to think a school should be able to look after a child for over an hour?

[pingu2209]

More of a "is my friend being unreasonable" or the school?

A mum friend of mine has a career job but can't afford a nanny. A nanny would cost all of her salary. She uses the before and after school club. She works 1 hour away and her husband works 1 1/2 hours away from school. She was phoned up and asked to come and collect her son as he had a temperature and a rash.

She said, "okay I will be there in about 1 1/4 hours." The school office said, "well we need you here asap, can you get someone to come in the next 10 mins?"

My friend said, "no, I don't have any family living near by and I am uncomfortable asking a friend to pick up my son who is ill and may be contagious."

The school said to her, "you need to have an emergency contact who can get here in under 10 mins."

She replied, "well that would be great in an ideal world, but we are not from here and have no family. A friend would pick up if I was running late, but as all my friends here have children, I can't ask them to pick up my son who is ill. I am just over an hour away but the longer I am on the phone to you the longer I will be. I need to make a couple of calls to cancel meetings etc. I can't just run out, I need about 15 mins just to close up my desk etc."

I understand that a school is there to educate our children, it is not childcare or a 'sick room'. However, surely they need to understand that if both parents are working and they don't have a nanny, one of them will be along as soon as possible.

Who is being unreasonable?

Not earning any money ending up homeless and having no food on the table isn't good for the child either though is it?

Once again, you won't find anyone to argue with you on that pont, xstitch.

Regarding whether a vomiting child is or is not an emergency - that must depend, in part, on how much they are vomiting. A child can vomit once, get rid of whatever had upset their stomach, and be well on the road to recovery, whereas another might be repeatedly vomiting. It wouldn't be too hard for the school to look after the first child whilst waiting for a parent to arrive, whilst the second child definitely needs picking up as soon as humanly possible.

The vast majority of parents are going to do their best, within the constraints of their own circumstances, to get to their sick child as soon as possible. Maybe there are some who can calmly let the school look after their sick child until it suits them to get there, but they are not in evidence on this thread at all, and a parent who is doing their best to get to their sick child as soon as possible does not need or deserve a lecture from the HT or school secretary. A bit of understanding on both sides is needed.

Sadly, the thing that this thread has made most clear to me is how few friends I actually have round here. I have social 'fun' friends, but no-one really close. And the friendships I do have seem to have got as close as they are going to get. That feels a bit shit, actually.

PCT rules are very clear, StayingDavidTennantsGirl - usually 24/48 hours needs to pass before a child can re-enter school. Therefore I have to disagree with it depending on how much they are vomiting - and that rule is not imposed by the school.

Yes but for many people keeping a job means having to travel some distance and therefore take a bit longer to get back to the school. I think most people have agreed that parents should get there as fast as possible but sometimes that just isn't that fast. Look at my dd 7 contacts yet me, as contact 1 was the person to pick her up just over an hour later :(.

That's an interesting point, sdtg. But you know, sometimes, asking someone for help can nudge you over that fine line between aquaintanceship and friendship. You can become closer "in the face of adversity." lots of people like to feel needed, too. But you won't know unless you ask.

I don't think SDTG is saying the former shouldn't be picked up. Just that it would be easier for the school in that situation in the ga between the parent being called and them reaching the school. At least that's how I read it.

That's exactly what I meant, xstitch - the child who throws up once and is then well on the way to recovery is far less of an emergency for the purposes of parental pick-up than the child who is vomiting repeatedly - and far easier for the school to cope with.

I certainly didn't say that the first child didn't need picking up at all - I don't think I even implied it.

I didn't mean that either. I meant that the severity of the vomiting shouldn't have any bearing on how quickly a parent should try to get there or how well a school office should deal with them.

I don't think SDTG meant the parents should take their time I certainly didn't.

Neither do I, but there was a distinction made between the timing of each, and I'm saying there shouldn't be.

We all appreciate there are times when parents are always over an hour away because of work. If there is nobody else who can be an emergency contact I would hope the situation was exPlained to the school before an emergency arose. At least that way in the case of an emergency closure they can ensure that parent is called first to give them a "head start" and if the child is ill they can immediately know it will take longer and not make the child think mummy/daddy will be there on a few minutes.

I totally think the school is being unreasonable!!! It is not anyone else's responsibility to get someone else's kids (I have for my sister, but we live close). Besides, I always thought that schools had to have certain people on the Emergency List, as they said, but that doesn't mean that they are responsible for the kids. Ultimately, I feel it is the parent's decision about who picks up their kid(s). My sister called me to ask me FIRST, and THEN called the school for me to pick up my niece and my nephew from daycare another time. That's the correct way. The school has a Nurse's office and they should be using it for what it's for. Personally, I think Nurse's offices need to be larger in schools!

