Need URGENT advice !!

[NeedAdviceASAP]

Is anybody around at the moment, really need someone to help me decided how to act on a really urgent situation.

Have name changed for privacy reasons to those involved.

Have a close friend with SERIOUS PND depression at the moment and have been trying to help / support her over the last few weeks. She often days that she hates her DS because she wanted a girl, thinks he is ugly because he has a birthmark, hates his red hair because he looks like his dad etc.

Things have got worse and worse and most days when I go round the baby is alone upstairs and crying. She isn't feeding him regularly or changing him and as a result he has terrible nappy rash at the minute. She says she can't bear to hold him.

I am helping out as much as I can and go to see her at least 3-4 times a day to make sure baby is sorted, he also has been coming to sleep at mine once a week (will be increasing to 2 nights) as she has started drinking pretty heavilly at night and dosn't always wake up for the baby's night feeds.

Anyway am currently chatting to her on MSN and she has just admitted to me that a) she got really angry the other day and smacked the baby (15 weeks old) and b) she has seriously thought about killing him and herself !!

I don't think she will honestly do something like that but like I said it's really bad at the moment and I don't want to dis-regard what seems like a plea for help.

Am talking to her now still, what the hell do I do / say!!

I feel awful but wondering if I should get SS involved?
She would know it was me and it would destroy our friendship but i'm so worried about her DS.

Oh that poor poor little baby. No chance you could send him to me in America? I'd love every red hair on his little head. :(

I'm so glad the baby is safe with you- the older son is at his Dad's tonight I assume? I would call 999. I would just explain the situation as best as you can possibly can and say you are worried that she'll hurt herself. Then I'd call SS in the morning and do not let them jerk you around. Save all her MSN messages so she can't say you're exaggerating.

I had PND (not like what your friend has, I never wanted to to hurt DS and always cared for him but I was desperately unhappy) and it's an awful thing to live with. She needs help.

Bless you for being so good to the little one, and your mom for coming over.

And I'd kick her "boyfriend" square in the junk next time you see him, immature as that would be.

I'm very bothered by what you said "most mothers with PND" do and don't do.

What if she is not one of those "most mothers"?

How will you feel if she does one of the things "most mothers" don't do?

You posted asking for urgent advice. You're being given excellent advice. I hope you follow some of it.
Your friend's situation is very worrying.

Highness - Please do not think I am dis-regarding what she has said because 'most' mother's don't go that far. I was responding to a point made by a previous poster about having her son adopted.

I will be following the advice given and making sure this gets sorted, she has been going rapidly downhill for a while now and it's got to the point where she needs someone there 24/7. There is no way I can do that with my own children.

Like I explained earlier we have plans in terms of medication now and will be seriously looking into the mother and baby unit's also, sound ideal for her.

Oh and yes her older child is with his dad tonight, right through until Thurday now so gives us a few days to make some more long term plans and get the professionals involved.

What an awful situation. Well done for getting the baby out. I think ringing the out of hours GP service might be an idea at this point and explain the situation. I don't know but would guess there will be someone on duty locally from the community psychiatric team who can deal with a mental health crisis and can go out to her and get her through tonight. They might have knowledge of the situation locally with the mother and baby units and can start the ball rolling on this.

Your firned has undoubtedly had a sh*t time, young baby, father abandoned them... I do think it's good that she seems to be open and honest with you anout these innermost feelings, that's something you can work with. If she is known to have depression - and has told you so - then can you encourage her to contact her GP / CPN team / HV? Alternately you can contact them yourself with your concerns. They won't tell you anything but it may put wheels in motion.

Without trying to scaremonger, it sounds like postpartum psychosis is possible. Read the famous cases listed on wiki:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerperal_psychosis

You sound like a brilliant friend. So pleased to hear that yr friends baby is safe with you. And that you are seeking 24/7 care for her. Really hope that this will be ASAP.

Do you know what is keeping your severely depressed friend alive at the moment? How do you think she will react to being free of the responsibility of caring for her baby?

I STILL think that you need to call on professional help now as yr friend seems to be at high risk of suicide. I really wouldn't say this if I didn't believe it to be true and hadn't seen this sort of situation end badly before.

She probably needs to have someone staying with her to keep her safe right now.

Of course this is yr choice.

CheerfulYank - I'll hold the guy, you kick him in the nuts [bugrin].
And then we'll swap, ok?

OP, I feel like I should apologize. I'm not trying to give you a hard time. I realize my post looks like that was my intent and it really isn't, so, I'm sorry. You're being an absolutely amazing friend, far beyond what most people would be able or willing to do.
I'm just really worried for your friend, from a personal experience when what someone said was being dismissed because "that's now what most people do".
But that's how it is, any advice that anyone gives is always coloured by their experience.
However, that doesn't give me or anyone the right to rag on you, you're the one in the situation, we're just spectators.

not
not "now"
Bloody iPhone.

You are possily the most incredible friend in the world. Call social services because she needs help - she knows this, hence the antidepressants.

Explain that while you are happy to help, the situation is developing, and you can't do everything - you have your own life afterall. Perhaps you could be there when the SS come round?

I second cheerfulyank on kicking boyf in the nuts.

