MIL obsessed with whether DS is warm enough - went too far yesterday

[BigGingerCat]

Sorry for another attack on MILs, but if it was my own mother I would have sorted this out by now by having a proper go at her. But I have been trying to follow the diplomatic route to preserve relations. I want your opinions because I am exhausted and have PND and chronic insomnia and I'm not sure whether I am getting in a state over nothing.

I must have been challenged at least 30 times since DS was born six months ago over whether he is warm enough, whether I should be warming his bottles up more or whether I should be warming up his food (currently just baby rice or porridge or sachets of stuff). I am not an idiot, I know how to dress my son appropriately for the weather and how to feed him (my DH and I are completely aligned and my mum and Dad have never mentioned anything). Once she had the gall to say "I'm sorry, I'm going to have to overrule you" (WTF???) in front of my dad over something to do with a hat I think.

She was looking after him all afternoon yesterday as I went into work and was great. I didn't think she would have to do bedtime routine but neither DH or I could get back in time. Apparently DH rang her and told her not to bother putting him in his gro-bag as the nursery gets very warm. (We are going to sort this out this weekend with a fan. Can't open the window because of the blackout blind and I'm not sure in the summer months it would really be enough to keep the temperature at 20 or below. So we make the necessary adjustments to his clothes, normally putting him in just one layer)

So I got back at 6.30 and found that, with the Gro-Egg thermometer in the room showing 22 degrees (she claimed she didn't see it/didn't know what it was - impossible) he was in a vest, babygro and covered in a bloody blanket. It was a cellular blanket fortunately and she had only put it over his waist and below allegedly. But she knows he is a restless baby and when I went up to check on him he had pulled it over his head. She came up with me to "help" check on him. I was FURIOUS but said "oh dear, these babies eh, look, he's pulled it right over him. We need to uncover him a bit I think, the temperature is 22 and it's really dangerous as they can overheat if they get too warm." (OR FUCKING SUFFOCATE....) She sighed and said ok and then made a move to leave (we parted politely with a hug and a kiss as usual).

I also discovered she had challenged my DH AGAIN on the subject of us not having a cot bumper, even though I have told her time and time again about the SIDS risk they can pose. She does not respect my authority on anything and it is really upsetting me. DH is going to talk to her on the specific issue of yesterday this weekend. But AIBU/over-sensitive?

Just wanted to add my opinion

we are in spain and in the summer the day temp hits 50 degrees and nights very rarely drop below 35, we have no air con.

Kids over here (inc my dd) are still dressed in vest, long sleve tops, cardigan, trousers, long socks, coat (for out side) under atleast one duvet at night and a blanket and it was 28 yesterday!

But the thing is it is so much hotter in the summer that the body feels the cold so much more particulalry in childredn borne here.

But the UK is different and your baby your rules (as long as doing no harm).

My mum is simlar and felt that she had (has the right) to over rule me as I am inexperienced. But she will if shouted at do at my bidding on most things. But i have had to get dad (bless him) to have a word (yell) at her.

You must be feeling worse with pnd on top as I suspect you really need people to say things like, oh thats great, you are doing a bril job, I would never have thought of doing it that way, god things have changed for the better from my day, thank god that have worked out things to avoid for sids, I wish we new that when you were are baby!

She is porbably thinking that she is doing the right thing, have DP say a word, then use phases like.

Thanks for your input we are doing it this way
I know but they used to think the wordl was flat too.
You can´t over rule me I am the mum.
Oh that would be so pretty it is a shame that they are dangerous.
We we do it this way, but thanks for the offer
Please don´t do that that doctors would be horrified
Oh well thinking had changed these day´s
I can´t wait for my turn at being a GM it will great to see how things have changed.
Look, I will not ask again don´t do that we don´t like it.

Try and relax and remember that you are mum, she is just jelous of the bang up job you are doing and trying to make you feel you need her.

Hope that you are getting some help for the pnd?

Biggingercat YANBU!!! how DARE she say "i'm sorry, but i'll have to over rule you`" if my MIL, my own mum or my aunt (my 2nd mum) ever said this to me i would flip. i'm pretty sure none of them would have the audacity to say something like this.

