To think a school can't legally suddenly ban the headscarf for muslin girls!

[Headscarfs123]

So our local catholic school has banned the headscarf this week...disastrous for some of the girls but also against church advice that headscarfs are fine, against DFES advice about consultation and sensitivity to religious groups, against best practice as this type of change should involve the governing body? discriminatory on religious and sexist grounds...Sikh boys can keep their turbans.

Aibu to think that the school is legally in the wrong?

One observation is tha a side effect of being liberal and standing up for your values of human rights and religious tolerance is that the religiously intolerant gain ground, whilst never respecting the liberal ideas that let them do so.

stonign some years ago?

teh first link i come across when googling stoning

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1350945/Horrific-video-emerges-Taliban-fighters-stoning-couple-death-adultery.html

august 2010

Who is religiously intolerant? The catholic school?

" I shall approach a male authority figure about this."

I am referring to the religious men in authority who draw up the protocols. It's not women is it?

onagar I meant it would be hard to outlaw headcoverings as a religious attribute - because people cover their hair for non-religious reasons (though few use Muslim head scarves to do it, most use cloth caps/bandana type coverings) as well as some professions require some kind of headcovering. So, yes, we could ban certain types of headcoverings that are typically religious, but unless we banned them all we couldn't ban using them being used by an individual covering their head for religious reasons because it would hard to police motive.

I think the main problem with this debate is that headscarf/head covering is being used to equal just the Muslim type of head scarves when really there are dozens of different types of scarves and other types of head coverings used. There are many groups and individuals who cover their head for completely non-religious reasons. A woolly bobble hat is a head covering, but I doubt it would raise any ire.

Thats not where I lived cantspel. More than one Muslim country in the world.

Anway what I said as I personally lived their years ago if you read my post. Didn't see any stonings.

"You still won't give me any explanations BEHIND the Religious reasons. Fill it out a bit.

Try not to turn it back on me. This is just a debate."

Read my posts properly. It isn't a debate as far as you are concerned, because you aren't listening. If you read my post properly you will know the answer to the question you keep asking me. I'll repeat again in this one, a bit louder:

^I AM NOT A MUSLIM. AS SUCH, I AM NOT BEST PLACED TO EXPLAIN TO YOU, IN DEPTH, THE REASONS, RELIGIOUS/CULTURAL AS THEY MAY BE, FOR THE WEARING OF HEADSCARVES.

PLEASE SEEK OUT A MUSLIM TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION IN FULL.^

I'm not bothering asking you for the umpteenth time whether you have any muslim friends to explain it to you, as I have helpfully suggested to you several times already, as it is clear you don't.

" a side effect of being liberal and standing up for your values of human rights and religious tolerance is that the religiously intolerant gain ground, whilst never respecting the liberal ideas that let them do so."

I tend to agree with this.

"The explaination is that their religion says so" I'm not sure whose explaination that is but most people ime have no idea where the lines between religious dress and cultural fashion blur- as with the headscarf. If it was a religious obligation then it would follow that each (woman) who followed that religion would Have to observe it or they would not be a follower. This simply isn't the case, even in Arab countries.

"One observation is tha a side effect of being liberal and standing up for your values of human rights and religious tolerance is that the religiously intolerant gain ground, whilst never respecting the liberal ideas that let them do so."

Female this is exactly the next point I was going to make.

However, there need to be no contradiction between liberalism and creating certain rules of behaviour in the public space. After all nobody claims there is human rights infringement when prevented from driving a car wrong way up the road.

Orthodox jewish ladies wear wigs.

Doesn't matter which country in the world it is happening in or in the name of who's god it is being done.
The fact is that stoning is still happening in the world today. When stoning of women and men is no longer than maybe i will worry about whether a child should be allowed to wear a bit of fabric over their head in school.

My argument for children NOT wearing head gear is purely practical - and nothing to do with religion.

I think it's unhealthy, impractical and unnecessary. Even my own kids have come home saying how hot and bothered they look at PE.

What I have not seen in this thread is anyone focussing on what is best for the children and most comfortable.

Fanjob- I don't know why you keep telling her to ask a Muslim women about headscarves.
Firstly, many women don't wear with them and many disagree with them
secondly there are as many stupid Muslim women as there are women of any religion, so you can't just take the word of randoms As gospel can you?

Or, how about she asks my ex boss, a pakistani muslim? She often said that the women who covered their head/ face back home where the inbred Dirt poor uneducated village idiots who have no mind of their own- I'll just take her repsonse shall I? She's a Muslim after all.

Of course stoning is wrong.

However it is a very sterotypical views that Muslims spend all day long stoning each other.

Unless you have lived in a Muslim country you will be missing out on what else it has to offer. The stonings are of course the dark side, but not some form of daily entertainment that replaces Eastenders.

I am strongly opposed to segregation by parental religion in schools, but if it is to be done then the schools should at least play fair, and not discriminate by stealth against a group who might bring the league table rankings down or scare the white parents away.

*Fanjob- I don't know why you keep telling her to ask a Muslim women about headscarves.
Firstly, many women don't wear with them and many disagree with them
secondly there are as many stupid Muslim women as there are women of any religion, so you can't just take the word of randoms As gospel can you?

Or, how about she asks my ex boss, a pakistani muslim? She often said that the women who covered their head/ face back home where the inbred Dirt poor uneducated village idiots who have no mind of their own- I'll just take her repsonse shall I? She's a Muslim after all.*

Who should she ask, if not the culture that this debate is focussed on? Perhaps she should go to a mosque and enquire there then to get a fuller answer to her enquiries.

Actually I need to qualify that - I strongly disapprove of discrimination in state schools, I'm on the fence for private schools.

Headscarfs must be uncomfortable to some extent. I have Muslim friends, and in my experience they tend to take the scarf off when they get home and only put it on again when leaving the house.

Fanjo - stop shouting and stop resorting to silly - 'talk to a Muslim' tactics.