To think that cash-for-internships shows what the Tories think about who should have opportunities

[Himalaya]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1356469/Tory-backers-pay-party-2-000-buy-children-work-experience.html

Folks at tory party HQ don't think that it is a problem that access to first steps on the career ladder in jobs with influence in finance, policy, media, PR etc depend on who-you-know networks and the ability to work for free and live in London... In fact they think it's a good fundraising opportunity and have been selling off internships at top firms for 2-3K.

Tells you all you need to know, really about their views on social mobility and equality of opportunity.

Nope, I demand they do it to me though

'Assuming the people at the top are the cleverest,'

That is the funniest assumption I've read on here in a long time.

This is not a meritocracy. It hasn't been for a loooonnnggg time, as in never.

This article highlights everything that is wrong with that assumption ( the people at the top are cleverest).

Its not really an intern ship though is it - its a week's/2 weeks' work experience. I think there'sa difference between that and a 6month/year long internship.

It would be interesting to see how many otehr opportunities for internship and work expereience these companies offer.

Good God.

It used to be there were apprenticeships so young people could get paid a small amount whilst learning a trade.

Then apprenticeships went and 'internships" came in, but still, they were paid.

Then, internships stopped being paid and - certianly in the creative fields in the 90s / early 2000s - young people got "expenses", which meant 5 quid a day for travel costs and 5 quid for a sandwich meal deal from Pret a Manger.

Now, we've arrived at the point where young people or their parents are actually forking out thousands of quid for one of this blummin internships.

We used to say only in America, but now it's "only in Torlyland".

Ominolap - I agree the problem here is the companies willing to sell work experience opportunities and the party which doesn't see that cronyism is wrong.

Not sure what is the matter with the headline though: "Cash for internships: Tory backers pay party £2,000 a time to buy their children work experience at top City banks and hedge funds" seems fairly accurate, doesn't say Cameron organised the auction, but it was done for and in the name of his party, so in the end the buck stops there.

Happiestblonde, Alouiseg -- all I hear is wriggling - auctioning internships is not that common, life isn't fair, desire to succeed etc...

So that make it ok then?

The fact is that employers will tend to recruit people in their own image, because they fit into the culture and that is who they feel comfortable with. That in the end is not good for business or for individuals if you get 'Tim, nice but dim' being recruited over someone smarter but with fewer connections (or, god forbid, a woman...)

That is why we have equal opportunities legislation and HR practices.

Auctioning off internships is blatantly bad HR. In fact I think someone who'd applied through the regular channels for an internship with these firms and been turned down would be in a good position to sue..(..only guessing, anyone legal on here?)

It is especially divisive because the kinds of jobs where the way in is most often through informal internships (media, public policy, politics, think tanks) and through the old school tie and the best universities(finance) are the ones that hold power and influence.

University entrance has been democratised to some extent but most kids don't know that even after they graduate (with a mountain of debt) they will still need a Masters degree and/or an internship to make it into these professions. That is a huge barrier, and to just say that someone whose parents haven't been to university, who has no capital behind them and who has no one to explain to them the way in and make introductions for them, they they can succeed just as easily as someone with all those advantage, if they just have drive and intelligence is frankly ridiculous.

Yes alouiseg life isn't fair. That is why we have governments, laws, democracy. The aim, should be to increase fairness not to institutionalise unfairness.

How would advertising internships and recruiting through equal ops processes, rather than recruiting through connections and money not be a good idea?

There's a reason HR is referred to as human remains.

This is life. I have absolutely no problem with companies auctioning off a week or 2 for work experience - it's a voluntary transaction.

happiestblonde your fathers success came from the housing opportunities that allowed quite a few to make something from the property market during thatchers years, but it was an anomily and not as possible as you believe.

My father came from a woring class background, started a small business and built it up into something that meant he rubs shoulders with the most elite of the place I am from. He had a red cross charity school education until his late teens. Yes opportunity is there but he was no fool, he did everything in his power to send his kids to the best schools and to have the money to set up connections and social platforms for his children. He knew that people who make it like him are not common. They are a minority.

Your father was lucky to be around in a time where he could put his skills to such an enterprise as the opportunity was around him. Such opportunities are not so available at this present time.

It is not a lack of aspiration due to ones own inability to sieze opportunity either. From a very young age, young people from certain social groupings are made to feel like the real opportunities are cut off from them as they naturally lack the prerequisites to gain entry into these opportunities. For instance, going to see a careers advisor who when you mention what you aspire to do, will tell you "this other job may be more suitable for you" as opposed to advising you on how to best access the career you originally inquired about.

There is a very good documentary that recently came out about the social devides of our society that are stopping underpriviledged children from obtaining internships and access to the most elite jobs. I will try and find the link.

