or is prejudice against America considered OK by most of mumsnet?

[VajazzHands]

Comments about America on mumsnet, really ridiculous comments (basically that all Americans, are fat, stupid, god botherers bent on taking over the world) seem to be largely ignored and accepted as fact in a way that comments about any other country never would.

Blatant sexism, racism, xenophobia, disablism would never be tolerated on MN in any other circumstance. Why do people let it go about Americans?

I agree that things are getting worse in UK, especially with tory (corporate exploitation) policies.

Its true that things ARE worse in America, that is why it is important to criticize them, and not look up to them nor follow their example.

HHLimbo I'm still not sure why things are worse in America, maybe just different?

Would it also be fair to say that the British government does not serve its people because the Prime Minister is not directly elected? Or is that ok because people in the UK realise it?

I don't get it, either, CA. I give up. Every apartment I rented there, even a studio in a converted Victorian house, offered a far better standard of plumbing than any I've had here, for example. So, plumbing can be worse here.

My wages were higher there, and I got to keep more of the money, so financially it could be worse here.

All depends.

Yes, every visitor we've had from the US has had a tour of our plumbing and they are amazed! Never mind the British Museum, have you seen this boiler?

Although, it's now getting to the point that when I go home I get a little scared by the toilets, they are just so big....

I think George W Bush did a lot of damage for Americans. People from outside the US simply could not respect him at all. And lets face it the competition was stiff for moronic leaders-that means you Tony! But George....really??! Twice !!
America is like every other country in the world. Personalities across the board. So it is unfair to label them as any "type" of person.
But the leader of a country does,I think,play a role in defining how other countries think of you.
So if you think of the leader of a country,does it colour what you think of the people in that country? It does a bit for me. Maybe that is something I need to work on.

Cali - please look at links on previous page.

Just a small selection:
Affordability and availability of healthcare. (Leading cause of bankrupcy in the US)
Workers rights (even Amnesty international has spoken out on this in the US)
Womens rights
Obesity
Crime
etc.

I think its very important that people read about these things and educate themselves on things that are important to them. So concentrate on your plumbing if you like, expat :)

40 % of Americans believe in creationism

Alabama Votes to Call Evolution Controversial

I really don't want to row about creationists. I'm just saying, there are reasons people make these generalisations.

You've lived in the US for 20 years and never met one? I lived there for 35 years and ran into plenty. It's anecdotal for both of us. But polls show plenty of support for it (it goes up to 70 % if you include 'god had some role in the process').

I honestly don't think people who make generalisations about Americans being really religious or ignorant, honestly believe that every single American is religious and ignorant. They're saying a lot are, or many are, or our society is. That's what generalisations are.

I don't think it's particularly helpful, but it just doesn't bother me. I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that.

Sorry that was for Madam

HHLimbo

I'm certainly not flying the "America-Fuck Yeah" flag, and you know how much we love flags. You can criticize certain policies- like your example of collective bargaining rights without drawing the general conclusion that things are worse in America. Yes, public sector employees in certain states of America may have their rights curtailed. And, I believe it's been said that women will bear the brunt of recent government cuts in the UK. Both of these things are shitty.

But, I guess when you say that things in America are worse, I'm wondering worse than what or where?

Madam, what you believe is 'intelligent design', which is that extra 30 % I mentioned.

40 % of Americans believe God created the Earth exactly as the Bible says.

I don't have a huge problem with intelligent design (although I don't think it should be taught in science class... maybe philosophy classes) but I find it disturbing that so many Americans still believe in strict creationism.

I think the idea of God sneaking around hiding dinosaur bones is hilarious! I think there's also some crazy explanation of how the Grand Canyon could appear in a couple thousand years, like God made the river run super fast or something.

And, regarding healthcare, you can put the spin on that here, with the postcode lottery and no funding for certain drugs, Tories abolishing wait lists, spiralling maternal death rates, or increasing child poverty/gap between the rich and poor, classism, all sorts of things.

Someone in Shettleston would probably have a worse life is comparably poor in Bangladesh, but may have a better one in Massachussetts.

So I think california asks a reasonable question, 'Worse that what and where?'

Some things are worse here, other things are better. Some things are better there and worse here.

Its not one thing, its worse across the board. In the early 90s I was quite interested in living in the US, but not now. It just seems too big a risk. It had great potential but has really taken a wrong turn and gone down the pan.

Healthcare - Americans pay double what we pay in the UK, with worse outcomes, and its not even universal.

So it is not a prejudice, OP, it is in fact a valid and important observation.

HHLimbo It is not true that Americans pay double for healthcare compared to the UK. If you compare the level of care provided we actually pay less. A hip replacement here in New Jersey costs less than a hip replacement on bupa and my father is flying over to have the work done here as he can't wait another two years for treatment.

I have found the care I have received during my pregnancy to be excellent. My appointments have all been before work (obn able to see me at 7am) and they are doing a great job of looking after me. I was shocked to learn that NCT classes are GBP200. I am paying $150 for all of my baby care, birth, first aid and breastfeeding classes.

The outcomes here are nearly always better from what I have seen and experienced. If you need to see a doctor or other medical professional appointments are readily available. My complaint with the healthcare system is that Obama should have not have pushed through the changes that he did. It was rushed and there are many parts to it that are not working. It is wrong that many people in high cost areas are going to end up being taxed on their healthcare benefits they receive from their employer. Often, as in our case, salary increases were sacrificed to allow for better healthcare coverage. A 35% tax rate is also very wrong. We currently pay around 9.5% in federal tax and 2.5% in state tax. It is not fair that we then pay 35% on the healthcare premiums over $21k a year.

I think the double quote is regarding the tax amount spent per person.

Just reading through this and got to this:

"She is from Dudley - think VERY BROAD brummy accent, one that most brits would think sounds the opposite of the queen."

Ouch! That contradicts the rest of the post. She's either from Dudley or a Brummy, you can't be both. If she's from Dudley she has a "very broad Black Country" accent, so obviously you're not as good at recognising accents as you think, even in friends! Around here we have Birmingham (with several accents just within Birmingham, it used to be you could tell the road people lived on from their accent but people move more now) Black Country, Wolverhamptom, West Brom, Sandwell, Walsall etc all with different accents.

HHLimbo So I guess the US isn't for you. That's cool. Different strokes for different folks and all that.

A discussion of the complexities of US health care is great. However, I'm wondering if it was general comments like Americans are all fat, or even America is worse (than what we still don't know) was what the OP was referring to. But to suggest that it's ok to make rude comments about Americans willy-nilly because you don't like their policies is a little out of line.

Anti-Americanism really pisses me off and I challenge it whenever I see it. I think it really started when Bush 2 got in. It then became fashionable and never went away. Some people think they're being really superior and cool by bashing the Yanks but it's really quite sad. Nobody in Britain has anything to feel superior to the Americans about. Britain as a whole is insecure about its place in the world so some people want to bash the top dog to make themselves feel better.

In addition I genuinely believe there's a touch of anti-semitism mixed in. Many people believe the US is under the thumb of Israel and thus much of the criticism is really about that.

I visited New York a few years ago and I was more welcomed there and treated better than I have been during outings to some parts of Britain.