To have written to the school about the Christmas shoebox scheme?

[gastrognome]

Just had a look through the leaflet sent home from DD1's school about the Christmas shoebox scheme that they are involved in.

Turns out the organisation adds religious literature to the boxes before they are distributed.

I love the idea of filling and sending a Christmas shoebox for somebody less privileged than us, but I really don't like the fact that these schemes are used as a means to evangelise. Of course Christmas is by its very nature a Christian festival but I don't think that it's right to "spread the word" by stealth.

So I just wrote to DD's school and suggested that next year they look for a similar scheme that isn't so evangelical in nature. I said I'd be happy to help research any organisations they could work with.

Do any others feel the same way, or have I turned into Scrooge?

I have the same issue with the Shoebox (Operation Christmas Child/Samaritans Purse?)

And I have issues with the shipping of boxes - there are better ways to spend money than shipping stuff half way around the world - like buying the items in the country perhaps?

Oh and they sift through the boxes and take out the stuff that's been put in and re-distribute it amongst boxes if you've been too generous or too miserly in your box.

Hate hate hate it.

Unfortunately in deepest rural Northern Ireland where the school is full of evangelical christians I haven't a hope of changing their minds. So I reluctantly do the shoebox every year as if not, Dd would be the only child not participating.

Does anyone elase do it? I think it is a lovely idea and a shame to stop it if there isn't an alternative.

Also, IIRC there was a MNetter who lived abroad and whose kids attended a private school and they all got shoeboxes even though they weren't in need?

Also, kids don't get the boxes unless they attend Sunday school or somesuch - which is offensive to the beliefs of their own families imho

Yanbu.

It should be done through a church if it's going to have a religious message, not a school.

The message the children recieveing these boxes will get is 'this is what being Christian is about, you be Christian, you get Christmas presents.'

When it should be 'there are people in the world that care about you and want you to have this stuff no matter who you are and no matter what you believe in because you are a child and you are worthy of kindness'

I hate that religion turns something that could be lovely into Bible Bashing.

My DD's school supports the Rotary Shoebox Scheme. I just checked the leaflet and they have no religious or political affiliations, and their shoeboxes are for disadvantaged children in Albania, Montenegro, Tanzania and Romania. Their web address is www.rotary1110.org.uk if you wanted to pass those details along to anyone at your school.
I think I would feel equally uncomfortable with donations that were alongside evangelical religious literature, even though the school my DDs attend is a church school.
Of course, the school may respond that it is your choice whether or not you participate and it is the choice of the senior leadership team/board of governors as to which charities they choose to support.

YABU.
Get over it. Join in, don't join in.
Sounds terrible, spreading a message of peace, hope and love to children who dont have very much.
So they may attend a church service? At Christmas? Call the police, this is terrible!

I am so fed up of this 'people are being indoctrinated' nonsense that some people spout! What do you think they are going to do to them? Lock them in the church till they believe!?

That is not the way it works. And instead of moaning about it, set up your own scheme if the Christian aspect of it is too 'distasteful' for you.

Well said Knickers.

Is it a C of E (or other religiously affiliated school)? If so, YABU.

Even if not, I think YA still BU, as it's up to the school what type of charity they support.

I don't think religious literature should be included. When we have done this shoebox thing, it was through our church but I have not heard that they open and redistribute the contents or possibly add leaflets. If they do, I am not aware of it. I did see a mention on tv once of a different organisation who managed a shoebox contribution scheme and the spokeswoman said they often have to take things out which are obviously second-hand (used clothes in bad condition, broken toys etc)

The thing is, as Fluffy says it is not even a good way to help people who need help.

The reason why they are no major charities running these kinds of schemes isn't because they haven't thought of it, it is because they work with local communities and organisations and ask them what kind of support they want - and the answers are around education, health, water, energy, enterprise, human rights, anti-corruption etc..,not Xmas gifts.

Instead of wasting parents and children's time and money buying, wrapping and shipping low value tat around the world to be used as a tool for evangelism, schools could teach children about just one of these issues and collect money for a reputable charity at xmastime.

It may not be such an immediately attractive idea as wrapping shoeboxes - but the point is that charity isn't about what is best for the giver it's about what is best for the receiver.

(YANBU)

The gifts the children receive are not given without strings attached. That is morally wrong.

The man behind Operation Christmas Child is the son of Billy Graham, who in case you don't know is anti-Semitic, advocated the use of nuclear weapons in Vietnam

Mr Graham Jnr believes that Islam is a wicked and evil religion. He rode with IDF convoys into Lebanon during Israel?s 1982 invasion to reach Palestinian refugees, preached to Kurds fleeing Saddam?s forces in 1991 and sheltered and proselytized young Bosnian Muslim girls who had been raped by Orthodox Christian Serbs.

They state on their own website that the purpose of giving small gifts to children in their "shoebox charity" is to position themselves to convert the needy away from their local culture and to adopt the Graham approved beliefs.

Children have to attend a rally and are enrolled in a 10-step discipleship programme.

I could go on but I won't.

