Why are so many non-Christians bothered about the (relatively few) borrowings from the Christian myth in the Narnia books?

[BelfastBloke]

Apart from Aslan's resurrection in one book, which is quite heavy-handed, Christian elements don't seem to be that prevalent across the seven books.

Yet many people seem to be deeply suspicious that the Chronicles of Narnia are a form of propaganda which will indoctrinate their kids.



I know that CS Lewis was a part-time Christian evangelist (and full-time Professor of Medieval Lit), but the books themselves don't seem suffused with the doctrines in the way one might expect; and certainly not in the way they're sometimes described.

Its just another story to me. A fairly familiar, preachy one, vut just a story. Then again, I view the Bible as a story too.

I enjoyed reading both books and do not really care about the link.

Lots of books are influenced by other writings, I don't see the big deal.

I don't think they will indoctrinate my kids. But I hate subterfuge. And these books a given to very young children who are not old enough to sort out the propaganda from the story.

It's actually the attitude to women that I find most repugnant. Oh, and the reverence in which a series of not brilliantly written books is held. They appear to be completely above criticism.

I read the books when I was a kid... have never been aware of any propaganda.

The Christian element went straight over my head as a child. Just another story. Don't all cultures have stories about dying and coming back after death? If you find that creepy/inappropriate fair enough, but it's not specific to Christianity and IMO the only way a child would work out that's what Lewis meant would be if they were already familiar with the Christian story anyhow.

Mind you, the Last Battle is just a bit crap and scary for little ones.

seeker - good point about the women! They're quite, ahem, racist too, aren't they?! Horse and his boy is, anyhow. And Dawn Treader.

'Of their time', I suppose you'd say.

There are LOADS of references to Christian myths in the Narnia books. The apple that Aslan gives Diggory for his mother, which comes from the garden. The witch tempts him with it.
Aslan dies for Edmund's sins - Edmund being the traitor.
In the end the children all go to Aslan's land - heaven. Susan doesn't because she no longer believes.
Aslan tells the children he is known by another name in their world (presumably God or Jesus). Aslan at one point turns into a lamb... It goes on.

CS Lewis quote:
Since Narnia is a world of Talking Beasts, I thought He [Christ] would become a Talking Beast there, as He became a man here. I pictured Him becoming a lion there because (a) the lion is supposed to be the king of beasts; (b) Christ is called "The Lion of Judah" in the Bible; (c) I'd been having strange dreams about lions when I began writing the work. The whole series works out like this.
The Magician's Nephew tells the Creation and how evil entered Narnia.
The Lion etc the Crucifixion and Resurrection.
Prince Caspian restoration of the true religion after corruption.
The Horse and His Boy the calling and conversion of a heathen.
The Voyage of the "Dawn Treader" the spiritual life (especially in Reepicheep).
The Silver Chair the continuing war with the powers of darkness
The Last Battle the coming of the Antichrist (the Ape), the end of the world and the Last Judgement.

(Pinched from wikipedia) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_The_Chronicles_of_Narnia

They are great stories but they are full of Christian imagery, so I don't agree with you there. Aslan is God. Children are given various trials based on their "weaknesses". The World's End is heaven. Narnia itself is heaven (?). The Calormene are nasty infidels from the East. The White Witch is the devil, there's load in the books about "modern ideas" about children being indoctrinated to reject faith and rely on science, especially in The Silver Chair. The whole idea that Lucy is the only one of the children who steadfastly believes that Aslan is around, but doesn't have the courage of her convictions when others ridicule her (The Lion the Witch and the Wardrobe, Prince Caspian)

If I knew more about Christianity I could probably tell you more ....

Who is bothered and why? They are just stories - I loved them, even as a kid I noticed the Christian element.

thanks Skyrg - I remember some of those now

It's only since becoming a Christian (in the last year) that I found out the background behind all the books I read them all as a child and loved them.
I've never heard any one refusing to read them invade of indoctrination though

Folktales all over the world are loaded with particular spiritual inuendo.Some people even do believe in elves and fairies don't you know?

In case of

I read them as a child and only found out about the supposed Christian stuff from Mumsnet. Thus I have no issues whatsoever with my children reading them.

"And these books a given to very young children who are not old enough to sort out the propaganda from the story."

They won't see any propaganda, just the story. Nothing in it says This is The Truth about God and you Must Believe It. If you want it to be, it is just a story.

Having said that, I also view the Bible as just a good story....

I didn't like them at all. Felt he wasn't keen on the girls. Ironic really, given that I'm a catholic...

Just read that scaredbear and am ashamed to say I laughed and rolled my eyes a lot.

Yet, those who object made some good points and there's no denying that there's a strong element of eastern culture about Waybaloo, however I do not believe for one second that it is covert indoctrination!

I do hate Waybaloo though, and not for its content or what has inspired that content, I just find it bloody sleep inducing nonsense. But then, its not made for me.

"The Magician's Nephew tells the Creation and how evil entered Narnia.
The Lion etc the Crucifixion and Resurrection.
Prince Caspian restoration of the true religion after corruption.
The Horse and His Boy the calling and conversion of a heathen.
The Voyage of the "Dawn Treader" the spiritual life (especially in Reepicheep).
The Silver Chair the continuing war with the powers of darkness
The Last Battle the coming of the Antichrist (the Ape), the end of the world and the Last Judgement."

Obviously these ideas and themes (some of them vague) are present in Narnia. but you could write a very similar list about Harry Potter, or Star Wars, or the Matrix.

So what if they riff on themes that have Christian roots, and throw in other myths and traditions too? Fauns, Bacchus, Poseidon, dryads, Ogres, stars with their own personalities, etc.

yes you can recognise things, but it's not one-to-one equivalencies with Christian myths.

The god Tash has many differences from Allah. The white witch has differences from Satan.

Which series DON'T have "the continuing war with the powers of darkness"?

I loved the books as a child and remain a hardline atheist. I don't know that I would stop DS reading them on the grounds of the Christian crap in them, I'd be more concerned about the racism (especially for a child who lives in a very multi-cultural area).

Seeker - if they weren't brilliantly written they would not have passed the test of time. Things last for a reason. Not being to your personal taste != being not brilliantly written.

Same here SoupDragon

Love the Narnia books. Want to read them to dd but at 5 yo I think maybe she's too young? I haven't watched any of the movies - are they any good and do you think they are okay for 5 & 6 year olds?

Fwiw on Waybaloo, dd (a bit old for it now I know) but she wouldn't watch the show. Or Balamory for that matter. In her words 'feels nasty, Mummy'.

The books do a lot more than just vaguely reference themes of Christianity (as many many many books do!). They are a quite explicit adaptation.

That bothers me not at all.

But am a bit bothered, as a reader, by the idea that anyone could miss this about the books! If one doesn't see this, one is missing out on a huge layer of meaning in the books.

I don't see how a child brought up in a strict atheistic household would know that an apple is meant to represent the apple of Eden? Surely if the child already knows that, the problem is not these books but the fact that you've been teaching/someone's been teaching the child about Christianity already?

(Personally, I think it's a deprivation not to learn about Christianity because it underpins much of Western culture and literature, but I don't see the logic here if you do think it's a problem).

We're watching the american cartoon version of LWW, on YouTube, with my almost-four year old. Dipping in to the recent film version too, but just the wardrobe/faun/beaver scenes.