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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to consider taking ds out with chicken pox?

114 replies

LiegeAndLief · 08/06/2011 20:47

Genuine question, am prepared to be told IAB outrageously U!

He is covered in spots but completely well in himself and has been bouncing off the walls. There is a playground a short drive from here that is nearly always deserted when we go and any kids there have always been school age. Would it be really bad to drive there during school hours, let him have a run around and jump back in the car in the very unlikely situation that someone turned up? I have no idea if the virus would be shed and stick to playground equipment etc where another child could pick it up.

I know how dangerous chicken pox can be to pregnant women, immunocompromised people etc so really don't want to put him in a situation where he might infect someone, but the selfish bit of me is desperate to get him out of the house!

OP posts:
xstitch · 10/06/2011 14:42

You may have a point my XH reported me to SS for keeping my dd off nursery when she had CP. I don't class staying in for 5 days heroic measures. It's sad that it is considered strange that a human being would want to take steps so that the didn't take avoidable risks with the health of others. Can take as many risks with your own health as you want or see fit but not others.

I have seen 90% of patients on a ward come down with norovirus after a visitor came in knowing she had it because she was bored and there would be sick bowls anyway. Her words not mine. Most people get norovirus at some point in their lives and the death rate from it isn't high. Still think she was selfish.

Back to CP if you come into contact with an immunocompromised person, it isn't going to matter one jot if they have had it before or not. Much better that a child with CP stay in for 5 days rather than they stay in for life.

IHeartKingThistle · 10/06/2011 15:14

DingleDangle she's an ex-MNer because she was banned for trolling. I don't think we ever found out how much of what she says is true.

Bunnyjo · 10/06/2011 15:14

LiegeAndLief 'I know how dangerous chicken pox can be to pregnant women, immunocompromised people etc so really don't want to put him in a situation where he might infect someone, but the selfish bit of me is desperate to get him out of the house!'

You have your answer above - it would be absolutely selfish and reckless to consider taking your DS out whilst he is still infectious. I sadly miscarried last year at nearly 12wk pregnant, due to contracting CP and I have also seen posts from ladies on other threads who have sadly lost their children due to CP. I am glad to see you have decided to keep your DS indoors/ in your garden until he is no longer infectious.

Oh and to address clemetteattlee - contracting CP as a child doesn't guarantee immunity - there is research being carried out to ascertain if there is more than one type of CP and there is also evidence to suggest that immunity wanes as a person gets older, therefore someone who contracted CP in early childhood may still contract CP as an adult. There are also people (like me) who do not develop immunity to CP or are immunocompromised, therefore I don't consider staying in for 5 days as 'heroic measures'! I find your attitude quite odd, especially given the fact you studied virology at medical school. Finally, the varicella-zoster virus can live outside the body for 24hrs, not a few....

IHeartKingThistle · 10/06/2011 15:14

I still wouldn't take a child with CP out though, FWIW!

DingleDangleDiva · 10/06/2011 15:44

Kingthistle just to state I know the story and I also know the lady in question, but I won't say anymore on the matter :)

Bunnyjo has a point I also don't have an immunity to CP (had it 3 times and counting... woowoo Hmm) and although it probably won't harm me I would'nt be too happy at catching it because of somone's selfishness.

OP Glad you are staying in :)

clemetteattlee · 10/06/2011 15:59

It may be an odd view but it is not inaccurate because this all comes down to a perceived moral code and mine, on this issue, is obviously a bit different to the majority. But the issue is whether the OP should have taken her child to an empty park so I not feel like expressing an alternate view is difficult to understand. Varicella zoster can live for up to 24 hours in ideal conditions, not on hard metal, and as I said earlier it is easily removed with an anti-bac wipe.
I simply think you can be a little more pragmatic than staying in for days - like the example I gave when I had to take my son to collect my daughter from school but we stayed out of the school playground. Nowhere have I said that you should expose people willy-nilly!

