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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to give up work, warning, tax credits involved!

253 replies

monkeyfacegrace · 31/03/2011 15:44

Ok all, Im getting myself all muddled so I cant think straight! Please help!

At the moment, I work 16 hours per week. My kids, 4 & 2 go to nursery while Im at work, and the government pay 80% (soon to be 70%) of my childcare.

I earn £400 wages, and get £660 every 4 weeks TC. My childcare costs are £450 per month on average for both kids (vary due to month lenghts, my 4 yr old grant etc). So I get £1060, minus £450 nursery, and the nursery and work are in the next town, so I spend £100 p.month on diesel to get there and back. Leaves me with £500ish(?!)

If I give up work, and pull kids out of nursery (except eldest who will do her 15 hours free), I worked out via TC calculator, I will get £450 per 4 weeks, then I will work a little 4 hour shift every week to earn an extra £100 p.month.

Now on one hand I feel like a scrote and a 'benefit grabber', but as my DH points out, Im actually saving the government money as they pay for so much childcare so I can work. My youngest will miss out on 1 1/2 days nursery that he gets now, but at the moment I feel like I never get quality time with him Sad

What do you wise lot think?

OP posts:
londonone · 31/03/2011 17:07

So has your DH recently had a significant wage cut? Or did you have two children knowling that you couldn't afford to pay for their needs.

Drizzela · 31/03/2011 17:08

No gym memeberships here for the first 4 years of having a child, and we both worked full time!

"Driz, full time I would earn around £800 p.month. Then knock off tax, and pay £500 childcare. Figures dont add up!" But the tax credits you would then get would be a short term thing because you could work towards promotion etc. Also, you would be paying tax, so putting in and taking out.

Original poster
monkeyfacegrace · 31/03/2011 17:10

No wage cut, but I didnt bank on my first husband leaving me to go under Hmm

OP posts:
londonone · 31/03/2011 17:13

I hope he pays child support

Original poster
monkeyfacegrace · 31/03/2011 17:14

yes of course he does

OP posts:
londonone · 31/03/2011 17:18

In that case I am not sure why you need extra money given to you by the government.

valiumredhead · 31/03/2011 17:20

No, I wouldn't rely on TC - they'll be the next thing to go at the rate things are being cut.

Drizzela · 31/03/2011 17:22

Maybe he doesnt give that much... londonone.

This is why I think Non Resi parents Should have to pay half of a childcare bill as well as Child maintenance. Child care is the real cost of a young child?

Original poster
monkeyfacegrace · 31/03/2011 17:24

He gives me £20 p.wk as he is SE and fucking gets away with it. So if you would like me to bring the kids up on that, think again.

I married him in good faith, without expecting to end up divorced and with two kids by 23. Thanks for rubbing salt in though, londonone.

OP posts:
WidowWadman · 31/03/2011 17:29

"Or you could just give up your minimum wage job because it doesnt cover your childcare and too far away to make sense and claim some benefits off the state!"

Funnily enough, she's much better off in her minimum wage job then I will be when going back full time after no 2 - I really can't get my head round this, it seems unfair (but won't give up work, because I want to keep employability and sanity)

brandnewcombineharvester · 31/03/2011 17:29

i don't understand why people think it is such a terrible thing to be on tax credits and are bullying the op about it. A vast proportion of families are on it as wages are so low and crappy. I assume all those criticising the op don't claim any tax credits or child benefit then?! Get in the real world- most families need tax credits to be able to live.

usualsuspect · 31/03/2011 17:31

Tax credits are not new ...why do people bang on like they are ...family income support was introduced years ago to supplement crap wages

jellybeans · 31/03/2011 17:35

I would do what makes you happy, life is short. If that is staying home on TC , then that is what you should do. Like you say, it costs just as much to pay you for childcare. So if it was me and I wanted to SAH, I would!

londonone · 31/03/2011 17:41

They are not tax credits, they are a bloody handout in lots of cases. It is not getting a bit of your tax back, it is in many cases getting a whole lot more than you paid in tax in the first place. Sorry the op needs them but if you start having children at about 19 without having any sort of established career then IMO you are probably having kids you can't afford. I am always astonished by the sheer amount of cash people are simply given just for having children.

