To want to scream that Motability cars are NOT FREE!!!!!

[Mamaz0n]

Ihave just seen a programme on the BBC where they have yet again claimed someone recieved a "free car"

No they fucking didnt!

They have been given a lease hire vehicle under the motability scheme. It is not their car, they DO PAY for it and it is only for a certain period of time.

It pisses me off that people assume that being disabled is a sweet life with loads of freebies.
It isn't. far from it.

you would expect the BBC at least to get it right.

Semanticd.... DLA is a gift and an investment. For many as well who become disabled as adults it's simply the repayment of a policy (NI) they have paid all their working lices.

Gift- well I consider myself to have been lucky to be born intoa society that didn't force me and the boys out to die of starvation. So yes. Am I grateful? yes I am actually. Although when it comes to CA I more than repay the kindness. Not many post grads working for £4 a day, 24 hour shifts after all. Noit that i woudln;t of course but it's a fact that CA is intended as a repayment rather than straight benefit: that's why it's taxable.

DLA (and we don't get mobility at higher rate) is to co er the costs of disability. It's an investment in getting people into employment, and it's an investment made with the aim of making caring manageable becuase residentaial care costs £8k a month plus and HR DLA care costs £285.60. If you can't work out why it's paid there's issues frankly.

The programme last night about the street without services for 6 weeks was intersting; we've been shouting about cuts to social care and the costs for ages now and nobody listens. It was only wen forced the street realised social care came down to them, and then they knew it! And when the suggested to the Councillors that cutting all care to the moderately disabled (definition vague but certainly would cover people who cannot work or be independent in many cases) all the Councillors could do was bleat about how hard it was them to make the call. They of course chose to be Cuncillers: ds3, moderately disabled by social services definitions, will die if not cared for when I pass away.

Also, OK so the boys haven't paid for their DLA as they are after all children but I am pretty sure that all those wages Dh and I dragged in over the last 20+ years were billed for NI, no?

I am as I said thankful to have been born into a society that had Bevan etc to set up the great institustions of support: equally it would take ridiculous naivete not to be able to see the economic and social benefits of the state as we have it.

Oh boys diagnosed at 6 and 5, though ASD clear from 3 or 4.

ccp- those that provide the goods and services are then kept in employment and pay into the tax system. No its not rocket science, its part and parcel of living in a 'liberal model' of a welfare state with universal provision thrown in.

We are (as a country) commited to providing 'cradle to grave care' so it is cheaper to have disability benefits in place.

how i long for people like ccpccp to become disabled in some way. I wonder if they will see their DLA payments a "gift" then.

rabbitfood - yes. the downpayments range between hundreds and thousdands of pounds. On top of the regular monthly payments for the lease hire.

thanks mamaz0n. I only wondered because if the downpayment was in the thousands, then what sort of car would they be buying, but presume that would be for the modifications?

it comes from money you haven't eared that was given to you by the tax payer = free regardless the reason why its needed the only type of car that is not free is one you pay for out of wages that you earn from a JOB you work at.

oh fuck

and we are off again

and what about the large downpayment, maypole?

that isn't just handed over.

and has to be paid every 3 years.

as I said earlier, for the car we would need, it would be about 5K. every 3 years, as we entered into a new contract.

that isn't easy to find.

I dont know about the scheme. But in my place you used to be able to hire a mob sc for a nominal sum

some cars have no downpayment but they tend to be smaller cars

the advance payment will depend on the make and model of the car, for example a volvo xc90 is about 6k in advance, and a mercedes mpv type is around 10k

the advance payments are based on the fact that the monthly dla payments over 3 years will leave a shortfall in the actual cost of the car, so the ap is adjusted accordingly

Mamazon - ccpc did say "Disabled people who need cars should be provided with them, and it shouldnt have to come out of DLA."

Motability, like the DLA that funds it, is a subsidy towards transport that enables disabled people to leave the home, go shopping and work in a way that otherwise they would not be able to do.

It is a welfare benefit or subsidy. The word 'free' makes it sound like a random free gift or lucky windfall. You do hear motability cars being described as 'free' in a way that Child Tax Credits, Child Benefit and Maternity leave are not. Do many MNers view their maternityp ay as 'free' money, as in 'if you have a baby you get free money for 6 months'?

It is a benefit or subsidy in which the state recognises a serious and significant barrier to health, work and wellbeing, and gives support to help address that.

And loads of people on DLA will have/be taxpayers or have families etc who are taxpayers.

I'm not on DLA yet but I have previously been a tax payer, if I ever manage to find someone willing to employ a young person with gappy work experience and multiple disabilities then I shall be a taxpayer again. My DP is a tax payer, my DM is a taxpayer, my Dad was a taxpayer from the day he left school aged 13 in 1953 until he stopped work in 2005 when he retired.

Most children with disabilities will have parents who have been/are tax payers, one day they may be taxpayers themselves.

Lots of disabled people don't even get DLA, it's very hard to get. It doesn't get handed round like a bag of sweets at a kids party you know.

Fuck off Maypole me and my husband have paid taxes for over 50 years between us.

Yes, steady yourself, disabled people pay taxes too.