I think it's really odd that right-wingers think it is Ok for people to "buy" privilege for their kids via bought internships ("just normal, doing the best they can for their DC, I would do the same, life is not fair" etc) but they rail against positive discrimination iniatives which help other people's children....so, a bright, poor black boy from a South London council estate gets a place at a top university and the right-wingers are all "it's PC gorn mad, bloody positive discrimination, he should have earned his place by getting coached 19 A *s like my little Tarquin, it is just unfair".

Yep, life's unfair, but seems like some people on this thread prefer the unfairness to go only one way.

It's illogical.

The actual background position is that many right wing people honestly think that them and their ilk are innately superior to everyone else. It's the only way they can justify their preferred vision of society.

It's pretty tough to break into certain industries if you can't afford to work for free.

I have loads of friends from uni who got a foot on the ladder in areas such as social policy by doing unpaid internships for think tanks, or internships that only paid expenses. Hence most people who work for think tanks are from quite a narrow section of society.

www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00yb5kv/Who_Gets_the_Best_Jobs/

Who Gets The Best Jobs on BBCi player. Great documentary and just under an hour long for those who have the time. Please watch if you can!

My brother had a First from a top university in History and applied (following ads in the Monday Guardian, which purport to be "real" jobs) for a role as an MP's researcher. He aced the interviews and it was only once they offered him the "job" that he discovered it was unpaid.

I guess if we as a family had been better connected, we would (a) have known such positions were unpaid and (b) been able to support him with a flat, food, utilities bills pocket money etc. whilst he did this for a couple of years. Alas, my family is just an ordinary family so he declined the job.

Went off and got a fabulously-paid management trainee job with Aldi supermarkets.

But just goes to show how there is a ruling class which will be perpetuated forever.

Yeah that's what I did - MPs researcher. It was amazing. There were 2 of us and the other girl got a bar job and supported herself becasue it was worth it to her. She was then given a paid position and now works for the guardian - no parental support.

Interesting that it's the M.P.s that expect interns to work for nothing.

Can I also point out a geographic bias here? Many of the most important internships are based in London. This goes for most of the political and media internships. Now, even working class families might be able to sacrifice enough for their child to work for six months unpaid, if their child can live at home, sharing family meals (shepherds' pie, anyone?), and perhaps having a weekend job or evening job. If you come from Cornwall, or Sunderland, you will need to be paying for London accommodation. No way will you be doing this on evening or weekend jobs.

The MPs don't expect it, they have a queue. Would you rather they be paid out of the massively stretched public purse? Believe me Parliament is run by interns.

Move to London then.

there's the solution, folks!

move to London!

this is why i encourage my children at every turn to get the hell out of the UK as soon as they can.

Yes, I would have interns paid from the public purse. Perhaps if we made an effort to attract people from the less fortunate parts of the country, we might attract some new talent, happiestblonde. Perhaps this could be a national scheme, paid for by some of that moat cleaning that a Tory MP thought was so important.

And what do you mean by "move to London" That people wanting to apply for unpaid internships move to London? How are they supposed to live? Or are their parents supposed to move to London? Is that what you mean, happiest blonde?

Happiestblonde
are you on crack?

No but I have really bad food poisoning and it's making me... poisonous.

I just think life's a bit tough and there are more important things to lose sleep over like come dine with me and the possibility that people's memories are so short that the tories (we) are going to get a battering at the May elections.

There's already enough talent. The candidates list is shut for 2015. Maybe people need to think ahead and apply to London universities if they might want a London internship because there they will meet people who they can live with for fairly cheap (not all London is mentally expensive at all)

'Maybe people need to think ahead and apply to London universities if they might want a London internship because there they will meet people who they can live with for fairly cheap (not all London is mentally expensive at all)'

Nah, I prefer enouraging them to leave altogether than going to live in a dump like London and have to kiss the arses of a bunch of twats they work for for free.

I vote SNP so I look forward to the May elections. That's going to be fun.

Do you think they'll do well? DP's Scottish but Labour (fool) and one of his brothers is very SNP.

London's wonderful and if you consider an MP part of a 'bunch of twats' then surely you wouldn't apply to work for them, paid or unpaid? I left politics to work in the city because the money's shit and I'm too young to get a decent seat yet but I'm planning a triumphant return one day. I imagine you'll be queueing up to vote for me

Sardinequeen thank God there is someone on here who cares about children other than her own. You are totally right. Whilst it is a parent's instinct to do whatever they can to help their child, it is shameful selfishness to believe that their child deserves opportunties and others do not. I am a self-employed single mother on a low income and receive tax credits. the only financial advantage I provide my children with is in comparison with other less wealthy countries (of which there are plenty), but I give them healthy food, help them with homework and try to encourage them to develop a belief in themselves.
When out with my children we walked past an old man on the street the other evening who was in a sleeping bag. We gave him some money and my 6 year old son asked me why he was on the street. regardless of whether he had a drug or alcohol problem he was someone I regarded as unfortunate and we started talking about people who don't have anything and how it's good to share (as most of us teach our children) He decided we should get loads of bananas, flapjacks and cartons of juice and give them out to people who need them. We are responsible for each other.