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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

I did a bit of philosphy when young. Free will or fatalist? fire away

25 replies

yellabelly · 08/07/2011 16:49

My late elder brother was a confirmed fatalist. Everything is preordained. Free will was for "woolly thinkers."

I am not that convinced; but I can see what he was getting at. Can you?

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 08/07/2011 16:53

Gabbyloggon... you're no better under the new name than you were last time.

ObiWan · 08/07/2011 17:02

Ha haa! I thought that too but I don't know how the name-change thing works so thought I might be imagining it Grin

CogitoErgoSometimes · 08/07/2011 17:05

The clues are all there. The AIBU thread that isn't actually asking if he's being unreasonable. The clipped, slightly odd sentence construction. A confession on another thread that he does some creative writing and makes up 'jokes'. It's definitely Grubbymoron back after his temporary exclusion.

claig · 08/07/2011 17:07

was he banned?

CogitoErgoSometimes · 08/07/2011 17:08

Admonished. Disappeared for a while. Good as...

claig · 08/07/2011 17:09

although this is a pretty deep question, nothing to do with Radio 5 Live presenters, so yellabelly may not be Gabby.

TheFlyingOnion · 08/07/2011 17:09

BUT WHAT ABOUT the RANdom capiTALS??

whereto have they GONE???

claig · 08/07/2011 17:10

What happened? I missed all that or is it not possible to say.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 08/07/2011 17:11

They'll be BACK when the MEDication wears OFF...

Original poster
yellabelly · 09/07/2011 10:24

To add to the rather deep discusion. Most relegions are for Free Wiil Most scientientists probably support determinism

I would argue that is is difficult to get proof either way. My brother implied people who opt for free will are sheep;incapable of thinking for themselves.

I can see the logic in his argument; but not the proof.

OP posts:
Original poster
yellabelly · 09/07/2011 10:25

To add to the rather deep discusion. Most relegions are for Free Wiil Most scientientists probably support determinism

I would argue that is is difficult to get proof either way. My brother implied people who opt for free will are sheep;incapable of thinking for themselves.

I can see the logic in his argument; but not the proof. Einstein said "God does not roll dice." hmmmmm Maybe not

OP posts:
faeriefruitcake · 09/07/2011 10:37

Free will implies thought, therefore they are not sheep. Fatalism is more the sheep approach as you just passivly accept what is happening.

Your argument is basically as flawed as my spelling.

Cogito ergo sum - thinking is action not passive, sheep like behaviour is one without though.

Original poster
yellabelly · 09/07/2011 11:11

You erither believe in free will or determinism...a sort of fatalism

Putteth your cards on ze table, squire.

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 09/07/2011 11:45

The trouble is that to have a conversation about philosophy, you have to have participants that are rational and intelligent. And since you are clearly neither, it's not going to get very far is it Grubby? 'Squire'.. Hmm

Original poster
yellabelly · 09/07/2011 11:51

we are not getting many serious thoughts here. Is it because the so called working class are NOT philosophical. (They leave it too the middle classes) and that is why the MCs always run the show? I despair a little over the lack of imagination shown. A bit stuck in a rut.

OP posts:
NevermindtheNargles · 09/07/2011 11:56

?

CogitoErgoSometimes · 09/07/2011 11:57

You're not getting many serious thoughts (as usual) Grubbyloggon because people don't know what you're going on about. Don't despair... just maybe try to start a conversation in AIBU that, rather than being a one-sided, verbal diarrhoea, ego-trip effort, could loosely hang on the initial question 'am I being unreasonable' and take it from there? (The clue is in the title)

NevermindtheNargles · 09/07/2011 12:00

I actually find the 'free will vs determinism' debate quite interesting, in a 3am kind of way, but the OP doesn't seem to know which is which and this all looks a bit weird to me, so I'm not playing.

Continuum · 09/07/2011 12:06

Oh fuck, I thought mumsnet was middle class!! And here's me trying to better myself and everything by being here!!

CogitoErgoSometimes · 09/07/2011 12:09

It's OK Continuum... Yellabelly aka Gabbyloggon is less 'middle class' and more 'middle earth'. Wink

Original poster
yellabelly · 09/07/2011 13:20

I still think you are content to leve it all to middle class clever devils. My hubby would be ashamed

OP posts:
Original poster
yellabelly · 09/07/2011 13:21

no argument can be flawed by spelling. Spell as you wish on mumsnet it aint an exam

OP posts:
yoshiLunk · 09/07/2011 13:36

I thought this must be Gabby when I saw the title too.

Hello Gabby (if it is you) - are you feeling a little bit more cheery? You were being uncharacteristically rude last time I saw you here, hope you are back to your old self Wink

ObiWan · 09/07/2011 13:38

Your Hubby?! I thought you had a wife?

faeriefruitcake · 10/07/2011 23:12

I don't think class has anything to do with philosophy in it's purist sense. Fair enough in the past in was really only accessable to men who came from priviliged background and who had time to do all their precious thinking.

Mind you being a philosopher isn't really a job that many people want.

Humans are capable of cognitive dissonance so can be both fatalistic and believe in free will.

Certainly my argument wasn't flawed by the spelling, it's the spelling itself that is flawed.

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