Also the car isnt ours. We lease it. It doesnt belong to us.

lou - surely a mercedes mpv or volvo x90 with downpayments of thousands would be more of a lifestyle choice than a necessity.

There must be cars at the cheaper end of the market which would fair just as well with a much smaller downpayment surely?

Maypole1

2 surelys in one post. bit much [embarassed]

You can get a car just for your DLA higher rate mobility allowance so in essence it is paid for. However this is the smallest car in the world

We paid a downpayment of £6k to get a car large enough to get DH's scooter in it. They also get the mobility allowance which is about £200 a month. And after 3 years we have to give the car back and start all over again (mercedes posted this on the first page)

That is why. The more expensive cars are bigger, so if you need a larger car you have to pay more.

fair dos minty. I just couldn't understand why the talk of mercedes and volvo as a means from getting from a to b when the rest of the world has to put a fmily of 5 or more in a normal people carrier thingy. I understand now.

Rabbit - my father is 50. I have 4 siblings still living at home (20, 14, 12 and 9) my parents need and MPV.

My dad uses a mobility scooter in order to get around. Being a man of 6'9 he can't use your nice and light foldaway scooter. he requires a bloody great big heavy thing.

They take months searching loads of alternatives and trying to work out which vehicles they can and can't get due to teh seat and space requirements.

Add to that the fact that my dads legs swell and are ulcerated and he also needs to ensure the driving area has a lot of space.

It isn't as simple as just chosing the prettiest car from teh list.

They currently have a Galaxy but it isn't big enough really. my brothers have to sit with no leg room at all because the seats have to be pushed so far forward in order for the scooter to go in the boot (with the rear seats folded)
But the downpayment was £7k and the vehicle that they should have got was £9k. they simply couldn't afford it.

So no, it is not always about a lifestyle choice. it is not always possible to just chose the vehicle with the smallest downpayment.

Also only certain vehicles are listed on the scheme.
You can't for example, get a Toyota previa, even though it would be ideal for my dad, because it isn't on teh scheme.

i can't believe that there are people who moan over disabled people having a car to get about

My husband has a long term deteriating disability. He had it from being born. He has worked for the last 15 years and paid taxs, is married and has kids. He uses the car to go to work to pay bills and to pay tax. He is the braves person i know. He is in pain all the time and never moans, he works to support us all as i do not work. We saved 1k to pay for a car that will fit two car seats in and has hand controls. We will now start saving again.

There is no way we could afford a car otherwise. Last year my husband work 37 hours per week and for the whole of the year earned 13k. This has to support me, one child, the house and to pay for petrol and food - well everything. He can not eran more as he is limited in what he can do and the time he has got and paid for a degree he might not be able to work.

I really hate the people who think that being disable gets you free money or free cars. If that were ture i would love it as my husband would not have to work and might live longer. Unfortantly life is not like that.

Also the reason i'm not working is so i can care for his children, do all the house work, all the shopping and cook the meals as well as look after my husband when he is here.

My grandad gets the higher rate of disability and my dad gets a new car every 3 years through it. Instead of getting the cash my dad drives my grandad around in grandads car that my dad looks after iykwim?

I am sick to the back teeth of telling my own mother (parents divorced) that my grandad doesnt get money AND a car - but only gets a car.

Some people need educating on the DLA and Mobility.

possibly that could be the case, but then again there are people in receipt of dla who have larger families, or need a higher car to get in and out of without pain etc

my son is the one who gets the dla in this family, but his disability has had repercussions on my own health, wrt my back, so in my case the ideal car would be one that had enough boot space for his wheelchair and my supermarket shop, one high enough so transferring from car to chair and vice versa, is easier for him and less strain on my back (i now have daily back pain from years of this, and have a trapped nerve atm), and one to fit all of my kids

obviously i dont have the means to pay a 6k payment so have had to do something of a compromise, but having tried out a fair few models, the xc90 would be the first choice for me

so yes and no as to whether or not certain cars are just for aesthetic purposes

i guess i could have applied to motability for a loan to get the deposit, but whilst they may agree once i have filled in the forms, to give me a loan, they wouldnt necessarily loan it for the car i wanted, but push towards something else iyswim

Until we got our Motability car for DD2 we couldn't all go out together as a family. We just couldn't fit 3 children (all in car seats) 2 adults and all the stuff we needed for a day out in our old saloon car, and couldn't afford to buy what we needed which was an MPV.

So we went out minus one adult (hard in itself as one parent could have done with the help) or only went out with friends when one of us could travel in their car.

Now we have our lovely MPV which means we can do things as a family, we can even go away for a weekend as it fits all our stuff in the boot and it's higher than an estate so it doesn't completely shag my back lifting DD2 in and out.

Unfortunately MPVs don't come cheap so every few years we have to find at least a thousand pounds to put down as the advance payment. But we are very "lucky" to have the option of a subsidised scheme such as Motability as there's no way we could afford this sort of vehicle otherwise.

Sidge - I think your story illustrates how the scheme is so important. It must be lovely for your DC now you can all go out as a family together :)

I just can't understand why some people begrudge other people that - I can't imagine being annoyed that my taxes helped to improve someone's quality of life. I just don't get the negative attitude :(