southofthethames · 10/06/2011 16:10

It doesn't stick onto playground equipment like colds and flu viruses do, but being in close contact would, and you can't stop pregnant women and babies from turning up to the playground obviously. If you want to be very civic minded and give your child some beneficial fresh air, why not go to an open, grassy space in the park with few people close by and bring a football, scooter or bike? But NB don't tire him out - be very firm about going home after a short spell (less than one hour, more than five minutes) - tiring him out weakens his immune system while he is still in the middle of the viral infection and can lead to lung (pneumonitis) and brain (encephalitis) complications. Enough exercise to give him a change of scene (and fresh air is good for his recovery) but not to make him tired. Nobody catches chicken pox from grass btw.

southofthethames · 10/06/2011 16:17

When you have to stay in, lots of DVDs, tv and jigsaw puzzles are the only answer! (The harm of excessive tv, if any, is very temporary and wears off after the disease is gone :-). Stick to channels with no ads. Ads are a disease in themselves, IMHO!! Does he like train sets?

Original poster
LiegeAndLief · 10/06/2011 19:38

Thanks for the further replies, this seems to have taken off again!

We are now on day 3 and I haven't taken them out (although I am losing the will to live). Was overjoyed to see dh this evening, I am going OUT tomorrow!! Just to clarify, I was certainly not planning to put ds in close contact with anyone. The playground in such that I would have been able to see anyone coming and got them back in the car before they got close, I was more wondering if the virus would linger on surfaces, but irrelevant now as you have convinced me not to go.

Really interested to see that chicken pox is not quarantined in Switzerland - is the vaccine routine there?

We have done lots of baking, cutting and sticking, painting, running round the garden etc. I was running out of ideas today and put the tent up in the garden and dug out our very old playstation (ds loved the eye toy). Was going to take them out to the car wash today for a change of scene but had the plumber here all day (I checked, he has had chicken pox and was happy to be here) so will save that treat for tomorrow!

OP posts:
Original poster
LiegeAndLief · 10/06/2011 19:40

Oh, and train sets yes he loves, but dd is a bit of a godzilla! In fact dd is the biggest problem as she is nearly two so has a rather destructive tendancy and can't sit down to do anything for more than 10min.

OP posts:
mrsravelstein · 10/06/2011 19:44

clementatlee i agree with you and find the elevation of CP to being some kind of major killer disease a bit mystifying... since they are infectious before the spots appear, you are going to be exposing other people to it whether you intend to or not. my younger 2 dc had it last month, 3 weeks apart, so we would have had to be quarantined for 5 weeks which is patently impossible if, as i do, you still have a school run to do for an older child.

clemetteattlee · 10/06/2011 19:49

Thanks for that, I was beginning to think that the whole world was living in fear...

thegruffalosma · 10/06/2011 19:55

I find it an odd viewpoint that just because you will have already, unavoidably, exposed people to the virus before you knew your child had cp that you should go on exposing people when there's something you can do about it!

Bananamash · 10/06/2011 20:02

clemetteattlee and mrsravelstein

I completely agree with you. My eldest DC had it, and then 3 weeks later, to the day, the youngest had it. If I had had to stay indoors, to the extremes suggested her eg getting neighbours to get milk etc I would have topped the lot of us!

When the eldest was ill, I got my mum to look after him and took the youngest out. When the youngest was ill, we still had to do school runs etc and went to the supermarket the day before the spots came out when he was a bit off colour (tho i was wondering if he had it at all at that point, as i thought it was supposed to be 10-14 days between siblins catching it...)

Original poster
LiegeAndLief · 10/06/2011 20:11

I have seen several people doing the school run with a pre-school poxed sibling in a buggy under the raincover - at the time I thought it was pretty reasonable, as I have no idea how else I would get ds to school (assuming dd gets it in a week or so).

