to report a facebook photo of naked children?

[ednurse]

This photo is on a friend of a friends account. Friend has been 'tagged' so anyone who is friends with him can see it.

Said picture is of a girl about 5 and a boy of around 2 in the bath (naked) standing up and leaning against the wall....bent over almost so you can see their behinds.

AIBU to report it? I'm all for photos of babies/toddlers playing in the bath being modestly covered but I think this is just ridiculous..

I would normally agree with Hecate and the argument is totally rational.

However, the logical conclusion of the argument would be you wouldn't show sonogram photos, birthing photos/ videos as the baby is naked.

If you asked a 5 year old if you could take a photo of them on the beach (nude) they would likely play up to the camera as they attach no judgement to being naked. Are they then 'consenting'?

A child cannot consent to sexual images but nudity is not in itself sexual.

That's why pre-pubescence photos of happily innocent naked children are to be found in family albums - as until they become self conscious it is not necessarily intrusive or implies ownership to take a photo.

"dignity" as a concept is meaningless where the child himself/herself has no concept of it, IMO

if your child is too young to be concerned about modesty, or simply has no problem with being seen naked, then his/her dignity is not being compromised.

I'm also having a bit of a private chuckle at the idea that in the delivery room mum says "baby coming out naked. Switch the camera off."

That argument spider is not rational at all - would you say that a person with severe mental illness has no right to dignity either??

Not starting a bunfight - just asking

By the way - I have no problem with nudity within the family/ close friends etc But posting on the internet is where I personally draw the line.

I thought that might come up

In the case of someone whose mental capacity is such that they have no concept of dignity, I actually feel - for me, anyway, if I were the carer/parent - that the reasons for covering up would have more to do with the perceptions and perceived norms of others than the disabled person's per se

pictures of a naked adult displayed as though that person were a child would contravene social norms to a degree that would shock people and make them uncomfortable

and in terms of the disabled person - well, the reaction of the viewer to an adult naked body is going to be rather different from the reaction of the average viewer to the image of a child's bottom while in the bath - so it does feel disrespectful to everyone concerned to display such pictures

it doesn't seem irrational to me.

Good post cory

I'm amused at the idea that children have an enforceable right not to be seen naked without consent. How is this made up "right" to be enforced? How is consent to be given?

Couching areguments in simplistic legalistic absolutes and thinking you've made a moral argument is a funny little mumsnet peccadillo

once we were on the beach and DS1 was nude. SIL kept on telling me to dress him, and I was like yeh yeh, till we saw some dodgy old geezer (who hung out there every day) who was very discreetly taking photos on his mobile

next day, bathers were ON

saidthespider Some paedo is wanking over a photo of your kids, but they don't know it's happening, so no harrm done. Seriously? That's the most bizarre and frankly disturbing comment I've seen on mumsnet

but it doesn't harm them, does it? As I said, I wish there were no such people

but I am not going to run shrieking at the thought somebody unsavoury might see my children's innocent childhood pictures and feel something they shouldn't

nor am I going to worry about curbing their wholly natural and lovely desire to be naked in the sunshine because somebody MIGHT take a picture and get a perverted kick out of it

I will not live my life that way and neither will my children

what are you going to do? Ban cameras? Bonkers.

Agree with said thespider on all counts.
If some freak is getting their jollies over pics that most people would find totally innoffensive, then what can you do? Lock the kids up? Make them wear Burkhas?
I wouldn't post naked pics on the internet, but I have a couple I have taken in the garden. Children love running around in the garden in the buff when it's hot.
I don't think anyone should change their behaviour or way of thinking(unless to keep safe e.g "dont get in strangers cars etc)just in case perverts are taking a wholly innocent and beautiful thing and twisting it in their minds.

northernrock you answered the question - don't post photos of your naked kids on the internet.

saidthespider um...I didn't say we should get hysterical or ban cameras, cos yes you're right, that would be bonkers.

I remember when I used to use Yahoo Chat and had some wedding photos on my profile. I used to get IMs regularly from men telling me which was their favourite photo and what their screen now looked like. Same picture all the time. I don't even get what the appeal of that particular picture was.

Doesn't matter what you post someone will get off on it. Post a picture of your children clothed and there's a risk the head could be photo-shopped into another picture.

We only have a problem with nudity because we're told to. Children don't have that problem. Personally I think it says more about the viewer who says it's obscene than the person who innocently posted it.

Soooo i doubt we'll find out if the friend of a friend replied to the OPs message.

Doesnt look like she's coming back

I have numerous photos of me, stark naked, as a toddler and little girl and I hate their existence. I was very trusting when those pictures were taken and I feel that by taking them that trust was abused and mocked. I completely agree with Hecate, I don't think taking photos of your children naked and sharing them in that way is acceptable at all.

You wouldn't post naked photos of yourself. What's the difference? they don't care that they're naked but plenty sickos do

"If you asked a 5 year old if you could take a photo of them on the beach (nude) they would likely play up to the camera as they attach no judgement to being naked."

I disagree. I think 5 year olds would be quite self-conscious of their nudity. They're not babies - they're school age.

I think that would largely depend on whether or not their parents had burdened them with adult notions of modesty or not

Animation, I agree. Spider, this is the point - at what age SHOULD children be told by adults that they shouldn't be running around naked on a beach, for example? I think 5 is too old, but then I only have my ds1 to base this on, and he is very mature for his age, so always "seems" older than he actually is

Personally I don't see a good reason why children should be naked on a beach anyway - swimming costumes/swim nappies?

Her settings were wrong, I'd let her know. Personally wouldn't put naked or semi naked pics of my or any other child on fbook although have plenty of 'usual' photos of DD on there-and very tight privacy settings.

Very very horrible things get put on facebook, reported and never taken down so I wouldn't put your trust in some faceless (geddit) organisation.

Well spider - I have never 'burdened' my 5 year old with notions of modesty....but she has naturally become quite a private little girl and phots of her naked that are to be shown to other people would be very embarrassing to her.... surely some children are naturally more private than others?

Claiming that modesty is a burden is a little far fetched. Perhaps if modesty was taught to children there would be less women and men out there willing to take a piss in the middle of the street on a night out and such like.

Where do we draw the line then? Do we ban nappy ads, parenting mags etc?!

I believe it is up to the parent/s of the children in the oicture to decide whether or not it is appropriate, not yourself.

YABU.

If someone is going to misuse a photo then they will do so, a photo of a child fully clothed doesnt magically protect them from the nastys of the world.

I learnt the hard way when I first discovered Facebook. I had a gorgeous picture of my son about 6 months old in an army sleep suit which I put on facebook. Before I knew it, it was being used by some mental anti war, anti army girl. It was posted everywhere with the slogan.... child of a rapist/future rapist, as according to her all soliders rape afghan women and as my son was wearing an army print sleep suit that somehow meant him!!

Simple solution, dont put pictures of your children on facebook if it concerns you that much of them falling into the wrong hands.

My son, now 3yrs old, would happily stay naked 24/7. He is well known for getting naked at any given moment at nursery...I am not about to sit him down and give him a lecture about protecting his modesty at his age and it certainly doesnt mean he will grow up to "piss in the street"