to think that parents who moan about their kids gettting too much homework..........

[rudolphsmum]

........to think that parents who moan about there kids getting too much homework can't then expect them to do well in exams.

If my son is finding something difficult I sit and explain it to him and if I can't I speak to his teacher. The most recent complaint I heard was that one mum spoke to the head teacher about her daughter finding homework hard but that she wasn't interested because all she is cares about is the school getting good results ....sorry I thought that was what a good head teacher was supposed to be concerned about.

There seems to be a certain group of parents that send there kids to school and expect all learning to go on between 9-3 Mon - Fri and then wonder why their children struggle and before anyone starts on about children being to tired or need to play and relax when they get home, I am not talking about hours of the stuff either - ok rant over ;)

Cat64, I can understand your concern to watch your child struggle. Perhaps she is not ready for 'automobile'. But she should still put in the effort to learn 'their'.

I am all for setting homework at the right level. I am not for saying 'no homework' because some children might struggle. If homework is set at the right level (and this may involve discussions with the teacher for a slower child to, say, not do certain parts of it) and is not 'too much', there is benefit to it.

Cat64, so what do you reckon is the solution for your dd with the bad spelling. How can her spelling improve?

Sorry blueshoes, I left caps lock on by accident.
I mentioned I was a teacher 'fwiw' specifically just to indicate that I view this issue from two perspectives, as a professional and as a parent.

Am I supposed to be more impressed with your views because you are a teacher? No, please see above.

I am not sure what you thought was 'unnecessarily combative' unless you mean my caps lock fumble.

Do you always use the same unnecessarily combative tone when you engage with your students? Erm, I'm not sure, is that meant to be a joke?

Gosh I am really quite surprised by being described as 'combative' and the suggestion that I am an aggressive teacher.
I am looking at my posts again and I HONESTLY was just answering the OP.
I thought my posts were pretty measured e.g. IMO, there has to be a balance, fwiw....
I have to say I am rather upset by that rather personal dig at my teaching style and professionalism, so I think I will bow out of this discussion and go to bed.

What makes me cross is often ds will spend hours pouring over work he's been asked to do then it never gets looked at, asked for or commented on. [cross]

Now that's just simply not fair. If the child spends ages working on something it's just cruel to see it go unaknowledged.

or even

A year or two back my ds had spellings from a scheme his very experienced and now retired teacher had designed. All the words were about patterns of spelling and I really think he did learn something useful from it, which as he is dyslexic and spelling is incredibly difficult for him was actually practically useful. Prior to that he had lists with no apparent logic for rote learning, which he struggled with hugely and simply became resigned to getting wrong, which dented his self esteem a great deal for little benefit to anyone that I could see. When I was at school I cheated in all my spelling tests, and whilst my spelling is not fantastic with spellchecks etc it really doesn't matter very much.

Well set homework which reinforces learning at school and helps parents to understand what their child is learning and where they might need extra support is useful. Homework for the sake of homework (which it often appears to be) is a waste of time all round.

I do not agree. Kids should come home, kick their shoes off, have a glass of milk and watch Grange Hill (you know what I mean).
There is more to life than school when you are young and as many other children in the world don't even start formal education until 7, shows that endless homework and mummy anxiety about school performance at the age of 5 is unnecessary. Obviously we all want our kids to achieve, but they either will or they won't. Fussing is only going to make them as neurotic as you.

I don't mind the idea of children getting a bit of homework, but 5 nights a week and weekend stuff under 12 is a bit much. I have friends with older kids and their homework sucks there night out of them. They need down time too. Kids have other interests too, and usually are involved in other activities throughout the week as well. School shouldn't be all encompassing.

there-their. Its been a long day and its late for me.

Ugh -- it's ghastly to call children kids.

OP primary school children do get too much homework.

If social mobility is to improve primary schools need to stop expecting so much of parents.

In fact they need to stop expecting anything from parents at all except sending the child to school fed and brought up with some modicum of respect and social skills.

There is no point at all in any sort of homework except reading practice for primary aged children.

Schools oly set it because parents moan if they don't - and judge schools by the amount of homework they set. The homework thing is entirely driven by parents.

I am ghastly rightpissedoff, and also don't assume that we all believe social mobility is a realistic dream.

KIDS KIDS KIDS KIDS KIDS KIDS KIDS...

Really, come on. An unnecessary comment to say the least rightpissedoff

My DD is 14 and has had homework since she was 5. The problem with starting them young (in my experience) is that by the time they are older they really see homework as a chore and become unwilling to do it just at the point where it becomes important for them to do it. In a nutshell: after 8 years of pointless homework they are completely turned off and start avoiding it (unless they're the class swot, or have a pushy parent standing behind them. (Sorry, pushy parents!))

My DD is just choosing her GCSE options and after a couple of years of arguing about/avoiding homework, she is beginning to see the point of independent, out-of-school learning and knuckling down again.