Also, what about my point WRT the fact that shipping shoeboxes around the world is inefficient and it would bring more benefit to buy the gifts in the country intended to be helped?

YANBU. We did it at our school, and lied to the school about the evangelising.

Btw, Refuge this year are campaigning for presents for women and children there, would that suit you or the school? I think it may have been linked to before, but the facebook page is here:

www.facebook.com/RefugeCharity?sk=wall

Oops, meant to type 'they lied to the school about the evangelising'.

IN 1991 in El Salvador, they refused to allow Catholics to receive temporary homes provided by US government aid unless they went to an evangelising prayer session.

They do open the boxes and each and every box has an evangelical leaflet put in it.

And the US equivalent of the charities commission has concerns about the operation of the organisation.

My DS is the only child not participating. I should write a letter

Can't you put in a Dawkins book with it if it bothers you? I agree that it seems a bit mental to be putting in any propaganda, and would want to see the leaflets etc. (wouldn't actually mind if they were putting a bible in but some leaflets are crap). I wouldn't not participate because of this though, that seems unfair.

I looked up Samaritans Purse when DS1's school were asked to do it, and found it was a dodgy evangelical Christian organisation so chose not to contribute. I also didn't contribute to a homeless charity at Harvest Festival as I know the organisation benefiting had some very unsavoury practices (priest in charge exposed on a TV documentary giving money to drug addicts in return for sexual favours). The school must think I'm a right Scrooge.

I fail to understand what is so wrong with teaching our children to consider those worse off then themselves. The idea of the shoeboxes is to give a precious gift to a child who otherwise would have nothing. I also fail to see what is wrong with the Christian involvement, it gives the gift of hope to a child who is living in desperate conditions.
Someone complained at our school and thw school stopped doing them altogether. Which i think is a real shame.

Also they dont only give them out at sunday schools, they distribute the boxes in schools also. I know this because a mumsnetter a couple of years ago posted about it saying she was annoyed as her child was given a box at school but it was a private school ( which she paid for) and she was upset that a box meant for a child in poverty had reached her very well off dd. I was shocked at this, but that's another thread altogether.

agree with knickers

you are more bothered by the fact its religious, than the fact it might might some child feel cared for

a very sad view

' I also fail to see what is wrong with the Christian involvement, it gives the gift of hope to a child who is living in desperate conditions.'

Can you not see how patronizing that is? Do you think Muslim children (who are often targeted) might not be upset to be told what they believe is lies?

I'm gobsmacked.

No-one seriously imagines sending a shoebox of old tat halfway around the world is more than a gesture. It could conceivably be a nice, if not very efficient gesture, but when you put it together with evangelising children I think it's disgusting.

I'm glad it's not just me that's a bit uncomfortable with this DS's nursery sent it home - but as he doesn't really understand it and I'm not a fan of evangelical anything , we are going to do our usual Christmas charity thing and support help the aged (less ahhh factor but just as worthy of help)

msrm.org.uk/liab.html

No religious affiliation.

But I have to say - if you aren't 'religious' and are so morally outraged with the Christian ethos - then don't be such a hypocrite and I suggest you stop celebrating religious festivals.

Stop
Bloody
Moaning

I feel very soap-boxy this morning

It's not a faith school.

I don't object to the shoebox scheme as an idea - I think it's good for privileged children to stop and think about those who are less well off than them. I also don't have a problem with Christian aid organisations per se, as many of them do a lot of good work.

What I object to is the rather sneaky way this organisation - linked to the Samaritan's Purse - seems to be evangelising and disseminating their literature.

I suggested to the school that they look for an alternative scheme next year and said I'd be happy to help.

Seriously, it's not the Christian message that bothers me, it's the way they are going about spreading it.

I would just like to add a comment to clarify a few misconceptions regarding samaritans purse. Firstly they do not add literature to the boxes. In some places if it is culturally appropriate then literature is offered with the boxes it is not however a condition of recieving the boxes. They give the boxes to children regardless of their background. They are invited to join in sunday school programs too but again this is not a condition of recieving the box They do check the contents of the boxes to make sure they are culturally appropriate and for some areas they do have to make some adjustments to the contents and they do add in a extra items if a box is a bit thin on contents so that people can just put in as much as they can afford. One of the reasons they send boxes is because people like to send something tangible rather than just donating money so it enncourages people to give who otherwise wouldn't. Check out their website for more info

www.operationchristmaschild.org.uk

OP I'm not sure I understand why you you think they 'spread the word by stealth' as they do make it clear that they are a christian organisation. If you look at their website they are very open about the whole process.

Also surely as Christmas is a christian festival celebrating Jesus (the central figure of christianity) coming then it makes sense to explain to people why you are giving them boxes.

However if you don't agree with their beliefs then there are other ways you can be generous at christmas and you anbu in expressing your views to the school however it would be important to ensure that other parents views were considered as well as many may support the schools choice of organisation in which case you could send a box through another organisation separately from the school if that was what you wanted.

Sorry for the long post but as several posts contained misconceptions I felt it was important to clarify the facts.