Littlereddragon is spot on, you are not her trainee, he is YOUR son.

it's not worth causing murder over but you need to get DH to have a word, and just explain that you have a certain way of doing things, you really appreciate the advice but you are going to stick with your rules for your son.

It just makes her 30 years out of date.

or alternatively someone with years of hands on experience, some of which must have been successful as she produced the OPs husband

vanwoman, I know that is harsh but I think that has to be said to her - to make her realize that she shouldn't think of herself as the teacher and the OP as her student. I do realize some of her advice will be good, but she is clearly seeing her experience not as potentially helpful and useful, but as something that in some way qualifies her to overrule the OP. Those two things are quite different and I'm sure if she were only trying to be helpful the OP would be getting a much more varied response.

Who´d be a MIL eh?

What I don´t get is why when MILs have "form" for not doing things the required way, they are still asked to look after baby.

YANBU for feeling undermined - she is being thoughtless and disrespectful in some areas and maybe needs some written info passed her way regarding cot bumpers, SIDS etc.

However don't get too hung up on temperatures and bedding - 22 isn't terribly hot and by 6 months a baby is better at regulating it's temperature to some degree. Generally speaking a baby needs one more layer than an adult. Also go by how they look and feel, not just what a room thermometer says - if the baby is pink and sweaty then take a layer off.

YANBU. I hate this, my mother and DH's gran do his ALL the time. My mother is constantly saying things like "do you think she is warm enough?" "I think you have given her too much food she will never eat it all" "Do you think that is the right thing to do?" "You are not taking her out with no coat are you?!!" etc etc.....as if im a bloody idiot that doesn't know how much food my baby will eat or how to dress her and make sure she is warm enough!

One time when DD1 was 12 weeks old i put her outside in her pram to nap. It was a lovely day. DD struggled to get to sleep as it was so light outside so i draped a cellular blacket over the pram (the hood was up) and left a big gap either side of the hood so it was perfectly safe and just made the pram a little darker. Well DH's gran came running in saying the blanket is over the pram. I said i know and explained why. I went out to DD and found the blanket off her so i put it back on. Over the next 2 hours DH's gran and i took turns to go out there and cover/uncover DD in the pram She kept saying DD won't be able to breathe and despite taking gran out and showing her the bloody great gaps either side and the fact it was a cellular blanket with holes, she still kept taking it off which really pissed me off!!

Hate being made to feel like a little girl who knows nothing and is a danger to her kids, just because my mother and his Gran have had kids themselves means they know everything and are always right apparently...

Rant over :)

diddl - MIL is normally pretty good, and extremely competent. I do like her. But annoying, undermining and I would venture in this instance her undermining could have been potentially dangerous.

Starynightsky - I love some of your comebacks, thank you so much!

Well tbh, I don´t think that she did undermine you.

As requested, she didn´t use the "gro-bag", but a very thin blanket.

Good job I´m not a MIL/GP-you´d probably have got home to find baby still up at 6.30

I am extremely against MILs.....(well, my own, and many of the ones I hear about on here) but tbh, if you're using her as a free babysitting service then you have to accept she's going to do things which are out of your jurisdiction.
Or pay someone to have Junior.
I think you need to try and stop sweating (no pun intended) the small stuff as well tbh, chuck the egg thing away (am in Italy, never had a room thermometer) and try and relax a bit more.
If her putting an extra cover on your baby has you in this state, you need to rethink your childcare.

Also I thought that the point of cellular blankets was that baby won´t overheat/suffocate/choke.

Had he actually pulled it over his head of wriggled down underneath?

If the latter then maybe he wasn´t "feet to foot" in the cot & maybe she doesn´t know about this?

Yes, he'd pulled it over his head.. She has been told about feet to foot several times and completely ignores us.

She asks to come over and it is no inconvenience to her, she was glad to have him for longer to be honest.

DH said no grobag, as he did not need covers. She ignored this too.

