To be a bit confused and a bit annoyed that I earn less

[MrsKravitz]

As a senior lecturer at a University than an A level teacher.
Seriously considering changing.

Oh, no, I didn't mean to suggest it did, font. Just trying to say what I thought as I have sympathy with the OP, but not exactly based on the reasons she gives, if that makes sense.

I am a solicitor and have taught A level law and also lectured at a Russel Group university.I can honestly say that teaching A level students was more demanding than lecturing at the university. As a lecturer, there is some distance between yourself and the students, however as a teacher one tends to spend an inordinate amount of time dealing with personal issues, behaviour problems etc.
One should not assume that because one has higher qualifications , that this will automatically mean that they will earn more money.

Im not sure about your role but I certainly dont have that . I deal with personal problems, finance, drunken phone calls from parents, the lot!

I agree with forehead.

I have about 60 allocated students for who I am personal tutor. I am also final year tutor for an undergrad course. I am admissions tutor and programme leader . I am not this distant figure who waltzes in, lectures and leaves.(I wish)

Im trying to illustrate what we do btw, as LRD said....there is so much misconception.

It's natural there would be misconceptions though - most people's jobs are such that outsiders don't have the foggiest what goes on!

I think something tricky is that although I've never met an academic who says they don't enjoy the research, it's not a luxury - it's what you get paid for and ultimately, unless you hold a purely teaching post, if you don't do enough research you will be without a job. Someone earlier in the thread said that teachers don't 'get to go off on sabbatical' and I have to admit, my first thought is, 'erm, no - because you don't do the work for it either!'

Not so LRD. We are not being released for research now!!

Sorry ... doesn't that mean you are purely teaching? Or does it mean you're researching on your own time? Either way, I don't think a sabbatical is a luxury or 'time off' the way people sometimes think.

No, its not supposed to be a teaching but we arent given time to research. Im trying to do some on my time (ok just systematic reviews) but the main thing we are doing now is livig vicariously through our MSc student's projects and sending them in as abstracts to fluke extra publications. Or we have people who have come with research just done or half time at another institution and we piggy back off that.

And worse still? We are a "centre" .....ha ha ha

it's much easier to teach university students who want to be there than secondary aged students who may not

Did you say university lecturers have to have some kind of teaching qualification? Cos I don't, and nor do any of the others I know!

irksome we all have to as part of our contractural agreement. Completion of a pgce and fellowship HEA.

Oh, how crap MrsK. Is there a possibility of applying for jobs elsewhere, or are you tied?

activate - in my (very) limited experience of teaching university students, they certainly don't all want to be there! Bear in mind, even those that want to be on the course in general (which isn't all of them by any means) won't necessarily want to be on your course. Worse, they quite probably feel they are paying to get a degree, no matter what they do.

FWIW, I have no teaching qualification.

I wonder why they make us get one at Uni X? How annoying.
I had mine anyway but everyone who comes has to.

University lecturers typically need a degree
AND a higher degree (PhD @ 3 years minimum, without salary),
AND research experience (insecure short term contracts for several years)
AND to have published in their field.

Yes it is much more difficult and the teaching is a much higher level than secondary school teaching. You are at the cutting edge of your field and have to keep updating your knowledge constantly - lots of reading the latest publications, conferences, etc.

Whereas, you can teach straight off of a first degree, and go into a permanent position. Id say its like comparing a jogger in the park with an olympic athlete.

I'm only on a partial contract, but all I have is a Phd and no publications.

Another misconception ....not all the students want to be there at all! (we keep registers)

irksome the teaching and a phd are the requirements for permanent contracts for us.

Frankly, its a travesty.

god no.... I spend more time chasing up non-attendees that anything else, some weeks. And replying to emails which say 'please can you fill me in on anything important that I have missed'.

Well, I suppose you could teach off a first degree but only in some bits of the private sector, surely? Bit of an unfair comparison really.

I also don't think the 'jogger/athlete' comparison is fair at all - v. insulting! I had some wonderful teachers and no way would I have been able to do what they did. I also had some crap teachers ... and to my shame, I still don't think I could do what they did. But I taught university students last term and got excellent feedback, so clearly either I bribed my students, or the two sets of skills are very different!

(I didn't bribe my students)

(Much.)

(Well, only with chocolate ...)

My sister has just secured a job as a 'senior lecturer' at university teaching nursing students. She has no qualifications in teaching (is a qualified nurse) to speak of and there is no such position a 'juniour lecturer' so the senior bit should really be ignored. Your job is no more important than any other teaching post unless you have different management responsibilities.

you can kick them out for not attending you can kick them out for not studying so they do not have to be there

unlike secondary students where it is extremely difficult to exclude a student who may be constantly disturbing your class

it really isn't the same I don't think