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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Bloody W**NKing Tax credits! Or Government should I say

513 replies

Hai1988 · 06/07/2011 16:59

Just had my new tax credits award and have just found out that my DH's Working tax credits are being stopped as he has already had his lot for this year, £800!!!

My DH does not have a very well payed job at all and after rent and bills we have f**K all left and the weekly income of £140 really helped that is now just over £50.

So angry We need that extra £80 a week, I know it may not sound much to some but it did make a big difference to out life's.

Who ever voted Tory I hope your happy with yourselves that now so many family's are probably gonna struggle now.

Sorry not really an aibu but really needed to vent and wondered if anyone else is suffering with tax credits this year because of the dam government.

OP posts:
soverylucky · 06/07/2011 19:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

JoySzasz · 06/07/2011 19:16

itsybitsy I agree with you and well done to your DH.

We are in a similar boat ,it is stressful.

CherylWillBounceBack · 06/07/2011 19:19

Glitterknicknaz - we are thinking the same way. I've just gone one step further and decided that there is NOTHING you can rely on in life aside from your own ability to take care of yourself and your family.

You will be screwed whichever way you turn unless you're part of the rigged, corrupt elite, so for me, you have to make damn sure you can afford to live without any help.

JoySzasz · 06/07/2011 19:19

Sorry, just realized you said DP

CherylWillBounceBack · 06/07/2011 19:26

Oh and anyone who thinks thihs country isn't skint....we are. The entire western world is completely in debt and expects future generations to pay for it. And the eastern world is not too far behind either as a lot of those countries are going to have the International Mafia Fund calling in on them soon to plunge them into the shit.

Yet another reason to consider whether you want to bring a child into this f**ked up world. They are not going to have an easy life. For me, this means adoption is the only route to go down - when I can afford it.

PrettyMeerkat · 06/07/2011 19:29

itsybitsy08 Your poor DH!

fgaaagh · 06/07/2011 19:35

Well whilst I have every sympathy with the OP, her money (if she's accurate) works out to just shy of £9k a year in credits, if you consider that to earn it at (basic) tax rate to bring into the household, that is.

When we have families who are reliant on nine grand a year from the government to meet their basic bills (I'm going to assume the OP is genuine in that she's saying her household income isn't huge, although of course she's bias), well, is it any wonder the country is totally fucked?

fgaaagh · 06/07/2011 19:41

Fuck it, I'm going to re-post something I added to a thread las week here, since it's relevant:

----------

marycorporate said If you have 1, or possibly 2, children in childcare and work 16 hours a week in a low paid job, you will actually take home the equivilent of a 24k salary.

Georgimama When I was earning 17K per year out of interest I looked into what I would be entitled to by way of benefits if I were a single parent on that income (on the entitledto website). I would have got a smidge off a thousand pounds a month in WTC, CTC, CB and HB. My net income would have been pretty what it is now, on 32K gross.

And that's pretty much why the country is fucked - the government has subsidised private company wage bills to an unsustainable level for years. Employers aren't paying a living wage across the board, with the exception of the nice little top of the pyramid - tough luck if you're at the bottom or middle of the pile though - hence why the real income gap between those at the top and those at the bottom is getting wider and wider.

What kind of country can function in the long term where the majority of its able bodied working population need such huge percentages of income top ups to pay their basic living costs (food, council tax, accommodation). It's madness to think we could sustain this (although good for votes in the long term... vote for us or we're going to take away XYZ credit).

My sister has a husband who has been working a 6 day week for the last 2 years to top up the household income - he's working in a manual (unskilled) job for just slightly above minimum wage. She also has been working 3 or 4 days a week for most of the last year, doing admin on NMW for her old employer. However, with the recent rises in petrol and other household costs, it's wiped out any profit in it at all, she's looked into the extra stuff they'd be entitled to if she worked only 16 hours a week (saving in childcare, plus extra top ups) or not at all, she has concluded that there's really no point having this stressed-out constantly-manic situation at home with BIL working so much, and where the kids are getting packed off to childcare whilst she's not even making any money or extra benefit from working close to full time until they're at school, esp. since the job doesn't have any longterm prospects or promotions/ability to top up income (it's a tiny firm - a family owned chain of 4 hardware shops).

And you know what? Despite being in a duel-working household myself, I can 100% understand why she's decided that it would be better for their kids if she stayed at home and stopped work, or cut down her hours. The government will step in to fill the income gap, and stuff like free glasses, prescriptions, etc will help if she can get her hands on them; I'm not sure exactly how much BIL earns but I know he was on £6.20/hr ish last year.

But it's a broken, unsustainable situation to support longterm, across many households, if you're the government.

The real issue is that for many women (and men), if you're in a lowly paid job, either NMW or a few grand above it each year, there is nothing extra in material gain to be working fulltime or working hard. There's self esteem, and perhaps long term career prospects in some jobs, but not all - repetative, boring lowly paid jobs consist of the bulk of NMW jobs. But the costs of working (childcare, commuting, work clothes) often wipe out any extra financial gain in those situations.

Until you're earning a semi-professional salary and can start to see a difference between "what I've earned in a job" and "what I can earn in top ups and associated benefits" there's little incentive to work more hours/harder in the short/medium term.

In summary, I'm not arguing for a reduction in benefits - rather, I'm arguing for a reduction in tax credits, and for private industry to start paying their employees a living wage, without needing government intervention to top up their false salary bills. Unfortunately, this country has become so reliant on the low wages that the true cost of some goods is totally alient to your average shopper.

thursday · 06/07/2011 19:42

oh god, low paid is low skilled and low stress? sadly, not really. my husband would love to change career to something with better pay but with a 60 hour week in a stressful job already and not a penny spare we've no idea how he's supposed to go about doing that. he's skilled and has 20 years experience but still drags in a pittance these days. i'm looking for a job that will pay enough to cover the childcare, not that many around unfortunately, though will be easier now my sons about to start school.

