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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To wonder whether anyone has ever actually been influenced by the MN bun fight on SAHMs Vs Childcare

92 replies

Silver1 · 04/06/2011 23:34

Am I?

Everyone seems to take their corner very seriously-and defends it aggresively-so has anyone ever decided for or against working outside of the home or being a SAHM based on the comments on here

OP posts:
Honeybee79 · 05/06/2011 15:54

I actually find those debates just upset me and make me angry. They don't make me change my mind because I'm one of the many many women in this country who works because SHE HAS TO. No amount of ranting on here is going to change that. And that's what lots of people seem to be overlooking at the moment.

It really doesn't matter what my thoughts are on the entire issue. I work because I have no choice and having some money instead of none in clearly in my family's interest.

MadamDeathstare · 05/06/2011 16:10

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

pommedechocolat · 05/06/2011 16:23

MadamDeathStare - what is best for your family is your business and only your business. Your dh is paying taxes and supporting you all. Noone else is involved or needs to be involved. End of.
The person calling it a 'pisstake' will be very jealous. End of.

squishysquashy · 05/06/2011 17:26

My DH just started being a SAHD. He has had no negative comments from family, friends or random people, neither has he been referred to as a saint etc. Generally the reaction is something along the lines of that sounds lovely how are u finding it. Tbh though we both tend to refer to it as a career break rather than a vocation.

In our area there is a SAHD network which has now got dad sessions at a few children's centres too. With the new maternity/paternity rules I think gradually there will be more SAHDs.

Silver1 · 05/06/2011 17:27

I am really sorry about that Madamedeathstare Sad FWIW I believe the person who said those things is wrong.

OP posts:
EggyAllenPoe · 05/06/2011 17:56

MD ater 3 lots of mat leave in 4 years, my working life is a 'pisstake' also..no doubt according to my colleagues anyway.

I regret nothing though :)

MrsCampbellBlack · 05/06/2011 17:57

Madame - I really really wouldn't feel guilty about it.

Its your individual life and your individual circumstances.

I really couldn't care less what some one on here thinks of my decision to be a SAHM. There are advantages/disadvantages to both really - the main disadvantage for me is going to be finding a job when my dc's are all in school that fits around them/DH working very long hours/and I want to do.

MrsSchadenfreude · 05/06/2011 18:10

I read the support thread for SAHMs, which was really MN at its best. What shocked me was how sad and bored most of the people were on it - despite what some of them were saying, about wanting to stay at home for the children, hardly any of them seemed to be enjoying it - there were so many comments about feeling like they had lost their identity. I think that confirmed for me that I had made the right decision to carry on working. My short stint as a SAHM was not a great success (although it improved markedly when we hired a nanny).

QuickLookBusy · 05/06/2011 18:12

Madame don't let some lunatic person on the internet make you feel guilty about the choices that are best for you and your family. Really, do not let them do that.

I was totally shocked when I read my first thread about this on MN. I really had no idea that such extreme views really existed. I have never come across people like that in rl.

I have come to the conclusion that it actually comes from their own insecurites. Because they do it, they don't want to contemplate they may be doing the wrong thing, so they have to think any other option is totally ridiculous, when it clearly isn't.

ProfYaffle · 05/06/2011 18:17

MrsS - I am a SAHM (though I hesitate to say that on MN these days) and also saw that thread. However, as it was a support thread for people finding it difficult it didn't feel appropriate for me to rock up go on about how fab my life is and how much I enjoy being at home. I honestly don't think that thread represents the whole SAH experience.

My situation is v similar to MadamDeathStare - don't feel guilty MDS, I certainly don't!

ProfYaffle · 05/06/2011 18:18

Oh, and I use a nursery too despite being a SAHM, it seems I am vilified by all!

thegruffalosma · 05/06/2011 18:20

I think maybe a support thread for SAHMs isn't the best place to find SAHMs who love what they do MrsSchadenfreud Grin. I love being a SAHM - but my opinion or anyone elses doesn't really matter. I'm not you and our families and circumstances aren't the same. That is why anyone who says working is always best or staying at home is always best just comes across as really arrogant and a bit thick - assuming everyone elses lives and feelings are exactly like theres.

fgaaagh · 05/06/2011 18:20

Well I've done the SAHP thing, the breadwinner thing, and the part time thing - I like to think I have been blessed with seeing this from all sides during my time as a parent to small children!

I never was particularly opinionated about what was the "right choice" - there's no such thing. just what's right for each couple. which, frankly, on the couple themselves will know the details about.

However my eyes have been well and truly hardened to wonder how naive a SAHM is being when she gives up any form of working outside the home.

I'm sorry to say it, because it pains me to point out the number of Relationship threads where the story follows the same old, old pattern:

  • Woman gives up paid work to look after DCs (due to pressure from OH, or because she genuinely wants to, or it makes more financial sense, and all the reasons inbetween)
  • She may be happy or sad at various points, whatever
  • ... DH involved in accident, illness, bad financial decisions, affair, whatever
  • Woman ends up financially fucked due to having few NI contributions, no pension in her name.

