To wish that schools wouldn't reward children for things they have no control over

[dealer]

Attendance, they give out certificates for 100% attendance each half term. Ds would occasionally have a day off for illness, dd1 hasn't had a day off since reception, she's in year 4. Ds wasn't assed, dd1 has mild sn and despite the fact that I tell her that she's really lucky to be so healthy, loves getting up in assembly for the certificates and feels it's an achievement.

They've now changed it, since it wasn't 'fair' and you will now only get a certificate for most improved attendance. Dd1 wants to know how to get one of these. Not sure how you improve on 5 years 100%.

And I hate it when they award class attendance, so the poor kid who has genuine health problems or parents who aren't very good at getting them there, get highlighted as bringing the class percentage down.

Walk to school week soon. We used to walk to school all the time when I was a sahm because we live 10 mins from the school. Now though, I work as a delivery driver so it's somewhat essential to take my vehicle with me. I need to drop dd2 at nursery 4 miles away 10 minutes later now as well, since the school nursery had no room for her.

Dd2 will be in school in September, so I could in theory walk them then and then go back for the van. But that would utterly pointless since I would then drive the van straight past the school again, same polution etc, and waste 20 mins work time.

Doesn't stop dd1 waving 'walk to school' leaflets at me, and telling me she needs to earn stickers though. Pointing out great facts such as car occupants are exposed to 3 times as much pollution on the school run as walkers. Don't really understand that since they're only in the car for 2 mins.

They usually walk home, but apparently that doesn't count.

Anyway it's all arbitrary stuff that kids are supposed to be motivated to do that they can't do anything about.

Dancergirl, what I'm finding difficult to understand is how a primary aged child 'decides' whether to take time off school or not.

Perhaps you could talk me through it?

Essentially, it matters not one jot how motivated a primary aged child is not to take time off school. They do not make that decision.

"No! It's motivating them not to take time off from school for reasons other than illness."

Primary school age children are not the ones taking the decision about whether they attend school or not. Their parents are.

"These attendance rewards are not aimed at those children; they are aimed at children who take time off school for holidays, outings or other reasons."

Again, it's the parents. The child is not the one booking a holiday in term time, or arranging a trip to alton towers. It's the parents.

These awards seem very silly to me.

On another of these threads I have seen about classes winning prizes and children with conditions that mean they have absence being blamed by all their classmates for preventing them having a chance of winning. i cannot see how that can be a positive thing, in any way.

I don't think anyone who is defending it has had to comfort a sick child who wants to go to school

Yes actually I have. My middle dd had to have a day off school to rest a strained ankle at the doctor's advice. She missed the class group photo that day and was extremely disappointed and even more so when the photo came out without her in it. But it happens!

dancergirl - no it doesn't it motivates children to try and come to school when ill sos not to miss out on a certificate

The other things they give certs for you can try for, work hard at, you might get a fluke, that sort of thing.

I don't understand why children are being penalised/rewarded for the actions of their parents.

The walk to school thing is ludicrous. They'd be better off setting up walk schemes and things than doing these certs IMO

Essentially, it matters not one jot how motivated a primary aged child is not to take time off school. They do not make that decision

Sometimes they may contribute to that decision.

Parent: it's a nice day today, let's skip school and do something fun.
Child: don't want to mum, it's important to go to school

etc

It's just re-inforcing the message (to parent AND child) that regular school attendance is important. Nobody is penalising or punishing children who've been ill, that's just bad luck.

I don't understand why children are being penalised/rewarded for the actions of their parents

No? Have you never seen a child get an award for a project done largely by the parents? I have.

Aww she had a spwained ankle??? You think that compares to a child who spends their life in and out of hospital???

You're everything everyone else said, have no compassion and just plain sick.

It is down to the children a lot of the time. They tell their parent they are ill and want to stay at home and the parent says yes. if they don't say they want to stay at home (because they are being taught it is wrong to stay off school unless absolutely necessary) then the parent isnt going to keep them at home are they?

In every class there are children with parents who keep them off at the first sniffle. Those children miss out over children who's parents take a harder line. If they, and by default their parents, are being reminded that it is not ok to miss school - surely that is a good thing.

Of course an attendance award won't help with a child whose parents are already motivated and keen. But what about those children whose parents find it too much trouble to get out of bed some mornings and the children are happy to go along with it. Who is going to encourage them to make the effort to get up and get on with life when you would prefer to stay in bed? Or the child of parents who think that every little sniffle means their child is too ill for school (and we all know they exist - not talking about serious health issues). Or the child of parents who don't fancy the walk in the rain. Or the child of parents who will allow a child a day off because they don't want to have to miss break to do some homework they 'forgot'. Children will learn very quickly that it's OK to simply not bother when you don't want to.

These awards are one way of saying that actually turning up and making an effort is worthwhile.

Yeah, it's my daughter's idea to have a three day asthma attack that takes a week in hospital to wean off nebulisers/ ventolin.

using the 'children who don't win other things can win these' argument on this is nonsense - it just as likely as not to be the same children who struggle in other things who also struggle with attendance/walking to school/other issue-of-the-week.

If you want means of ensuring that everyone gets rewarded for something, there are other ways of doing it - DC's school has a 'star of the week' award for each class, awarded by the head in assembly on Friday, with citation ("X is the star of the week because he has tried really hard to sit still at story time all week") and accompanied by a large gold sticker. Of course every DC gets it at some stage, but they don't see it that way.

