How many years is it going to take before 18 year olds realise that going to Uni is only worth it for about 20% of people

[Hammy02]

I went to an old poly and wish I hadn't as it didn't make much difference to my career prospects. DP went to a 'proper' Uni and earns about 60K so it was worth it for him. All I did was waste my time. Many students will now be racking up such huge debts that it will hugely impact their future. AIBU?

Depends. On paper my undergrad is worth f-all but then again 3 years of getting drunk,living alone and recreational drugs was awesome fun.
honestly though while what I studied won't directly put me above any other candidate/professional what it did do was tech me about critical analysis and how to structure arguments.
Also when I decided to pursue a professional qualification having a degree meant I could do so pretty quickly compared to my sister who's now thinking of becoming a solicitor and there are additional steps she has to take and jump through some hoops.

If people are going to base the 'worth' of a degree by the percentage it increases your future wage, you will always be disappointed and probably would be better off working straight off the bat.

But of course it still actually costs you money, because even if you don't pay your own loan back (and living costs and credit is the real killer anyway) you still pay the taxes from which the loans are disbursed.

Education could be so much better. I'm not against education and I think it should be more widely available than it is, just in a different way. I do think the current system is pretty shit for most people in society and of course my perspective is biased by the fact that school after the age of 11 was a waste of time for me personally.

From a practical or mechanistic perspective, I have probably a year, totted up, of secondary education and have no particular problem keeping up technically with the people I work with, who all have advanced degrees from RG/Ivy League places, because you know, for normal jobs if you don't know something you can just look it up. Most people have normal jobs, not highly advanced research chemistry or whatever.

5 altogether 3 years studying, then 2 hopefully years of trying to find a job, before realising it's a waste of time. Lol

Actually I do not think uni is a waste of time and should be part of compulsory eduction. It is an opportunity to specialise in the skills the young person has developed through out school, but better aimed at finding a job. It gives them a chance to leave home, mature before having full responsibility as an adult. And for most gives them a better chane of finding long term employment.

I have struggled financially for most of my life: I still don't think my PhD was wasted. It gave me enormous pleasure and taught me to think in a different way. I am sure I enjoy every day of my life more because of the enrichment it gave me.

But of course that is unlikely to be the case for somebody who just stumbles into a BA because it is the expected thing, does the bare minimum of work and then fails to get the financial recompense they thought they would.

For me being able to support myself is enough, but I didn't have that sense of sheer enjoyment, I'd probably want more money too, to make up for it.

The strange thing is, victor, that my mum actually runs a very successful library in my home town and she's not even qualified! She just worked her way up over the years, and says she's too old to study now. I was just lucky to get this particular apprenticeship, I absolutely love the job and they are pleased with me so far. I think the NVQ will be more useful in the short term while I need to bring money in.

I actually did the first half of my degree for free due to low income, and because of the break I'll have to pay for the rest (still quite cheap though, I think under £4k over 3-4years). It was hard to give up as I was doing really well but it was just too much with everything else going on :(

I do agree with Fabby about the relevance issue, there are too many 'Mickey Mouse' degrees and it is unfair to the students who may be given false hope. At college we were told that, for example, you shouldn't do a Forensic Science degree if you wanted to actually be a forensic scientist, and you shouldn't do a Media Studies degree if you wanted to work in media. Why do those degrees exist if they aren't actually useful?

I think perhaps uni should not be open at 18 except for those who know exactly what it is they want to do, and are achieving the results in school AND outside of school, by doing related activities towards that. Other than that I think you should have to be 21 - those 3 years between the end of school and being able to start uni should be used to get some decent life experience - work, travel, volunteer, whatever - to give you a chance to see if it's really what you want to do.

Worth every penny for the life experience etc. Unlikely to be worth it in career terms for the majority, but you can't measure these things by financial gain alone. I will be encouraging my DCs to go. I would prefer they do something like medicine or law but if they want to do klingon studies thats fine. I would rather they did something "useless" in career terms but got the experience of going and the life skills it gives.

Another poster commented on women not paying their loans back, and this is something that I have said to DH time and again - every time I have seen policiticians etc on the TV discussing this, I have never heard anyone raise the fact that this will affect male and female students differently. I am in my mid 30s now, all my friends are graduates and non of the women who have children work full time, and some don't work at all. Even friends who are doctors stepped back from their careers and went part time when they had children.

So, it depends on how you look at it because on the one hand it is shocking that girls will run up thousands of pounds of debt that they haven't a hope of paying back. On the flipside, you could just as easily say that it is discriminatory towards male students, as they are much more likely to have to pay back what they borrowed, whereas women could quite easily say 'well, I'll never have to pay it back, I might as well spend three years having a blast'.

I graduated in the 90s under the old scheme, whereby my student loan would not have to be repaid until I would earn something like £35k at todays salary levels. In the part of the country where I live, this is a crazily unachievable salary, even for a graduate. The fact that over the years the government have chosen to drop the salary at which people have to start 'paying back' speaks volumes about how much they really feel that a degree will benefit people financially.

