Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

My 5 year old niece was told to go home and pray

490 replies

freyjasauntie · 21/07/2011 10:56

I am really upset that my 5 year old niece was told by her school teacher to go home and pray at bedtime. Although she goes to a C of E school, this is due to logistics of living in the country, and the school are aware that she is being raised atheist, (she was enrolled as such) with a view to letting her decide her own path when she is ready to understand what that entails.

If a Muslim teacher had told her girls to go home and wear hijab, there would be uproar, but it seems to be accepted that schools can promote Christian ideology. I have no problems with my niece being taught about Jesus, about being kind to each other, about truth telling and other so called Christian Values (which can be found in almost any religion) but I strongly object to her being told to give up something for Lent (she had no idea why she should do so), and to pray at bedtime.

Religious Education should be EDUCATION, as a qualified RE teacher, I have always presented all world religious as equally valuable, but there is a real difference between education and what I believe is insidious indoctrination.

OP posts:
seeker · 21/07/2011 11:58

So if the only reason this child was ion the school was because it was the only school with a place, rather than because the parents actively chose it, would it STILL be OK for the teacher to tell the child to say her prayers at bed time?

exoticfruits · 21/07/2011 12:03

It isn't the faith school's fault they are the only school.

Al0uiseG · 21/07/2011 12:06

Faith School or not, it still receives LA funding and is highly likely to be the only catchment school for that area.

Yanbu.

nojustificationneeded · 21/07/2011 12:07

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

exoticfruits · 21/07/2011 12:10

You can withdraw your DC from the religious side.

SpringchickenGoldBrass · 21/07/2011 12:12

It is actually a problem for a lot of people that there isn't a choice of schools - that the only one it's remotely feasible to send a child to is a crap-peddling faith school. The only thing you can really do in this situation is counter it at home, tell the kid she doesn't have to say prayers if she doesn't want to, that you don't and that it's no big deal. As she gets older, you can undermine the superstition more thoroughly, of course.
Because religion is at bottom harmful bullshit and at least worst a silly waste of time, and it's as well to educate DC gently towards respecting other's right to believe bullshit and not teasing them over it, but not respecting the bullshit.

GiddyPickle · 21/07/2011 12:12

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

cjel · 21/07/2011 12:14

I also think you are being unreasonable. If she is to be taught about relegion and christianity especially at this school then going home and praying is a big part of understanding. Are you afraid they are right and your n may get something positive from being a christian that you don't want her to have? Are you so dogmatic that you think you beliefs are the only right ones! Who made you judge and jury on what is right in the world of faith? Just because you don't share the truths of christianity doesn't mean everyone else has to follow you.

CurrySpice · 21/07/2011 12:14

Consider yourselves lucky

My DD1 had to pray to have the wisdom of Mrs Thatcher at her assembly Angry

sue52 · 21/07/2011 12:15

YABU. We are atheist and our DDs went to a CofE primary. We just told them people are able to choose what they do or don't believe and they were quite happy with that.

sue52 · 21/07/2011 12:16

CurrySpice that would have made my blood run cold!

exoticfruits · 21/07/2011 12:17

If it is the only school in your area there are safeguards, as parents you can withdraw your DC from both collective worship and RE lessons. I don't think that it is up to the faith school to change something they are upfront about providing. As a parent, who isn't happy, it is up to you to opt out.

ScarletOHaHa · 21/07/2011 12:17

YABU x2 You agree to comply with school rules code of behaviour.

  1. It is a faith school and as such suggesting a bedtime prayer is appropriate
  2. she is not your child.

Dogsbestfriend 'I were her mother I would be putting them straight on that in such a way that they wouldn't make the mistake again'. Shock

CurrySpice · 21/07/2011 12:18

You can only begin to imagine my feelings sue Angry

It was an assembly about role models and the stupid HT who is so young he probably wan't even born when she was in power chose Thatcher Angry

My DD1 put her hand up (aged 9) and put him straight :o

Sirzy · 21/07/2011 12:19

I agree with the majority. I really don't understand why a c of e school encouraging prayer comes as a shock to you really!

MrSpoc · 21/07/2011 12:21

freyjasauntie - You more than anyone should understand that faith Schools DO see this as FACT and not just FAITH. Are you really a teacher????>?

Original poster
freyjasauntie · 21/07/2011 12:26

seeing something as fact does not make it so. would you like a list of my qualifications and universities attended, schools, colleges and universities taught at?

OP posts:
msshapelybottom · 21/07/2011 12:27

You mention that your neice is being raised as an athiest. To me, she is already being taught her parents beliefs,

However, as she is going to a faith school you could use any religious teachings that your niece talks about as an opportunity to get her thinking about sprituality and faith in a broad sense. See what prayer means to her.

My kids used to go to a faith school and it involved a lot of indoctrination which I wasn't entirely comfortable with. However, I decided to try and use it as a chance to discuss faith in a roundabout way and try to encourage them to decide for themselves what they believed.

I'm happier now that they are going to a multi-denominational school now mind you!

RockinSockBunnies · 21/07/2011 12:27

YABU. Also, why are you so concerned if your niece is praying? Prayer normally offers a means of comfort and security. Is it really such a big deal if your niece is praying something simple along the lines of 'thank you for my family and please let me be a good person?!'

It's a faith school. Prayer is an intrinsic part of Christianity. A lot of children go to faith schools and become atheists in later life. And vice versa.

Relax.

Original poster
freyjasauntie · 21/07/2011 12:32

msshapelybottom, fantastic! this is exactly how we are using it, as an opportunity to encourage thought about differing points of view. We don't bitch about it in front of her, but it still niggles me!

OP posts:
Original poster
freyjasauntie · 21/07/2011 12:34

thank who for her family? "LET me be a good person"?! i feel she would be better off telling her family she loves them directly, and being a good person is a CHOICE she makes, not something someone lets her do.

OP posts:
tabulahrasa · 21/07/2011 12:35

As far as faith goes, believing in it does make it fact.

How can you be an RE teacher and not understand that? There is no ultimate truth when it comes to religions, if you believe it, it's true, if you don't, it's not.

Sirzy · 21/07/2011 12:39

I would actually be worried about children being taught re by someone who is seemingly so unable to appreciate others beliefs and understand how faith schools will always be centrered around a specific religion.

This of course doesn't mean other religions aren't taught about! Far from it in a lot of cases!

AbsDuCroissant · 21/07/2011 12:44

Was the instruction from the teacher for your niece only, as in the teacher went "Blah - go home and pray", or was it directed in general to the whole class?

If it was the first - YANBU, particularly if the school knows the situation (only available place, parents atheists) and maybe it should be raised with the school. If it's the second - then YABU and maybe your niece's parents should discuss stuff with her at home, what their views are.

But it is a very confusing situation for a five year old to be in.

valiumredhead · 21/07/2011 12:59

My DD1 had to pray to have the wisdom of Mrs Thatcher at her assembly

Now THAT would have me up the school so fast you wouldn't see my feet touch the ground!