I work 2 hours away from ds's school. If Ds was taken so ill at school that he required collecting in 10 mins I'd expect the school to call an ambulance and take him to hospital. There certainly isn't a 10 min rule at his school.

The odd time he has been ill he has been quite happy to wait to be collected. He gets fussed over by the school nurse and office staff and generally has perked up by the time I get there. He is 6 and appreciates that mummy has to go to work.

I dont see any sense of entitlement. Legally the children must be at school, the school has responsibility for them in school hours (or when they are on school premises). I think parents have an understanding that the school will care for them at that time. If a child is sick, that should continue until the parent can get there and take over at the soonest possible time. That doesnt mean any expectation over and above. It really doesnt.

When mine started school, the head spoke to all the parents and explained that we were now handing responsibility over to the school and that we had to "let go" and trust them. We even had to do a group task , rating where we were with our ability to do that. This involved placing a sticky note with our name on a scale written on the wall. A photo was taken. No doubt there will be a comparison in a few years. The school provides education but also a community and a has caring and christian ethos. If that means making sure a poorly child is ok until their parent can get there asap then why is that a sense of entitlement and an unrealistic expectation?

The school has a Nurse's office and they should be using it for what it's for. Personally, I think Nurse's offices need to be larger in schools!

Most schools don't have a nurse's office though.

the school.

And, as with hospitals, a nursing room (or ward) needs to be staffed in order to be any use!

As someone has already pointed out, in a school of 400 children, you may have as many as three poorly children per day. That's not once in a while.

Feenie - what I was saying was that although you may have a few children a day poorly , chances are that the majoritys emergency contacts will be available.I was agreeing that a parent should have to provide an emergency local contact number but its unreasonable to expect them to be at the end of a phone and immediately available 100% of the time and for them to be there in 10 mins all the time. Sometimes an emergency contact just wont be available and a child will have to wait longer then desired and I think the school was at fault by insisting that someone be there in 10 mins.

In the DT's school its usually a TA or one of the admin staff who stays with a sick child while waiting for a parent/CM to arrive although in a smaller school I appreciate that his would be awkward but then you are dealing with a smaller no of children also so less likely to happen.

I just think there has to be give and take on both sides and as long as parents arent taking advantage of teachers and deliberately not turning up on time/sending in children knowing they arent well/not providing any alternative contacts then I think schools expectatons should be reaonable also

I really surprised about the recent posters who are talking about nurses and nurses offices, because they are the lucky few - private school? - I don't know of a single primary school that I have taught at, worked near, my DC have been to or any of my friends from teacher training that have a room or a member of medical staff.
I totally agree about give and take, flexibility, parents douing their best ... but please, please, please - pass the message round your fellow parents - stop having a go at teachers when your child's education has been substandard for an hour or so because the teaching assistant who normally provides one-to-one has been borrowed to look after an ill child, or no one answers the office phone because the secretary is looking after a child, or the reading book isn't changed, or they didn't do PE because the teacher was being "flexible" and looking after the ill child as well as the 29 others. I'm happy to do it, because I'm concerned for the ill child, but I resent the backlash at ME because I have to provide the care to due to the financial limitations of the shcool budget not providing any other option.

Our school only got a nurse this year. Before that the office staff looked after any sick child until collected.

but how often does it happen that:
a) Jimmy gets sick at school
b) Jimmy is too sick to be left in the school sec's office for a while awaiting collection
c) Local emergency contacts are unavailable
d) There is no Ta/admin staff that could look after him
e) parent will take an hour to get there
f) teacher has to look after him and rest of class have to go to another class

I mean is it something that happens weekly, monthly in say a school of around 400 pupils?

Feenie - as a registered general nurse, I was trained to assess and prioritise patients according to need - and the child who is repeatedly vomiting cannot wait as long for a parent to pick them up as the child who has thrown up once, got rid of whatever has upset them, and is on the road to recovery, can.

As I have already said, ds1 gets migraine-style headaches, and he will throw up once, fall asleep, and wake up feeling better. He's not contagious when he does this, and whilst he does need picking up as soon as possible, it is much less urgent than if he were vomiting repeatedly, due to some sort of bug.

I think most people had already agreed that a parent should and would do their very best to get there as soon as, StayingDavidTennantsGirl - not sure what your point is.

And also, I think we've established that this school IS being unreasonable if they are expecting/demanding parents to get there within 10 minutes.