I've done a bit of entry level recruiting for jobs that used to be school leavers, and are now graduate jobs - essentially if you want to find someone who will be acceptably literate and numerate, and may have the potential to advance then by far the easiest way to get them is by looking for someone who's got a 2:1 degree in business studies or geography or whatever from a former poly. The people we're looking for simply don't start work at 18 any more, so the vast majority of school leavers are not up to an office job.

Now that might change over the next few years, and the balance might switch back to hiring school leavers, because there's no particular reason why a degree is needed - it's just a way of filtering the applicants.

i think it is not worth going to a 2nd rate universtity or doing a non-vocational or non-traditional academic course

the 50% university educated govt target has always been the epitome of what is wrong with educational policy - badly thought through and pathetic

it's just a sad fact though that not having a degree can stop you earning bigger bucks

so any degree is essentially worth it, just as a passport to a more interesting career

Call centre work and admin are now considered 'careers'? :( perhaps just semantics, but imo they're just jobs.

look at jobs in london especially in the city even pa positions they want someone with a degree. having a degree opens up more doors, it gives you far more opportunities now more than ever

so you i think yabu the job market has changed considerably in teh last 10-15 years

and surely it is a good thing to have as many options open to you as possible

If the only value you place on a degree is how far it advances your career, then that's a very narrow view to have. University-level education should offer a whole lot more than that.

I agree with Victor here.

I also think the 20% number has been completely made up, and that even if your only measure of "worth it" is financial then university will be "worth it" for far more people.

the current system will only make university only accesible to those with money if university was for the brightest in society as it used to be more of taxpayers money could be spent on it therefore less extortiate debts on graduation and people would go to university on merit not on being able to afford it

nocake totally agree, my oh is a nurse they have changed the diploma to a degree what the he'll for I want a nurse of the ward not is a lecture hall

The best way to learn how to become a good nurse is to have as many hours on the ward as you can

The labour lot made uni the thing to do even if if didn't mean you were studying anything useful.

Ifancyashandy and studying for he sake of it is fine if you have the money but i feel poorer students have been badly let down by labour were they were encouraged to study any old thing and still don't have a job

Having a degree only serves you well in some professions not all

In my profession practical experience will always be taken over a academic one

Having a degree shows how hard you can work, shows that you are dedicated and are able to learn, it is not just about what degree, although I know of many who left the same time as my son who have no job.

My son worked in internships during the 2nd and 3rd years of his degree earning 700 a week.

If you want it it is there. He never worked that hard went to no lectures during the 2nd, 3rd and 4th years.

He cares not about the debt because he says it is negligible considering how much he will be earning because he got a degree.

My youngest starts Uni this year, I'd not have had it any other way, I insisted my children went to Uni, but then again always knew they would both take Maths with which you are guaranteed a job earning mega bucks.

Nx2boys don't agree I think it will help parents encourage their children to think more about the courses they are choosing some are sending their children off to uni to time waste because the very fact its cheap the amount of students who drop out of courses

And I think this is a area we really need to look at

My mil is well off my bil did a art degree and I can tell you know if they had to pay 9k even though they have the money he would have had to do law

2 years on he still has no job as the video art he dose is nit her commercial or practical and like many of our young today he would here of doing any. Other job than what he has hs degree in

My son s in high school and I know at 9k a pop he certainly won't be doing any Mickey mouse courses or course that don't clearly have a job demand at the end
Such as the csi course and it turned out their were only 10 jobs available for this job in the whole of the uk

Our maths degree doesnt include internships

Degrees don't usually include internships. I did a maths degree, and decided myself to apply for (and got) an internship in banking for the summer break between 2nd and 3rd year - isn't that what most people do? Some degrees allow you to do a year-long industrial placement, which can be very useful as well. If not then summer internships are the way to go.

It's a very good idea anyway, as the experience counts for a lot when applying for graduate jobs (on top of excellent academic grades of course). And if you make a good impression during your internship you may well be offered a job at the end, for when you graduate. This is in fact the reason why the big firms take on so many interns, and compete for the best by paying them well, it's a very good recruitment strategy for them.

I think these days for a lot of professional jobs you need a good degree and some relevant work experience, it's not a case of either-or.

Uni education isn't meantto be 'useful' or 'worth' it financially - It's meant to be education and life experience, valuable in itself.

aliceliddell well then in that case they should pay for it them selves

Sorry but I barley have enough money as it is with out paying for people to be enriched

foreverwino, you sound such a good friend. No.

Seriously, do you think that the benefit of going to university is to 'spend time with diverse people from across uk/abroad' ? Where do you live? My 5 yo is in a very mixed school class and have 'diverse friends', nothing amazing. Do you want them to spend 50k so that they flat share with an Italian or Japanesse student? They could buy a whole house in Italy for that money or travel the world.

Personally i travelled before uni and learnt to budget long before, i thought many people did the same. It is not the case of either you go to university or work in a factory in a village for the rest of your life. BUT doing a good degree can mean that you can earn a good salary for life. Thats the main benefit imo.

(I had an ex who was going throu 10 philosophy/poetry books a week. Thats because he was doing night shifts as security in a very quite block, before the days of internet and i-phones so he had nothing else to do )