AIBU to think that a mum of two should not be jailed for

[Mitmoo]

taking a pair of shorts that her friend stole in the riots.

She's got six months.

A young man who took £3.50 worth of water from a ransacked shop got six months.

I want justice, I want those who terrified my family even though we were fortunate enough to only view it through the television screen to be punished but I want some kind of proportionality.

Do we remove mum's from their children for six months because she took a pair of shorts from a friend who had been in the riots?

It was wrong of course, she should have shopped the "friend" but six months????

menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1455638_mum-jailed-for-six-months-for-wearing-pair-of-looted-shorts-

Me too shelley. I was in tears watching the news and watching utter shit excuses for human beings cause so much heartache and fear.

I think the Sikh chaps had the right idea - interesting how the police have turned a blind eye to them brandishing swords in public! Think there would be an outcry though if they were arrested over that.

Self-inflicted injury. Get over it.

That's completely fucking ridiculous! Plenty of rapists/abusive men/violent criminals get similar sentences- her only crime is being a bit thick, as far as I can see. Shows you what Cameron et al think is more important, though, I suppose.

don't be surprised. Women are given very harsh punishments if they step out of line. THis is rule number one of any patriarchy (for that is what we are living in)
Rapists are given about six months, if they get convicted at all, and as I mentioned earlier on another thread, two women a week are murdered by their spouse, who gets an average of 4 years in jail, less if he pretends she died during a "sex game" (i.e that he shot or strangled her "accidentally" and she wanted it, much like women want rape). I have seen a case of a man who raped a 4 year old get a very leniant sentence.

BUt women get 16 years for retaliating against and killing a man who has been battering them.

Ah, it's all fun and games under the big P, the patriarchy.

Actually Wibbly I thought the crime was receiving stolen goods and being an accessory - I don't think "being a bit thick" is, in fact, a crime.
Oh and she should have reported her pal.
And, rapists etc. should get longer sentences anyway - which is nothing to do with this case in question.

hahaha me disingenuous?

I am lots of things but I am certainly not that

Course it will have an impact. This is a perfect oppourtunity to introduce new laws to prevent protest and to get them passed on a wave of public fear and disgust.

People are scared. What happened in this city was terrifying. Dont tell me the government wont make use of that.

Now that would be disingenuous

WibblyBibble:

Rapists don't get six months. The words violence and abuse cover such a multitude of sins that comparison is impossible - and incidentally there are abusive women too.

Cameron et al don't set sentences: judges and magistrates do that and they are independent of government.

The fact that an offender is one of a crowd assuming that there is safety in numbers makes the offence much more serious.

Where the hell is this urban legend about six months for rape coming from?

I was on the receiving end of the damage, though far far luckier than many. It?s absolutely nothing in comparison to those around me, but it's another layer of crap and further downgraded for all to judge as scummier than I already am judged for it.

We defended ourselves succesfully here, but only because our doors been put through before so we know how to.

I feel sorry for this stupid woman, and the £3.50 water bloke, but do you suppose they feel anything for me but contempt when they see us scraping by?

^BUT I want justice. Not some showboating, career building version of justice that the government thinks will shut us up.

I want proper punishments that fit the crime. I want each case to be looked at properly and each person treated according to their crime.

To do otherwise is just pushing those who do feel totally disconnected from mainstream society further away.^

Spot on Mrs Devere.

*Also, injustice will make people angrier.

Prison riots next...*

Ah, so instead, we should appease the criminals in the hope that they'll be good citizens in future?

What was it Churchill said: ?An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile - hoping it will eat him last?

Just to be clear.

I live in the arse end of East London.
I have mixed race boys who are surrounded by gang culture.
I spent a whole week stuck away from home frantic and texting my teenager to tell him to stay inside and not go anywhere.
I didnt think he would get involved but I thought he might go and have a look at what was going on.

I have no pity for the looters. I do not think there is any justification for what they did.

In answer to the 'ivory tower' comments. YES we DO have to live with the consqences. We have to live with the consequences of the wrong sentences if they are too soft AND if they are OTT.

Andrewfogg most rapes aren't even reported. That's justice for you.

male justice, that is

in a system that supports males

including their right to rape

how else can you explain the fact that most rapes go unreported? and therefore unpunished?