TheJollyPirate · 31/03/2011 17:48

Ah it's that nutty londonone with the "how much in tax credits"stuff. Do yerself a favour - hassle emplyers to pay a LIVING wage then tax credits would not be needed to support what will be our future workers. Until then shut up banging on about "money for children". Hmm.

Or do you not want your rubbish collected, post delivered, etc etc etc in the future? In which case lobby for complete contraception until people reach what you think they should before reproducing!

usualsuspect · 31/03/2011 17:49

oh londonone ...do shut up

londonone · 31/03/2011 17:52

How about rather than hassling employers, people actually only had children if they could afford them. Last time I checked the world was over rather than underpopulated. I would much rather encourage freedom of labour and immigration so that there are people to deliver the post etc than continue with this cycle of people having children they cannot afford to support. OP for example has two children, if she had one child she would be in quite a different position.

Original poster
monkeyfacegrace · 31/03/2011 17:52

thanks for the support guys Smile
I do understand londonones frustration, but Im doing my best and I dont regret my children for a second. I was young and naieve (sp) but Im trying to fix it.

OP posts:
Lougle · 31/03/2011 17:54

Tax credits were NEVER a rebate on tax paid. NEVER. They were ALWAYS intended to be a redistributive benefit for working people and those who have families to raise who don't work.

The Tax Credits replaced the family element of Income Support, so that families don't any longer get a child supplement on their Income Support. Instead, they get a single/couple rate for IS, and Tax Credits.

Some people will pay lots of tax and get no Tax Credits
Some people will pay quite a lot of tax and get very little Tax Credits
Some people will pay some tax and get some Tax Credits
Some people will pay a little tax and get quite a lot of Tax Credits
Some people will pay virtually no tax and get LOTS of Tax Credits
Some people will pay no tax and get quite a lot of Tax Credits

That is how it has always worked.

There are some anomalies. There are some injustices, but no-one will EVER be actually better off if they are not working in income terms. However, what some people find is that they are better off not working if they take into account the added costs of working, such as fuel, childcare, etc.

I am a Qualified Nurse, average wage is around £11 per hour. I worked out that after all is considered, and BEFORE childcare costs, the difference between working and not working was £1.23 per hour. 3 children under 5 meant that I would pay £12 per hour just for childcare.

As it happens, I don't have the luxury of choice. My eldest has SN and traditional childcare options are not an option.

OP, it is simply a choice. If you give up work you will lose in some ways and gain in others.

londonone · 31/03/2011 17:57

At last someone who actually seems to take some responsibility. Obviously you don't regret your children grace, but with hindsight do you think you had them at the best time? I am guessing not. If only people could be honest. There is another thread at the moment where lots of posters are encouraging someone to try and have a baby even though she is in no position to support and/or provide for it. There are a lot of posts about how love is all you need. Well that is crap actually, you need love and the ability to meet their basic needs.

londonone · 31/03/2011 17:59

it was monkeyface who I was saying was taking responsibility BTW.

usualsuspect · 31/03/2011 17:59

So only the well off are allowed children then londonone?

laInfanta · 31/03/2011 18:00

Well you might as well give up work if it will benefit you and cost the taxpayer LESS...

but on the other hand, who knows what this government will cut next - I wouldn't be happy relying on tax credits

londonone · 31/03/2011 18:01

lougle - The name tax credits is a bit of a misnomer and I believe has contributed to the fact that they are now viewed as an essential income supplement for people rather than a safety net for the very poor.

Original poster
monkeyfacegrace · 31/03/2011 18:04

just sorting kids tea/bed, will be back later

OP posts: