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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

My 5 year old niece was told to go home and pray

490 replies

freyjasauntie · 21/07/2011 10:56

I am really upset that my 5 year old niece was told by her school teacher to go home and pray at bedtime. Although she goes to a C of E school, this is due to logistics of living in the country, and the school are aware that she is being raised atheist, (she was enrolled as such) with a view to letting her decide her own path when she is ready to understand what that entails.

If a Muslim teacher had told her girls to go home and wear hijab, there would be uproar, but it seems to be accepted that schools can promote Christian ideology. I have no problems with my niece being taught about Jesus, about being kind to each other, about truth telling and other so called Christian Values (which can be found in almost any religion) but I strongly object to her being told to give up something for Lent (she had no idea why she should do so), and to pray at bedtime.

Religious Education should be EDUCATION, as a qualified RE teacher, I have always presented all world religious as equally valuable, but there is a real difference between education and what I believe is insidious indoctrination.

OP posts:
AmandaB22 · 21/07/2011 13:03

C of E School - it's kinda in the titlel really!

Clockface · 21/07/2011 13:04

It strike me that one of the issues here is what education is, and what it's for.

Freyja'sauntie, You might think that that schools are for giving dc lots of opinions and experiences so that the can make their own minds up aabout issues. A lot of faith schools would say that a big part of what school is for is to form the dcs' characters in the context of Christian community. So, going on the first definition, YANBU, but going on the second, YABU. If you have a fundamentally, irreconciably diferent definitiopn of education to your dn's school, you're going to butt up aginst this time and again.

Feminine · 21/07/2011 13:09

The school wouldn't think it odd to suggest she prayed, that is what Christian parents would want their child to do.

Its a C of E school.

Teachers in that type of school would feel quite free in suggesting it.

I also wouldn't worry about it .

CurrySpice · 21/07/2011 13:13

valium let's just say they know my feelings on the matter Wink

soverylucky · 21/07/2011 13:15

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

GwendolineMaryLacey · 21/07/2011 13:23

I'm at a bit of a loss to see why it's any of your business other than a passing interest? I'm extremely close to my nieces, they live across the road from me, my DD will be going to the same school as them next year. I am highly interested in everything that they do. But that's where it ends. What their parents choose to do about their education is none of my business. At least one of her parents thinks there is no harm in it so why are you getting your knickers in a knot.

And I fail to see why your qualifications are relevant. Did you get a 10m swimming certificate too?

What bothers me most about this is, like most people with a problem with religion, you hide behind the 'letting them make their own mind' excuse. And yet at the same time do everything in your power to make sure they follow your footsteps like little sheep. If your niece said actually, she wanted to pray, what would you do?

soverylucky · 21/07/2011 13:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Cocoflower · 21/07/2011 13:27

Good point Gwendoline

Would it upset you if your neice decided to become religious or spiritual when older? Would this be bad?

Would you tell her it was all lies?

MrSpoc · 21/07/2011 13:29

Op a really do doubt that you are a real teacher. Yes you may teach some night school to people but certainly not in a main stream school.

Faith to people is FACT. Because you are an aitheist you are blinkered.

Are you saying as FACT that there is no god!!! How do you know for FACT that there aint. Answer is you dont.

MammKernow · 21/07/2011 13:31

Why on earth did you think that was a good post from Gwendoline? Looking at it:

  • you have no idea about the family situation (I do) - don't compare it to yours.
  • Someone else started banging on about quals, op was simply reponding.
  • 'letting them make their own minds' - not an excuse, instead surely its what any parent who truly cares about their child's individual development would try and follow.
  • 'little sheep'?!?!?!? From someone defending a faith school?! Ha ha ha ha haaaaaaaaaaa!
  • and do you therefore think that 'no religion' is somehow less valid than having a religion?
MammKernow · 21/07/2011 13:32

and FFS, use a dictionary and look up what 'FACT' is cos as far as i know, no-one has proven the existence of God as yet...