Birdsgottafly I don't believe for one second the 3 men dressed all in black with there hoods pulled up round their faces leaving my flats, less than a 10 min drive away from Clapham Junction on Monday night, at 11:30pm, as we where watching Clapham Junction burn, where joking when they where shouting "Yeh, ha ha, we're going to a riot".

If rapes go unreported they cannot be sentenced . . .

But if they are reported and tried - and proved beyond reasonable doubt - the starting sentence is eight years - which may or may not be enough but it is not six months.

When did you last hear anyone, sakura - male or female - allege that there exists a right to rape?

sakura - you sound like those conspiracy theorists. Do you believe 9-11 was an inside job?

Disproportionate. How long did the MPs get for ripping off public funds?

Not surprising though.

Fair enough thefirstMrsDeVere. But I would put my right arm that the majority of those pleading for understanding and lenient sentences live in nice areas and, as such, dont witness first hand the consequences of anti-social behaviour.

Scaredy- i thought you meant general humour, i do not like some jokes (about death etc) but sometimes it is used to lighten, but not in your case.

I think that people are forgetting the premeditated aspect of the riots and looting.

Sakura- i agree i (and previous/present generations of my family/friends) have suffered enough under cultural and institutional patriarchy. It doesn't mean that i am happy to suffer personally because someone of my own gender is a criminal, it doesn't balance out, it just makes my life harder.

wubbly, ours got 9 months.

Good, scurry. Most of them got off with a mumbled apology.

You may be right didyousee.

I dont want lenient sentences though. I want the right ones.

Because I really think that is is vital that justice is done .

The excuse for the looting was the death of a man. There was an assumption that justice would not be done with regards to his death. It was almost a given. This didnt happen because everyone who lives on an estate, is on benefits, is poor, is black or wears a tracksuit is paranoid.

It is because the sort of idiots that took to the streets utterly believe that the justice system is not for them, that the police lie and cover up and that they will not be treated fairly.

It doesnt matter that those people are dirty little fuckers. What matters is that the police have behaved appallingly regarding police related deaths and that even those of us with no axe to grind do not expect them to be open and entirely truthful.

And that those of us who are law abiding have to live amoungst these people who will be further disefranchised and will feel that they have the right to complain about the treatment they will get.

WHY give them the excuse? If it is all done right, all done according to the law and in proportion to their crimes they can whinge all they bloody want. If there are loopholes and mistakes they will only go on to feel more justified. I dont want to live with the consquences of that!

Most sentences doled out to women are for shoplifting not drug related offences as stated by another poster.
As sending someone to prison for drug addiction clearly doesn't work why are we continuing to do so citing a lack of treatment in the area? Surely spend more of treatment rather than imprisonment.

If the crime is stand alone and not based upon gender then it makes no sense that the proportion of first time offenders imprisoned for non violent crime is so much greater for women than men. Or that it is increasing at such a rate.

I believe women are treated more harshly by the courts as they are mainly being judged by men.

If the sentences provided do nothing or little to prevent reoffending I wonder why we use them? Surely a community based sentence would be more appropriate?

I'm not apologising for rioters. I am asking that we treat people fairly. I believe women are treated proportionally more harshly in the current system and that these sentences do little good and cost money for no gain. I also think that sentencing in these nonsense circumstances must included asking for consideration of dependant family in that process.

your all deluuded if any of you believed in the british justice system, but its the only one we have and it IS better than most other countries... you cant compare rape to riots or politicians ripping us off to murder they are all different and all wrong and all individual.
you cant compare hwta someone stole from bhs and got to what someone got for looting a few days ago, the government already informed the public these would be harsh sentences, some people did die during the riots many lost homes and their small businesses. a woman on tv the other day sat on the pavement with her toddler alone scared after losing all her worldly goods with no one to turn to , and many families with only one tiny shop lost their livelyhood which was bad enough with the likes of tesco looming over them already struggling. and yes there are side effects and consequences of mums banged up for 6 months for what some people seem to think is trivial
we know its an amalgamation of things that brought us to where we are now in a broken society blaming people wont help its like after the blitz we have to work on what to do next and how to help repair britain not pass the buck everyone is to blame everyone.