to be OUTRAGED by this university lecturer???!!!

[Oakmaiden]

So much so that I have lost control of my punctuation???

This is the situation: I was in a lecture this morning about Inclusion in Society. We were discussing racism and multiculturalism. Towards the end of the lecture the lecturer said that she felt that multiculturalism could be taken too far, and that since world domination was a central tenet of the Muslim faith, she thinks immigration should be curbed or she is concerned that we will be "taken over" and all have to live by Islamic laws. I mean WTF??? "World Domination is the central tenet of the Muslim Faith"???

One I had picked my jaw up off the floor I did challenge her fairly firmly. She made me get up in front of the class to tell them all why I thought she was a racist she was incorrect in her assertions. Which frankly I was more than happy to do - and was rather depressed at how many of the class seemed to agree with her.

So - was I wrong to challenge. Actually, don't answer that - no I bloody wasn't. But - should I be taking this further? Should she really be teaching inclusion/sociology to would be teachers if she cannot keep her own odious opinions out of the lectures? Should I write a letter of complaint to the course leader? Or should I just keep my head down?

I never thought I would say that Norman Tebbit made me laugh.

Sorry, I was joking for effect - I didn't mean there was actually a 'thicko university'

The point being if there had been your lecturer would have fitted right in.

On a serious note is your course decently rated?

I genuinely think you should meet with the Head of the Course as that type of 'argument' is not suitable to be taught to first year Sociology students.

"BTW, I don't think RobF sounds like he has ever walked down the next street to a university, never mind attended one."
I got a 2:1 in English & Film from Sheffield Hallam, thanks very much. Not the best University around, I know, but I'm still familiar with how they work. Most of the lecturers I had had no hesitance in making their political views known to all.

Try telling the Daily Mail that, Laurie

Virgowoo - link below. Actually it turns out sharia law is already recognised and enforced in some areas!

www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/faith/article4749183.ece

RobF-of course multiculturism is right, the world wouldn't be what it is without it. Or is your take on multiculturism that it was ok for white Europeans to do what they wanted wherever they wanted to but lets keep the immigrants out of the UK (unless they are serving food).

HHLimbo no, I am not islamic.

And I am aware that some islamic groups have said they want Islamic laws in Britain. But I don't think the aims and value of a religion should be based on the wants/demands of a vocal group of "extremists", for want of a better word. Most religions have their extreme groups, and they are all probably equally unreasonable. That doesn't change the fact that the vast majority of people of any religion are just well meaning PEOPLE. And it doesn't make them likely to actually succeed in taking over the country, imposing their own laws and making all women second class citizens (which is a concern I have heard voiced)...

I can believe this was a set-up too.

When I did my degree more than one lecturer said something outrageous to get a response from a quiet class.

Depending on the details of what she was saying, it could be a valid (if unapalatable pov too)

Maybe you could ask for a meeting with her in office hours. Say that you weren't sure what she was trying to say in that lecture. If she was making a genuine point it is worth making sure you understand it properly so you can line up your evidence against it rather than shutting her down before it starts IYWSIM.

oakmaiden - as a teacher I find it really sad that you feel that way, that teachers feel they must conform to some set of unwritten rules. It's no wonder that so many NQTs are more like ciphers than real people. Unable to capture the children's attention as all they do is regurgitate lesson objectives, plenaries and whatever shite the govt has most recently come up with. Teachers who can't work out how not to be socially unacceptable without being taught, have no business being in the classroom IMO. Fewer lectures on diversity and more on practical strategies may mean we actually got decent teachers.

Birds - have you ever been to France?

Laurie- i think that degree level students can cope with it if it is appropriate at all.