Yes, the cellular blanket was better than a traditional one, which wasn't to hand thankfully, but still why on earth would anyone think this was necessary in a room of 22 degrees, whether they had been told about it or not?

I did tell her if she didn't want to do bedtime routine I would be happy if she kept him up but would leave it to her judgement, she chose to do it.

I think there is a tendancy to over dress babies. I've had quite a few people tell me DD wasn't wearing enough, was cold etc when she was a baby - she was always toasty and warm and snuggly, but not overwrapped or over dressed IMO. And guess what, I'm her Mum so I will make the call thanks. But I was never too bothered about the comments as it's no hassle to check and if she was cold, and I had made a mistake well I'd rather know.

I do admit to looking a little at the way some babies are OVER dressed myself though. Poor little mites look ready to combust!

As for the overrule comment - OMG!!

Your MIL is only around 10 years older than myself so she doesn't have as much excuse as my mother had for coming out with this sort of thing - she too, was always on at me to wrap my son up and keep him warm. Largely I think the mismatch stems from houses being so much warmer today than in the past. Central heating was still pretty rare when I (and your MIL) was small, all the 'traditional' thoughts on keeping warm were about babies in draughty houses with coal fires. And her 'advice' is rooted in that background I fear.

I do think you need to take a slightly different tack with her though. "well this is what we do, but do what you think, you know what you're doing obviously!" is just a bit too accommodating - please try to replace with "this is the current guidance, how was it done in the past?" or some such phrasing. Depersonalise it, it's not about what she did but about then.

And as for "over-ruling" you - pull her up sharpish if she tries that one again - a skeptical look and a snort might do the trick, if not be blunt. I know you're trying to keep the relationship sweet, but even best friends can snarl at each other occassionally!

Right, here's my view on it.

Your MIL sounds a bit of a nightmare - the "overrule" thing for a start, arghrr.

I would say if she truly believed he would need those layers then if she is the one putting him down, she should be able to do that. Its not fair to ask someone to put your child to bed but put them to bed in a fashion that that person believes will have them cold. Its daunting enough settling someone else's baby off to sleep without having to do it their very specific way when you are not being paid, and when you have plenty of experience with babies yourself. Its not like she put him down swaddled in fleece, after all.

On that note - 22 degree nursery, vest and babygrow with cellular blanket, which tends to move and get kicked off anyway...its not excessive. I know there are guidelines about what is the ideal nursery temperature, but honestly the temperature will drop during the night a bit anyway and even if it doesn't, the baby's body temperature will (in the early hours of the morning) and your MIL probably felt he would wake cold.

I think to an extent if you want your MIL to babysit, you have to let her use some of her judgement, and if she really is that far off the mark in your opinion, hire a babysitter you are paying and then they are obliged to follow your instructions.

There's no use falling out with your MIL over this (and it didn't sound like you did to be fair) because I dont think its as alarming as you think it is, in my opinion. Sure, pull the blanket off when you get home but honestly, I dont think he's in any true danger from what you described.

I am dreading the prospect of becoming a MIL

It seems they can never do any thing right ?

I also have to remind myself sometimes that we are with their baby ~they are in one piece and try to relax :)

Tbh I sleep in a t-shirt and cover myself with (albeit very light) duvet now- and it's about 20 degrees during the night. DD (2) sleeps in cotton PJs and if she kicks her duvet off, she feels cool to touch.

He would not have overheated in a vest and babygro- I assume it was a light cotton one, not a thick winter one? And a light blanket would allow enough air circulation I would imagine.

We all sleep naked/ children in t-shirts during the summer when it's hot -like 28 degrees- I wasn't aware you need to cool the room down to 20 degrees for babies. Really?

OTOH she should listen to what you've asked her to do. But you are overreacting a bit imho.

Ok, she is being unreasonable to go against your wishes but I don't think that a) 22°C is extremely hot and b) he was overdressed.

I thought you were going to say he was in a thick down grobag, not just covered with a cellular blanket.

My DC were born in Spring/Summer when we lived in Germany. It was regularly over 30°C, even at night. We did not have fans or aircon.