The fact that I've seen this happen to my own mum (in her case, my dad's workplace accident) made me realise in my late 20s that this was a rare, exceptional, sad thing.

What I've realised being on MN the last few years is that this isn't an exceptional thing.

A significant proportion of SAHMs throw their (and their children's) financial security in with their partners. In a number of cases, this tactic works out just fine.

But in so, so many cases, it doesn't.

There is far too much poverty brought on by sticking to the "nuclear" family setup of 1 SAHP and 1 WOHP that MN has confirmed my thoughts that my mum's situation was avoidable, with the benefit of hindsight.

It upsets me to see this scenario played out again and again and again on here.

And it all stems from the (longterm) labour specialisation that so many MNers think is a wise decision - because they don't see the longterm advantages/disadvantages of their choice. It's short sighted thinking at its worst.

So, yes, MN has changed me on this score. Not from debate, but from seeing desperate posters who through no fault of their own, end up homeless, no earning power, and relying on the CSA (etc) or their DH's sickness benefits/compensation payments to get them by for years to come. Sad, avoidable, and depressing.

thegruffalosma · 05/06/2011 18:20

And yes I'm aware I've accused people of being thick and made at least one spelling mistake (probably more) Grin

MrsCampbellBlack · 05/06/2011 18:27

Fair point fgaaagh but not true thankfully for all SAHMs. If anything was to go awry in my marriage - I would be fine financially.

But it is a risk generally speaking to step out of the work-place espeically if you had a reasonable lucrative career. I mean I won't have worked for probably 8 years by the time I do go back to work (3 dc's) and I know I'll struggle to find a job that I want and it certainly won't be at the same level as I was at previously and thats fair enough really.

fgaaagh · 05/06/2011 18:29

"but not true thankfully for all SAHMs"

No indeed, thank god! I was just shocked to see my own family's story being played out so often, in so many families - to end up financially crippled through no fault of your own (well, not really - we all try and make the best decisions we can at the time, right?), it's depressing to see it!

manicinsomniac · 05/06/2011 20:10

No, I have not been influenced because I didn't have a choice to make in the first place. I think that's probably true of many posters.

In my case I am a single parent so being a stay at home mum is impossible. Working part time is also not going to cut it, it has to be full time.

People saying that working mothers are harming their children has no effect on me whatsoever because I know that there are no other options available to me.

NormanTebbit · 05/06/2011 20:23

I am a SAHM for all sorts of boring reasons. These threads make me depressed and upset. They never change anything because most people do what they do because they have to.

It's not like i'm gonna read mumsnet and think "farkin ell, I need to rush out and get a job, see ya kids!".
Decent childcare, flexible hours blimey even being able to find a job things are always more complicated than a thread on mumsnet allows

SybilBeddows · 05/06/2011 20:28

haven't read whole thread but surely no-one is going to think they've been influenced, in the same way as people insist they individually are not influenced by advertising, despite the fact that we know that people as a whole are?

pointythings · 05/06/2011 20:34

BelleDame Well said - so many people seem to think that we work because we want to/because we want to have flash cars/big TVs/the latest phones/clothes and so on. A lot of us don't have a choice - I certainly didn't when the DDs were little.

And if we hadn't had children, then the world would have missed out on two lovely little girls who are being taught good manner, good social skills and a good work ethic.

Lastly, I don't think we can underrate the need adults have for adult company, even if only part-time - it means we treasure the time we have with our DCs, make the most of it, learn to appreciate every facet of our lives and not just the obvious ones. I firmly believe that I am a better, more patient, more loving mother because I've always had to work.

NormanTebbit · 05/06/2011 20:37

And I knew that the SAHM support thread would be used on one of these threads.

We use it to moan.

NormanTebbit · 05/06/2011 20:40

We worked out most of the SAHMs on that thread are there due to redundancy, lack of childcare help etc

No one seems to be making cupcakes and bunting because it's the real world just as the women desperate to stop working because they are exhausted are also part of honest RL

Every situation is different

Honeybee79 · 05/06/2011 20:40

I'm with you manicinsomniac. No choice so the whole debate has had no impact on me at all.

Cain · 05/06/2011 20:48

Well that would be silly, to let complete strangers on the internet influence any aspect of your life.
By all means get POVs but we all have different circumstance and needs so people can rant and wail all they like but at the end of the day it is down to individuals.

mumnotmachine · 05/06/2011 20:53

Ive done all manner of work patterns- FT, PT, have also been a SAHM and if Im honest take my hat off to those who love being a SAHM. I was glad when DS started school and I could go back to work!
Im now a term time only worker and feel that I have the best of both worlds as I am not reliant on anyone for childcare, and I can spend real quality time with my kids during the holidays