to wonder have we got it really wrong with todays parenting?

[slipperandpjsmum]

Parenting has changed so much in the last 20 even 10 years alot for the good but not all I am sure.

There is so much emphasis on risk and avoiding it, all the 'must have stuff' for babies, all the guilt/worry/pressure about are we getting it right rather than just enjoying our children???

Just throwing the question out there to the MN jury .................

People are always wittering on about how different parenting is and how they have no boundaries and no discipline, and I never know who the fuck you are talking about. It's not me, its not anyone I know.

You're way over-thinking. Some people are fairly good at parenting, some struggle a bit but get by, a few are really awful at it. this is not new. Harking back to some non-existent golden age when childhood was perfection is both nonsensical and annoying. And counter-productive.

Stop thinking so much about it. Just muddle on through like the vast majority of us.

I do think we have extended adolescence, so that teenagers are protected to a degree that would have been thought very OTT in the past.

My cousin won't let her 14 year old boy go into the town centre by himself. My dad pointed out to her that at 15 he was working.

Have also heard and read about parents contacting universities wanting information about how their children are doing. When I was at university we would have thought it extremely wierd for a parent to get involved in this way. Only time I can remember a parent getting involved was over a seriously anorexic young woman that everyone was worried about.

I was in the hairdressers the other day and a teenage boy, who must have been around 14/15 was in there with his mum. Not only did this surprise me massively, but she was sitting in the chair next to him telling the stylist how her son wanted his hair. It was very infantilising (if that's a word) and I felt sorry for him.

*I tell you one thing that's changed.

20 years ago, we didn't 'parent' or debate 'parenting' or worry if we had 'parented' or 'were parenting' or 'would parent' appropriately or adequately

We had kids.

I think that putting a lot of effort into 'parenting' is actually the problem.

Before we 'parented', back when we just had kids, we spent less time thinking about it and more time doing it and I think that, by and large, kids were the better for it!*

Hecate - fabulous post and I agree with every word.

When did 'parent' become a verb...?

we focus on stuff too much. we buy to much and we try and be our childrens friends.

its all gone wrong

When I was a kid there was more emphasis on natural consequences.. ie mum said dont ride your bike too fast round the corner. When you fell off at said corner you only had yourself to blame

or when your mum said dont bounce on your bed and you did and you bounced off and sprained your ankle you only had yourself to blame

We were taught the difference between stranger danger and someone being nice to us ..

I think the difference these days is that we dont allow kids to learn for themsleves we try really hard to keep them safe... so we dont let them out and we sue the council when our kids fall off their bikes

Bollocks. Have you ever sued the council when your kid feel off a bike? Has anyone you know? Then whats with the "we"?

I think a lot of the current problems and parental angst are caused by the fact that education has become a dialogue between parents and teachers. It is no longer a space for teacher and child that parents are seldom involved in (which was certainly the case when I was a child). I find the expectations of the school almost overwhelming in terms of reading/ homework /spellings/ projects/ tables practice/ parental involvement. I turn as I have become involved, I have increased expectations of what they are doing in relation to my children.

The role of a parent seems to have become somewhat extended and whilst I can see both pros and cons, I am not sure that I do not envy the care-free lack of involvement that my parents' generation seemed to have with their children's eduction.

@BuzzLiteBeer

Unfortunately I see this all the time with people I know and it drives me mad.

I've sat there at a friends house trying to eat dinner with a 4 year old sprawled on top of it. I've seen their daughter smack her mum across the face because she was talking to me at the time rather than instantly focus on her.

I've stood in line waiting to tell the teacher something but slowed down by endless parents explaining how their little Johnny had a different shade of green snot last night, coughed once etc. etc.

Honestly the list goes on. It drives me bonkers!

Goosey I know what you're saying but when schools were just left to their own devices large swathes of working class children had little education to speak of...they were just expected to leave school at 15 and go to the factories/pits etc

Buzz, maybe you are lucky and your friends/colegues are not like this.

But tbh where i live and work i see everyday cases like the ones posters here describe.

It's what we CHOOSE to buy into though isn't it?

Personally I didn't buy into any of this "Must have", "best for MY baby" stuff, & I very quickly became aware that at a pregnant woman and new parent I was highly targeted by advertisers/marketing people, who aren't afraid to use fear as a manipulation tool to get you to buy their product.

I worked hard not to act out of fear though out PG and with a young baby & I think that that perhaps over simplistic way of thinking has been more helpful than anything else to my way of parenting.

We've done OK thus far without buying any parenting manuals cheers! Though I will seek information/advice from MN of course (it's always well rounded isn't it? :) )

I think there is too much pressure too. Look perfect, hit the milestones and preferably have them mensa ready at two (for milestones that werent even recognised until the fifties). Its since been proven that most children will try and find the stimulation they need to learn even (whispers) without baby einstein!!!! I know! Shocking! My mum just chucked us out to play all day with no worries about what the neighbours thought and yet there are conversations on here about calling social services when you see a child walking to school alone. Its ridiculous, over cossetted and many children grow up with no real sense of risk, or concept of failure, which whilst miserable for them to go through, is the real world they face.

That said I agree that we dont beat our kids, listen to them and nurture them more which can only be a good thing.

maybe its just that I don't live in the UK, but I really don't recognise what you are all talking about. And I really do think it is exaggerated, how many people sue councils and schools? And how many of them would win? I'd be interested in stats, I think they'd be vanishingly small.

wordfactory - I see your point but am not sure how far parental engagement helps some groups of children. There are studies which show the modern importance of parental engagement in eduction and also that there are certain socio-ecomomic groups who tend to engage less and hence their children may achieve less. I wonder if the focus on parents hasn't further exacerbated the problem rather than levelling the playing field.

I think the media like to whip us up too.

Middle class children are stressed. They all burn out too soon. They don't ride their bikes. They do too many extra curricular activities. They don't see enough of thier parents. They spend too much time in the house.

Honestly...what I see are mostly happy well loved kids.
But I guess that doesn't sell papers does it?

goosey that may well be true.

But I really don't think we should discourage a good thing, just because some parents won't do the said good thing.

A bit like insisting we all eat crap because some parents won't or can't cook decent food, no?

They fuck you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were fucked up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,
Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another's throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don't have any kids yourself.

What has got better:

1. child-friendly society (remembers sitting outside pubs with half a coke for 2 hours every weekend brrrrr)

2.Less corporal punishment

3.less repression of kids

what is worse;

1. The lack of play inside and out because of lazy arsed parents putting the tv on for hours a day.

2.the commericialisation of every aspect of childhood.

3.The lack of boredom kids can cope with.

4.No time on their own to learn to get themselves out of shit then unleased on the world as older teenagers completely inept.

probably loads more

LeQueen - I like your style. Agree with all you say and it's what I aspire to too.

Re education: when you say you don't get involved in their education, what exactly do you mean? Not helping/supporting with homework?

Did anyone see 'Radical Parenting'?? I watched on Sky anytime....they had extreme forms of parenting on it e.g. home unschooled, attached parenting. Now some of that stuff was quite odd....not having a formal teaching for your children and letting them do what they wanted when they wanted and what they liked. Being attached to your child 24/7 until the child was about 2-3.

sorry missed out 'eating' from that.