I used to dress them in short sleeved loose bodies, will try to find a link, and put them in a very light grobag. I don't like sleeping without a blanket, so my DC were always covered. I just think it is cosier.

So, your baby was not in danger of SIDs and you are overreacting.

However, it is not good that she feels that she can "overrule" you and she has to stop this.

What is it with MiLs and overdressing?

One time MiL 'helped' ds to dress - I think he was about 3.5 at the time and was completely capable of chosing what clothes to wear and putting them on for himself at the weekend (just had to check he remember to put his pants on ) and rather than coming down in Tshirt, he had a vest (goodness knows where she found that), a Tshirt, a long sleved shirt and a jumper. When I saw him all clothes were removed and the T shirt replaced before she managed to get downstairs.

She also has a preoccupation with thinking that additional bedcoverings are a must - she does this for adults too - but at least we can choose to take them off. She would regularly get a blanket out of the cupboard to put over him in his grobag - even though this would result in him waking up soaked in sweat at about 1.00am and me having to 'deal' with him - and we always told her before bedtime that he ONLY NEEDED HIS GROBAG. Now he's 6 we still have the same problem - he's too hot under his (summerweight, 4 tog) duvet () in the middle of the winter - so has a couple of cotton cellular blankets and possibly a fleece blanket on top of that if its particularly chilly. You guessed it - I normally find him under his blankets with the duvet on top and a fleece on top of that....

However, on the whole I think I'm pretty lucky with my MiL - based on MN tales, I could certainly do a lot worse. Mind you, I'm saying that just before I endure a week with her and the BiL and his family....

Like this

My DC lived in these - no body underneath so nice and loose and cool. We had one of these organic sleeping bags which were just the perfect weight for a warm summer night.

Using a vest with ababygrow sounds OTT to me but some people obsessively put a vest on with everything in babies.
We used terry nappies so didn't use vests that much as they didn't fit well round bulky nappies and our babygrows were quite thick ones.
The undermining in front of you is unreasonable and if anyone talked about having to overrule me I would be leaving their company or asking them to leave.
In 25 going on 95s case I would have asked the gran to please let me sort out my baby my way and explain that evidence suggests we should keep babies cooler than they did in her day.
It is you and your husband's baby though and you could just ensure anyone in her company knows you are her parents and make it clear you won't be undermined.
If you leave someone else to babysit though you have to give them some autonomy. If you don't trust them don't leave your baby with them.

Oh I got tutted at re no vest too 2rebecca - even when it was really warm and other layers were involved.

Yanbu, MIL used to use a big fecking silver cross pram to take dd out in complete with all the pomp and lace.... which didn't bother me tbh, i'm quite easy going..... until I caught her out in town one afternoon, the poor child had so many blankets on she couldn't move (she already had a coat on) resulting in a furious cheese whipping blankets off left, right and centre in the middle of Debenhams

"Her overruling us on this put him at risk in my opinion and that is what I am upset about."

I am sure that the risk actually is minimal, look I get this ALL THE TIME from my italian in laws, they are obssessed with babies being cold. babies in someones arms not a car seat is fine though!!!!

until this is resolved, dont ask her to babysit , or wait and be patient as once they pass baby days it will pass anyway

YANBU. I think she should respect your wishes. However, in time you will probably become more relaxed about things. I was so stressed out in the beginning and wanted everything to be done a specific way. I know it's not nice to be constantly told you're doing things the wrong way, especially when you've read up about it.

Regarding the cot bumpers, I'm sure on the SIDS website it says there is no conclusive proof either way - I could be wrong. I don't have them either BTW because I'd always believed them to be dangerous, but a moses basket doesn't have open sides and they're not considered to be dangerous.

My DD roasts in a 1 tog sleeping bag sometimes, but I know of others who dress their DCs in fleece sleepsuits with arms + blankets.

Maybe if she looks after DS again you could just leave out what you want him to wear.

Hopefully when DH has a word she will be fine.

I know my mum & dad and aunts & uncles find it quite bizarre to be left with a list on instructions.