake, that's the second time I've heard that argument in a week. If he didn't want the child, he had the option to use a condom. Once it's born, he's supposed to stump up (although many, many 'fathers' don't and there's not a whole lot women can do about it but I don't see you getting all aerated about that WAY more common scenario).

And of course it's one-bloody-sided. It kind of has to be, what with the whole women having to go through the pregnancy and birth thing.

thisisyesterday · 17/11/2011 17:27

well the money is for the baby isn't it. who didn't ask to be conceived.

so no, i don't have a problem with men having to pay for children they have fathered. sorry

QueenOfFlamingEverything · 17/11/2011 17:29

Fluffycloudland - HomeStart can only get involved with a family if there is a child under 5. And they are not legal advisors so could not possible represent someone in court.

And zubin - I hardly think a totally anonymised discussion with the location undisclosed breaches confidentiality. I haven't discussed it with anyone in RL for this very reason, hence turning to MN as a sounding board.

OP posts:
Peachy · 17/11/2011 17:30

I used to run just those courses OP, alongside my manager as I worked for that charity.

I would be frankly amazed if she apsses the course; she might be asked to resit or told to go away but we'd not have let her near a family- we'd have let her complete the course though to help us decide what to do with her

thisisyesterday · 17/11/2011 17:30

"the man wants the child but she does not, the man should have some say in it."

he does have some say in it. he can say to her "i'd really like you to keep the baby"

but ultimately it HAS to be her choice. you can't force someone to carry and give birth to a baby and then give it away to its father. that's just ridiculous

Peachy · 17/11/2011 17:31

Do discuss with your Organiser though, I imagine she'd be chuffed you picked up on it

MrSpoc · 17/11/2011 17:32

the point is clearly lost.

I agree all PARENTS should pay and support the child. THIS IS NOT THE POINT I AM TRYING TO MAKE.

My point is this:

Woman wants kid but man does not = Woman has kid regardless
Man wants kid - woman does not = Woman aborts regardless.

My point is that men should have more of a say in these things. After all it would then be EQUAL.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 17/11/2011 17:32

Why should the man have some say though, MrSpoc? It is her body.

It is healthy for a relationship to discuss decisions with your partner, but that's it. The man cannot do anything to carry a foetus. He can't make up for what that will do to a woman's body. So how can he make a choice about it in any meaningful way?

KatieMiddIeton · 17/11/2011 17:32

Fucking hell. I refer people to Homestart - they are a wonderful organisation - but I would be horrified if any parents had to deal with such a bigot.

Please complain. She is awful and should not be allowed to volunteer.

Peachy · 17/11/2011 17:33

Funny, our volunteers KNEW the training was a simultaneous assessment. Either you've got a rougue HS which would bloody amaze me, or it wasn't quite explained right.

KatieMiddIeton · 17/11/2011 17:33

And well done you for volunteering. It's a wonderful thing you do Smile

LRDtheFeministDragon · 17/11/2011 17:34

It wouldn't be equal - how could a man equal the work a woman does to carry a child? Confused

It's not as if men have no choice at all - it's just their choices come before they get someone pregnant. Either you can choose to use contraception, or to find a partner who also wants a baby. I don't think either of these are really difficult, are they?!

Peachy · 17/11/2011 17:34

KateMiddleton we actively pulled people for similar stuff I assure you

hellsbells76 · 17/11/2011 17:34

We get your point. Unfortunately your point is bollocks.

MumblingAndBloodyRagDoll · 17/11/2011 17:35

MrSpoc No...woman can''t have aby regardless..not if Man isn't having unprotected sex she can't. If he does....well then he takes his chancces doesn't he?

The point is lost on you love....not anyone else!

MrSpoc · 17/11/2011 17:36

LRDtheFeministDragon because it is his child. its simple

thisisyesterday · 17/11/2011 17:36

mrspoc, when men can carry and give birth to babies it will be equal.

piedpiper4 · 17/11/2011 17:37

You're right. There is no pass or fail on a Home-Start training course, but that doesn't mean that everyone gets placed with a family. Before a volunteer is matched with a family, the charity uses a strict 'matching process' to ensure that a volunteer is suitable to be placed with the family they may potentially support. The thing is that we all have viewpoints on things. The key is being aware of them. The Home-Start training course is about bringing your views to the fore, and becoming more aware of them, so that you will not use these prejudices when working with the families.

Whilst it sounds as though this ladies views are extreme, and potentially damaging to certain vulnerable people, she 'may' be able to support some people. The charity would need to ascertain this before matching her. Sometimes it is impossible to match volunteers for a variety of reasons, and these volunteers have to be 'let go'.

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