To be Disturbed by this woman in a Burka? ......

[Gingefringe]

I saw a very strange event in Debenhams make-up counter this week-end which on reflection, I found very disturbing.
A woman in a full burka (including her eyes covered in thin veil) came up to the make-up counter with a man (presumably DH). The man then proceeded to ask about foundation for the woman and had a conversation with the sales assistant which rarely included the woman at all (apart from trying on a sample colour on her hand).
I felt so sorry for the poor woman - not only to be forced to wear this ridiculous veil but she wasn't allowed even to chose her own make-up!
I did give the man my best evil looks but he didn't seem to notice - perhaps because I was a woman!! I was too cowardly to say anything.

On the day that France bans the burka I wonder whether you would have said anything?

and its not good for women in general to cover their bodies for years from head to toe without exposure to sunlight , because of this they lack Vitamin D and develop osteoporosis.

Yes I 100% support the French government.

If they don't like it they can go and live in a country that does like it.

When in Rome do as the Romans do.

mini skirts v burkas [ silly little girl comparison with no arguement.]

yes - those poor nuns :) and Hasidic Jewish women

i am a guardian reading charity worker - doesnt mean i read DM if i disagree with you. thats very patronisiing

so if I am FRENCH and MUSLIM and I don't like it I should leave the country I was born in - well lets lay on trains - they could stop at 'work camps' al;ong the way - that'll solve the problem :)

gordy - It is not a "belief". State and religion are separate in France. That is what secular means.

And burqa ban is not about not showing off religious beliefs, otherwise the headscarf (hijab) would be banned, too.

I wish you would stop smiling and grinning. Are you drunk?

Viewing all Muslim women as oppressed little flowers who need saving is also very patronising :)

No Cote I do not have a problem with english...but as I said are you comparing what someone eats (other humans)with what someone wears?...is cannibalism exceptable anywhere?..is what you wear killing someone for your eating pleasure?..no...you are controlling someone and forcing more women into situation where they cannot leave their homes because you will be offended by their dress

If you need to start being insulting Cote you are loosing the debate - I understand what secular means but unlike England the French Gov has a more legally binding definition :) :) :) :)

who is doing that gordy?
i never said all muslim women

Computermouse, not everyone has chosen to ignore her posts. I found them very interesting, and its good to hear a view point from the very people who ARE affected by this ban.

so if I am FRENCH and MUSLIM and I don't like it I should leave the country I was born in

Do what you like but if you break the law expect to be arrested, or have some respect for the country you were born in.

what bothers me about the veil or burkha - it seems to me a bit of one-up manship about how devout or pious a woman is and i still belieive that there is underlying pressure on these wives and daughters to show the world how religious and worthy they are by wearing the burqua
In wearing the veil and giving us the sense of seperating from the rest of society it puts pressure on other muslims, that, to be a good wife or a modest women /mother etc they must cover up . Suggesting to muslim women who don't cover up, they are not as good ...
I do not believe that every burqua wearer is forced or opressed but the burqua wearing women here tonight who are defending it must accept that there are some women who are being forced and opresssed into wearing it in our society - and this goes on and is, wrong .

gordy - There is only one definition for the word "secular". UK is not a secular country. France is a secular country.

Ha ha ha.

which brings me back to me 'pathetic' point - would you blindly follow every law in the UK :) if so - I find that sad and scary and as someone has pointed out I am glad our History is full of people who did challenge 'the law' :)

the UK is not secular by law but it IS secular - there is freedom of religious expression and secular education and laws - we are not governed by any one religion :)

But most people do follow the law in the uk. They must do or people in my street would be getting arrested all the time.

What is your point?

Yes because your religious beliefs are controlled by the government?...what you feel within yourself as a person of a particular religion suddenly disappears because of a rule of law?...I say again law cannot legislate love or respect..is the country you live in your controller?..if thats the case well... we all should be worried...

My point is 'The Law' isn't always right or fair or morivated by anything but political belief - laws are passed that serve POLITICAL purpose not just to stop crime - and they should always be questioned never blindy accepted :)

Mumcentreplus - Read what I wrote. I gave cannibalism as an example of a practice society considers abhorrent.

Yes, there are places on earth where cannibalism is accepted and even practiced. No, cannibalism doesn't mean they murder people before eating them.

Maybe I should have given an example that would be easier to understand

If you decide to be a nudist tomorrow, you will have to move to a place where that practice is accepted if you want to go around naked all the time, and no amount of tantrum a la "But you can't tell me what to wear!" is going to change that.

gordy - You clearly don't know what the word "secular" means. Look it up.