COCKadoodledooo · 06/07/2011 19:42

CherylWillBounceBack

Tax credits, child benefit, housing benefit etc....if you cannot afford to have kids without state benefits, then you shouldn't be having them.

Oh do fuck off, there's a dear. Our first child was unplanned, but we were both working and in stable careers. Our second child was planned. The redundancy we found out about when I was 12 weeks pregnant was not.

Dh's salary is now half of what it was as he's retrained to become a teacher (though obviously doing it wrong, because he's not on the squillions most people assume he is Hmm). I am not working because no fucker will give me a job.

So there. We could afford our children when we had them, we now can't without tax credits. Should I put them up for adoption then?

OP - dunno yet, we're still waiting to hear.

usualsuspect · 06/07/2011 19:49

Thats harsh OP ,its very difficult to manage on low wages ,I know

I'm sure the higher paid on here don't use the services of the MW workers though Wink

Lilyloo · 06/07/2011 19:50

OP my sympathy too , our award was also 0 this year and i think there will be many in the same boat.

Oh i love the comments 'if you couldn't afford the kids without state help blah blah'

Must be easy to look down on others who have circumstances that happen out of their control.
We had a good standard of living when the kids were born , then my mum died (no free childcare) my dp's buisness went tits up (in mortgages) , means i cannot afford to do my teacher training and utilise my degree so have taken a low paid nursery wage which happens to have taken us to the TC limit with dp's wage. So what i earnt last year we loose in TC great eh

itsybitsy08 · 06/07/2011 19:51

Thankyou joy and the same to you and your family.

yes it is stressful indeed and I wish you all the best for your future.

i am bowing out now as these threads keep going and going and always the same way! :)

oh and thanks pretty too

niceguy2 · 06/07/2011 19:55

It's not just about benefit bashing. It's about reducing expenditure across the board. Practically everything is getting cut and yes, TC's have had to have a trim too. And about bloody time. It meant well but poorly designed and completely unfunded. Noone understands how to calculate what they are due. It's allowed employers to employ legions of part time staff knowing they will have their wages topped up. It's allowed many employees to work part time (which isn't always a bad thing if the govt money wasn't borrowed.). And frankly why people earning £40k+ needed a benefit was beyond me.

Glitterknickaz · 06/07/2011 19:59

A working family shouldn't NEED top ups though, I think that issue definitely needs addressing. Quite how though I do not know.

CherylWillBounceBack · 06/07/2011 20:00

COCKadoodledoo

Well done on your selective reading skills. I said, if an unforseeable change in circumstances happens it is good that the system helps. It's having kids based in the expectation the state can top you up that is a problem

Now, take your own advice 'do fuck off'.

usualsuspect · 06/07/2011 20:02

I can see the benefit bashes frothing at the bit when tax credits are mentioned on MN

Does a Siren go off somewhere?

TotalChaos · 06/07/2011 20:22

agree with Niceguy, double check what's happened re:unexpected cut in award, just in case there's some mistake. Sorry you are struggling.

woollyideas · 06/07/2011 20:33

I find it unbelievably callous when people come out with drivel like only rich people should have children you shouldn't have children if you can't afford it.

As many have pointed out, tax credits replaced the old 'married man's tax allowance' and child tax allowance, so it's always been the case that the government helped families.

People's circumstances change all the time. I didn't plan on having a pay freeze, followed by a pay cut, which means I now rely on working tax credit to 'top me up'. Would people like Cheryl and Janey prefer me and my DC to starve/renege on my mortgage/go to court for non-payment of council tax? Or maybe I should tell my employers where to stick their pay cut and join the other millions of unemployed. Would that suit them? Probably not, because then I'd be the lowest of the low in their eyes.

I wish I didn't get working tax credits, but I wish even more that my employers (in spite of them having record surpluses and reserves according to their annual report) didn't use every excuse under the sun to dish out increments of 0.3% when inflation is running at ten times that rate.

When I started my job 12 years ago I managed perfectly well on my wages alone. Now it's quite a different story. Shall I put my DD up for adoption, so that I'm not bleeding the country dry by accepting government handouts?

woollyideas · 06/07/2011 20:35

And OP - I meant to say, I'm really sorry that you find yourself in that situation and I can imagine it's going to mean a massive struggle for you. Good luck to you and your family...

Hai1988 · 06/07/2011 20:35

Hi Wow that was alot of come back I wasnt expecting that.

I saw a few ppl asking questions but cant remeber who or what so is you would like to ask for more details of my situation to understand a bit better then please feel free to ask me.

Oh and to the person/people who say dont have Children if you cant afford them. FYI I only have the one 5 yo DS which wasnt planned when I was 17 and decided that I wanted to keep him. But I guess you think all unplanned pregnancys should be termintaed if they are skint !

Thanks all

OP posts:
Hai1988 · 06/07/2011 20:35

Thank you woolly

OP posts:
Hai1988 · 06/07/2011 20:38

Oh and my DH works 60hr weeks at minimum wage. and the £140 was child tax credits and working. Now we just get child tax credits, but dh's wage has not changed in fact it has proberly gone down since last year.

OP posts:
KidderminsterKate · 06/07/2011 20:38

these threads really annoy me. tax credits are there...if you are entitled you claim them! i actually got more this year than last, despite a pay rise! i cant work out why! Get about 100 a week and earn 30 k

Hai1988 · 06/07/2011 20:41

Oh and no I dont work but am looking but I do not want to use childcare and Its quite hard to find a job within the hours I would need, especially as I have no further education or qualifications

OP posts:
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