OP posts:
clemetteattlee · 10/06/2011 20:13

There is a difference between "deliberately" exposing the vulnerable (eg going to a hospital) and just living life. It is, for the vast majority, a mild virus.

thegruffalosma · 10/06/2011 20:14

If I had to do the school run I would do that Liege and wait at the end of the path and get the teacher to send dd up to me. Don't think the school would be happy about the older child staying off.

RunningDay · 10/06/2011 21:54

Liege the vaccine isn't routine in Switzerland.

I think it's what someone mentioned up-thread, that the assumption is that most people catch it when young, and if not, presumably get the vaccine at the age of 12 or so. My consultant was MOST surprised that I was still unvaccinated when pregnant with my first.

I don't think the vaccine is offered to anyone on the NHS is it? Does it always have to be done privately (unless medical emergency)? Certainly no-one ever mentioned it when I was growing up in the UK, but it may have been because they didn't have my full medical history available.

bringmesunshine2009 · 10/06/2011 22:13

I have a Q...

If DS1 (19 months) got the pox, should I keep him separate from DS2 (4 weeks)? As in, should me and DS2 stay away? It is going around at the moment...

Though presumably DS2 would have it by the time I knew DS1 had it.

Am worried it would be a problem for a newborn.

Just pontificating really, but good to be prepared.

xstitch · 10/06/2011 22:36

I can assure you clemett I am not living in fear I just have consideration for others and for me that is one of the ways you show consideration. I am not suggesting people stay in for 3 weeks, just the 5 days or so they have an active rash.

You cannot assume that somebody is not vulnerable simply because they are not in hospital. What about all these people who are on disease modifying drugs for severe arthritis and anti-rejection stuff for transplants. The whole point of these medications for these people is to allow them to try and live as normal a life as possible. 5 days is nothing compared to a lifetime, it is selfish to think otherwise. As I have said up thread if someone wants to chose to come and visit when there is active CP in the house they are welcome to come as long as the do it knowing that someone there has CP.

It is about the courtesy of not making other people's decisions for them not about living in fear.

KD0706 · 10/06/2011 22:54

bringmesunshine are you BFing? I'm fairly sure that newborn bf babies have their mums immunity.
Certainly that's what my friend was told when her two older DCs got CP one after the other when she had a newborn (she was told by a hcp, not sure if it was midwife or health visitor)

But also I agree with you that by the time you realised DC1 had it it would be too late

xstitch · 10/06/2011 23:00

I'm not sure it would be worth it tbh, keeping away when they have been in such close contact. AS KD says if you are bf your DS should have some of your antibodies. Now he is a few weeks old if he did get it then there is a good chance it would be mild. The main problem would be a child getting it when under one is less likely to build up immunity and therefore more likely to get it again later on and is more likely to get shingles as for some reason it seems to be more common in children who have had CP that young.

Hopefully your DS1 won't get it this time round and DS 2 will be older before it happens fx for you. If he does get it then keep a close eye on him for a cough/wheeze or the CP being very close to his eye or in his throat. In these circumstance call your Dr as can be sign of complications.

DaisyDaresYOU · 10/06/2011 23:04

I'd keep them in tbh.When my brother was on chemo he caught a cold and was extemely ill because of it he was hullucinating and crying because his temp shot up.It was extemely distressing.So god knows what cp would of done.Sadly there will be people with low immunity

Northernlurker · 10/06/2011 23:13

CP is spread by close contact. There is no reason why the op could not take her dcs out as she suggested.

southofthethames · 11/06/2011 23:15

Oh dear - who's convinced the OP not to go out? The scientists and doctors here have already said chicken pox viruses don't linger on surfaces like doorknobs and playground equipment! It's only a problem if the affected or incubating (ie just caught it but no spots yet) child continues to play closely with other children or adults when they turn up. A walk outside, cycling on the grass or cycle paths in the park, far away from others, is totally fine. Just don't tire out the patient. The outdoors is also good for the mum's sanity and the sibling's wellbeing.