This is really bad, especially for women

"the estate of a Midlands man was divided between three daughters and two sons.
The judges on the panel gave the sons twice as much as the daughters, in accordance with sharia. Had the family gone to a normal British court, the daughters would have got equal amounts."

and worse, they have used sharia to rule on domestic violence cases
"In the six cases of domestic violence, Siddiqi said the judges ordered the husbands to take anger management classes and mentoring from community elders. There was no further punishment." (they remained living together)

The trouble with her airing her 'opinion' in this context is that she has taken an element of the Islamic religion and twisted it, either through ignorance or bigotry, to make it sound something more sinister. .

I only have a basic understanding of this so am happy to be corrected if wrong:

The concept of 'Jihad' in Islam is that one should carry out every part of one's life in the knowledge of God, and always seek to promote his place on earth. This includes the personal discipline of following the Qu'ran and also encouraging others to do the same.

So yes, a Muslim who holds strong beliefs will want, as an ideal, for everyone to convert to Islam. But that does not mean s/he seeks these means by forceful means, as the word 'domination' could easily be seen to apply.

Also, many Christians would also like for the whole world to be Christian, and for many denominations prostheletising is an essential comand of the faith.

OP- why don't you prepare a short essay presenting some research into these religious concepts, and ask your lecturer to allow you to present it as a discussion piece to correct the misapprehension the class was left with? If s/he refuses, then it will be clear that it was bigotry not ignorance at play, and you should take it further.

birdsgottafly - there is no "of course" about it. Multiculturalism is a particular type of set up, some people think it's great some think it is horrendous.

Laurie........ at first I thought you were being ironic and then it seemed too 'bald'.

You'd never know I worked on literature, eh....

NT-yes if you read my posts my view is balanced. Valid points on both sides. But don't dress up anti islam as anti multiculturism, multiculturism has been happening for centuries. I personally don't agree with some of the countries being accepted into the EU that have been but for valid reasons not blind racism.

londonone it seems to be in most teaching job specs I have seen. If one doesn't hold a genuine belief in the value of multiculturalism (which I do, actually - but clearly many of my fellow students seem not to) then I think that they will at least need to learn to be circumspect about their beliefs.

And I don't think the way the lecturer presented her argument did anything except give validation to some fairly intolerant views.

I still think I'm right. It was a lecture on Social Inclusion. They simply wouldn't give the job of lecturing people about social inclusion to a card-carrying racist. If she genuninely was islamophobic it would have come up long before now. 10-1 when the OP complains they are told that it was a deliberate device to shake students out of their slumbers and that she was the only one that rose to the challenge.

There's nothing wrong with intolerance. People should not have to pretend to "tolerate" things that they think are wrong. Forced "tolerance" is one of the main reasons that this country is in the bad state it is in.

Don't want to do anymore hijacking of the original topic, but I think this is a key phrase in that article HHLimbo

"Under the act, the sharia courts are classified as arbitration tribunals. The rulings of arbitration tribunals are binding in law, provided that both parties in the dispute agree to give it the power to rule on their case."

The daughters in that case still had the power to refuse and settle the dispute in a British court of law.

"The daughters in that case still had the power to refuse and settle the dispute in a British court of law."
Yeah, right. And be ostracized by the society they have lived in all their lives. And quite possibly face attacks for doing so.

I'm not dressing it up, just trying to see some justification for her comment - although it's impossible to judge.

I walked out of a marketing lecture once. We were discussing brands and the lecturer made a negative comment about working class people, satellite dishes and fake designer gear. Most people laughed but it was out of order. I walked out but wish I complained. You should.

If that were the case Chil, and I don't actually think it was, then I think it backfired spectacularly.

I left the lecture feeling almost everyone else was fine with the lecturers viewpoint.

"Laurie- i think that degree level students can cope with it if it is appropriate at all".

No, no - it's not what the lecturer is saying that's inappropriate (people can decide whether to agree with opinion if it's presented to them as opinion) - it's the poorly constructed argument that is the problem.

In first year at university the lecturers are supposed to be teaching how to construct arguments. This is not teaching someone how to do that - it is too poorly constructed.

The quality of your teaching OP as you have presented it is dreadful and needs to be challenged.

Your own arguments OP are better constructed than your lecturers.