The child who is in and out of hospital is the minority. In today's 'fairness at school' culture the teachers will make sure they get a reward for something else.
Would you also complain that there are prizes for first place in the school relay race because one of the kids is in a wheelchair? Or prizes for spellings because one kid has dyslexia?

My DDs school doesnt even have first, second, third etc on sports day because it's all about the taking part... apparently... eurghhhhh

DD hurt her back on Tuesday (at school) they sent her home, yesterday she couldn't move when she woke up; later in the day we got to the GP prescribed painkillers (2 horly) a physio appointment & some further investigation.

Today DD was up & dressed (in tears) ready to go to school "as I don't want another red letter" she went, they tried to send her home twice but she wouldn't come.

& you say a red letter isn't a punishment? I really see it as one for DD

Before she was ill she went years with no absence; she attended with sprained ankles, broken toes, hell she even attended last year with all that stuff going on.

But when she can't go, she feels guilty; that is wrong apart from anything else I make the decisions in this house, not her

No of course it doesn't compare conduddled. You have missed the point. Children who have long-term illnesses have more to worry about then a flipping attendance certificate.

But this debate is not about children with long-term illnesses is it, although that plays a part. There are far, far fewer of those, I imagine, than children who take time off school other than for genuine reasons. Do you not agree?

oh can someone tel Lea transport please .Ds had appoinment 9..15 am was all done by 9.30 but no if he can not travel normal time in school transport then means whole day of.He had lot of apointments so lots of days of,.Any appoinment between 8am and 4.30 pm means a day of no matter how short

By public transport is at least 3 and 1/2 hrs each way so i can not take him .

But getting a 'red letter' is not the same as not getting an award.

And it is no coincidence that since we have been giving ours rewards for each half term of full attendance... neither of them have had 'poorly tummy' or 'headaches'

I'm Dyslexic and won awards for spelling.

The OP was about children who get sick regularly being penalised, so we are talking about that minority. My daughter doesn't end up in hospital for days on end anymore because she's so dosed up now but she does get ear infections (that have now burst both ear drums), tonsillitis, asthma exhaustion and general "unwellness" because of her asthma/ scarred/ weak/ immature lungs.

These awards are awarding those who are fortunate enough to have good health or parents who think it's acceptable to infect the rest of the school.

dancergirl - yes children with long-term illnesses do have more to worry about but equally that doesn't stop them worrying about attendance, asking to switch consultant clinics to be able to attend at 4.30pm even though that consultant isn't an expert in their condition or having to explain to your child that yes you did book there consultants appointment for a school holiday so they wouldn't miss school and would therefore qualify for the 100% attendance certificate but the hospital moved it to term time. You really should try having a child that has a medical condition necessitating 3 different consultant clinics who also happens to need to see another consultant for an unrelated condition and then you'd see the effect of these not really important certificates.

I don't agree with it at all. I don't think the parents of children who can't be bothered to get out of bed in the morning or don't want to walk in the rain will give a shit about a certificate.
DS was off last October for a week he had a blood disorder and was in hospital for a couple of days and then in a wheelchair at school for the following few weeks. He had a bit of a relapse and subsequent hospital appointments meant a few missed afternoons and a couple more days. On his mid-term report it stated attendance - some cause for concern, which I thought was unfair it wasn't like I kept him home without good reason.

I would like to know how best to improve attendance if you can't use such schemes. In the secondary school DS1 and DD go to they have an outstanding ofsted status BUT that is in spite of low attendance levels which are only slowly improving. They have a scheme by which attendance is marked and over 99% gets a gold certificate, over 96% is silver and over 94% is bronze (or something like that). The gold cert winners get entered in a draw for a bike every year. It shows that attendance in itself is worthwhile not just as a means to an end.

It is in a deprived ward where education hasn't generally been seen as a priority. How else would you suggest this is tackled. You could try and influence the parents but they may well never come near the place from one year to the next. The children are a captive audience - they can be influenced.

confuddled, I'm sorry to hear about your daughter. But may I ask you something: I imagine her illness impacts on her school life in ways other than attendance, sport for example. Do you then think awards for sports are unfair?

Long term illness has been a running discussion through this thread.

Do you really think when my daughter is home sick she's not thinking about being back at school and that she's not getting awards? She was devastated that she was the only one of her class that didn't get Star of the Week because she was ill! Even though they made her Worker of the Week, she still knew why she was getting it and won't acknowledge it. Star/ Worker of the week sits at the front of assembly and the head or deputy talk to them about why they got it. She refused to talk because she's upset about it.

She wants a normal life and her illness takes that away from her so YES she does care about silly things she's missing at school.

Like I said, if you've not had a sick (and I mean SICK) child then you won't understand how important normal, mundane life is to them.

I hate this too. Our school takes it further, in that whichever class gets 100% attendance gets the use of the Wii in lunch breaks, and some of the nastier contingent in the class pick on those who 'let them down.' I know this, because my dd is off a fair amount due to chronic ear infections/chest infections, as well as multiple orthodontist and dermatologist appts, and has been threatened before because 'she lost them the Wii again'

dancer, you can say it's not about those with chronic illness, but actually it is those children who suffer through it, just one more thing to cope with on top of anything else. But never mind, life's not fair.

Katy, dd has had a couple of those 'red letters' too, and I had a letter alongside summoning me in to talk to the school nurse about her 'poor attendance.' I tore it up. The school know all about where she is on a sick/appt day because I tell them.