MrSpoc · 21/07/2011 13:33

And no-one has proven the lack of God YET. FACT. there are more people in the world who belive in god than people who dont.

exoticfruits · 21/07/2011 13:34

A good point Gwendoline.
I never understand why DCs should follow the rest of the family-they do have minds of their own.

At one point my parents considered sending me to a Catholic secondary school, as it was they decided they couldn't afford it, but if they had I would have been withdrawn from Catholic religious teaching-that was what all non catholics did at the time. They didn't expect the school to change!!

exoticfruits · 21/07/2011 13:38

It was a good post because the education of her neice is nothing to do with her!

Blu · 21/07/2011 13:38

In proinciple, this is the problem with an education system where in many areas, especially more rural or isloated places, the ONLY schools available are faith schools, typically CoE.

In cities there is a choice, Faith schools are often over-subscribed and are a pro-active choice by faith-based families.

In the country CoE schools are often the default community school. Personally I think they should be mindful of this, mindful of their budget coming from the LA, and not be telling children to go home and pray.

GwendolineMaryLacey · 21/07/2011 13:40

Nice try MK. Hmm

  • Yes DD will go to a faith school. But if she comes home to me and says "you know what, I'm not sure I believe in all this" then I'm not going to frog march her to the priest for exorcism. I will bring her up in my way but am totally open to her deciding for herself. That's not the impression given by the many many threads of this ilk who freak out at the thought of their children, or other people's saying words which, if they don't believe, are totally meaningless.

  • WTF has it got to do with anything that we don't know the family situation and you do? For fucks sake, what a thick, fuckwitted statement. It's a discussion on an open forum where we are all making comment on the limited information that any OP gives us. I suggest you consult the Dummies' Guide to Forums and learn how to use them.

  • No religion is fine and dandy. Shame people are so threatened by 'crap-peddaling' and 'mumbo jumbo' that they can't offer the same courtesy.

  • I don't think anyone has proven that he absolutely doesn't exist yet, have they??

Cocoflower · 21/07/2011 13:41

Mindful? Why mindful?

soverylucky · 21/07/2011 13:46

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

GwendolineMaryLacey · 21/07/2011 13:46

I get it now MK, she's your daughter.

thedogwalker · 21/07/2011 13:48

YABU, so you TELLING her not to pray or do what the school says is different Hmm. How come your instructions are educational and the school's isn't.

It is a faith school, the parents chose it, so butt out.

Sirzy · 21/07/2011 13:49

Everyone has there own beliefs and of course will believe that to be fact (of FACT if you prefer!). The parents knew the beliefs of the school when they made the decision to send her there and as such have to expect she will be educated in that faith.

If often seems on these threads that those with no religious beliefs find it much harder to respect the beliefs than those of a faith do to respect the views of others on these matters.

Blu · 21/07/2011 13:50

'Mindful' because they should be aware that they are the ONLY school in the area, and are being finded by the LA as the default school.

Why should families on rural areas have no choice but to attend a faith school?

Though I think this is something that Gvt should address - of course the school will do their thing. But I fond it extraordonary that in a rural county a huge proportion of the education budget goes to faith schools with no other chpice. it is a legacy of a history in which the church were the founders of schools - that's great great, and they still own the land and buildings. But it doesn't necessarily suit changing needs. I think it is iniquitous that that taxpaying parents cannnot choose a secular state school and since the faith schools are funded to serve the whole community on behalf of the LA they should not be telling pupils from non-religious families to pray.

MrSpoc · 21/07/2011 13:51

So MK & Op are in cahoots to rail road childs dad into thinking he is wrong. How sad.

squeakytoy · 21/07/2011 13:53

It surprises me though to be told it is not my business. She is my niece and I am involved in all aspects of her life, including her school and her education

Too bloody involved by the sounds of it. She isnt your child. Keep your beak out of it.

MrSpoc · 21/07/2011 13:53

They do have a choice Blu. If they are not happy they could home school.

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