I support the idea of homework for secondary school children, who are old enough to properly research things, think independently, etc., but never saw the point of primary school homework, which required too much parental input and seldom seemed to be designed to consolidate what they'd learnt in class.

I agree with many of the other posters, when children are 4 - 11 they should be going home (or to an after-school club), having a snack, running around like mad things and relaxing.

The other thing that used to bug me was that I was a full-time employed single parent so my DD went to childcare clubs after school. I'd pick her up at 6 (hyper AND knackered simultaneously), take her home and then I was meant to sit and help her with homework when I should have been cooking dinner, bathing her and generally having some fun-time with her before getting her into bed at a sensible time. Homework used to put a ridiculous amount of strain on an already difficult routine.

I never got homework at primary school (in the olden days) and I can remember actually looking forward to starting secondary school, getting homework and feeling grown up. Now, by the time they're 11, most children are utterly bored with it.

And Aaargh! Those lists of spellings DD used to come home from primary school with...

She used to score 20 out of 20 in her tests and then write a composition a few days later with every word mis-spelt and a blind-eye would be turned because 'this lesson is about using their creativity, not about spelling...' So what's the point of learning spelling if the children aren't encouraged to apply their learning in an appropriate context?

Don't even get me started about the time she came home with a list of spellings that her teacher had corrected. They were spelling weather-related things and DD's spelling of LIGHTNING was crossed out because according to the teacher there was an 'E' in the middle of word. When I raised this with the teacher at parent's evening, she said she'd checked her version of the spelling on a computer spell-checker so it must be right! I was so happy to know that someone who relied on a computer spell-checker was teaching my daughter how to misspell.

I think my question upthread has been missed - can anyone tell me, is it a legal/ofsted-enforceable requirement for a primary school to have a HW policy written down? And would they have to show me if I asked?

Thanks.

These HW threads are always really interesting and I have to admit they have changed my views, I now understand the pitfalls of too much HW. I am shocked at how much some children get. I'm scared this will happen to my DCs, I want them to retain their love of learning (I still have this BTW - to me learning is fun, not just a means to an end, as someone asked earlier)

The details of this are often lost in argument though, so I'm going to set up a new thread on Mumsnet Campaigns, maybe people could summarise on there?

Perhaps the OP might like this homework:

there is, there are, there was, there were T.H.E.R.E.
their hats, their coats, their dogs, their goats T.H.E.I.R.

Go on, have a look!

I had a meeting with the Head about this only the other week.

Read the Homework Myth, I strongly subscribe to that theory.

I have no problem with a numeracy sheet once a week and some reading as often as possible but "build a tudor house and write 1 side of A4 descriing the house" or "create an art display of your local area" are particularly ridiculous.

If you saw some of the models that the children bring in to our school, it is obvious the parents have done them.

The point that I made to my Head was:

1. My child has been in school for 6 hours every day.
2. I went to school 20 years ago and so will not do projects now!
3. I will not enter into the competitive parenting malarkey.
4. My children have activities on 2 nights, have friends for tea 1 night, see their Dad another night and the weekends are for riding their bikes, visiting friends and family and relaxing.

There are childrens whose parents don't bother so who potential could feel like they have failed by not submitting work at the time and the children whose parents do the work for them could potentially feel like failures when they have to do work themselves in the future and it is not as good as the work previously submitted.

Quite frankly, it causes stress and pressure that no one needs, does not increase childrens potential and can have the opposite effect (burn out, failure etc).

I could go on and on and on (probably have!) but suffice to say I told my Head my children will not be doing any additional project work until the task matches their ability.

Freudian - to answer your question - no, a Homework Policy is not one of the statutory policies that schools are required to have.

Our secondary school sets lots of independent learning tasks which are supposed to take 3 hours but generally over 3 weeks.

I hated them at first and my children needed lots of help and parental input to structure the project properly. While I don't think parents should be spoon-feeding when it comes to homework, my children have actually learnt loads from doing these in depth projects. They do them by themselves now but I am on hand to answer questions and guise in the right direction.

They serve as fantastic revision guides at exam time.

The homework I really object to is Art or Drama, it seems so pointless unless you will be taking them at GCSE level.

Woolly is quite right.

"don't assume that we all believe social mobility is a realistic dream."

what a silly thing to say

I think you mean realistic aspiration, for a start. Certainly it ought to be an aspiration. Social mobility benefits everyone, not just the lowest on the social scale. Everyone benefits from a general uplifting of educational achievement across and intra social classes.

If you don't aspire to be socially mobile then no one is going to force you. But don't force your choice on other people.

Appropriate educational opportunity in a civilised society means that in state education children have the opportunity to acheive despite the families' social status.

Making teaching dependant on homework makes teaching dependant on parents, and if parents are illiterate, unwilling or unable then children will not progress.

If you don't care about those children, then spare a thought for your own, who will be paying for an underclass, financially and in terms of social order for many many years to come unless education becomes more egalitarian.

well obviously I mean dependent there and not dependant

sorry well informed people everywhere