Good luck, OP , and good luck to your friend and the poor little boy. They're lucky to have you!

What a horrible situation poor baby.

But what a lovely friend you are needadvice

Hope you manage to organise some help for your friend today.

There should have been a there after needadvice. Otherwise it reads like I'm being sarcastic (which I'm definatley not)

Oh this is terrible, the poor woman and her children. Can you phone your health centre first thing and ask to speak to a HV urgently? They will get access to SS and other support I think? This is just dreadful.

Go and talk to her GP this morning- he/she needs to know how serious this is and arrange inpatient care for her TODAY.

Take baby and tell her you'll hand it back as soon as she's settled in that inpatient facility.

Lastly call her family - my sister lives at the other end of the country but my Mum & I'd be on the first train in an instant and FURIOUS if someone contacted Social Services ( who may take the child permanently with no recourse!) We'd be there and looking after that child same day, and providing the right sort of emotional & practical longterm support (e.g you WILL get inpatient treatment) but obviously couldn't do that if we didn't know the situation until after the fact. You can hand the baby over to her family when they arrive.

It may be she needs to be moved back to whence she came from near her family and support network once this crisis is over and her family can help with that.

PND is very serious if it's this bad but SS aren't always the answer, they may make the situation 10X worse. It has been known for seriously ill Mums to kill the child rather than see them go into care. At this age the babe would be a prime candidate to help them meet the forced adoption targets. PND is treatable and with the right MEDICAL support she could go on to be the best Mum ever for 18 years after a few months treatment.

If you know her boyfriend - ring him and tell him she's ill and that you are reporting him to the authorities for neglect and child abandonment unless he get gets his arse round to care for HIS child right now! (dunno if he could be charged but new bint or not he has a moral fucking responsibility to the life HE created!).

Lastly - can I thank you for being such a wonderful friend to her so far? If more people were like you the child abuse/neglect statistics would be so much lower. It's rare to find someone and basically kind and decent as you are being to her.

Oooh yes, do what bochead said re the boyfriend. Much more helpful than a boot to the junk, really.

This is awful, I hope you get your friend the help she and her DC so desperately and obviously need. drag her to the GP and camp out in his/her office until they do something constructive, what ever you do please don't let her go in on her own, she might try and make out things are going far better than they really are. she needs help and the only way to get it is to be brutaly honest with your friend and the mental nealth support workers and her GP. don't let them fob you off, if your not comfortable talking about your concerns in front of your friend, for fear of upseting her further, write them on a piece of paper and hand it to the GP.

I think you should contact a doctor or something for help.

From what it sounds like to me, you are trying your best but she just isn't getting enough help. The baby's father is probably causing her more stress due to his previous and/or current behavior.

I agree with Bochead. Help her overcome this, and I know it's difficult, but if she had her baby taken away from her - considering the fact she wanted the baby in the first place and has the ability to be a good mother - it would probably cause her huge distress during her try to overcome the depression.

However, she needs help urgently as she is not herself right now, and I hate to say it but because she hasn't been receiving suitable professional support and advice, the baby is in danger. I'd call the mental health crisis team and insist a mental health professional sees and helps her.

You sound like an amazing friend, I hope she receives the help she needs ASAP.

What are forced adoption targets boc ?

bochead, I would be slightly worried if the father is put on the spot like that, he would probably be quite happy to sign the baby up for adoption by ss? he obviously doesn't want to be involved, I'm not saying he would but he's made it clear he doesn't seem to give a shit really :( also would you want someone who clearly doesn't want this child (the father) having any kind of involvement into looking after it at this moment? is it not out of the frying pan into the fire so to speak?

I don't really know, but could the father do that? put baby, up for adoption if mum is mentally incapacitated with severe pnd? maybe someone else would have a better idea.

Phone 999 now.

I know its tough but you need to tell SS urgently and impress on them how urgent it is, you have gone above and beyond as a friend but the child needs to be away from her If she doesnt carry out her threat the child will probably die of abuse/neglect anyway.

Please let us know what happens

I'm sorry to say but you must not leave the baby in her care until she gets help. You can't risk it for her or baby. The SS can help! They are not horrible people intent on taking the baby away they will help them both. You are a great friend and when she is better she will totally understand your actions

I hope you and your friend both got some sleep last night. Have you spoken to her this morning? Don't be fobbed off by anyone at the Doctors - you need an emergency appointment.

In your situation I would see how your friend feels about you looking after the baby for a while and bringing him around for as many feeds as you can - but if she wants to feed him in the night, she has to stay at yours. Mixed feeding wont hurt him. I would try not to let the breastfeeding go by the by as I know it has really helped a couple of friends of mine who suffered from PND to stay engaged with the baby, they both felt they were doing something right at least (I'm not saying it's wrong to ff, not at all, I'm just saying how they felt). I would deal with it with her, because I wouldn't trust SS not to take the baby away (especially as you are a single mother to 4 children they might think you couldn't cope with another one). [Birdsgottafly is a SW and she would tell me off for that comment].

Can the older DS's Dad do a bit more to help her out? Clearly he's an ex, but he's still the Dad of their son and it's in his best interest to get her sorted out as well (well, unless he's angling for 100% 'custody' of his son?!).

Best of luck x