to think that surely not EVERYONE hates Maggie?

[LadyOfTheManor]

Seriously, unless you're a miner or from a mining family, or Welsh... ok well even if you are, surely not EVERYONE hates Maggie T?

I'm a tad young, I was born in her "reign", but I did my degree in Politics and although I didn't really live under her (it was Major until I was 11) I couldn't see what she did that was SO terrible-let alone the sheer hostility when her name is mentioned here (in Wales!).

No, not everyone here hates Maggie.

Fair enough not to hate her.

But as a politics graduate you SHOULD understand why a lot of people do.

I hate large amounts of what she did, said and stood for.

But I also think the vitriolic, fierce hatred expressed for her (and some of the passionate approval of her) was partly just because she is female. If she'd acted more like other female politicians, there would be more contempt and despising; there is a kind of wild hatred for her that is partly about how she stepped away from her expected role IMO.

Fran That's very insulting to men dontcha think?

Sorry that doesn't read right!

What I ment to say was anyone without spare cash struggled even if they had work. Older voters loved her because they had money to spare. As did some younger voters. Anyone unemployed (get on your bike!), paying a mortgage tended to struggle.

I would never wish ill on anyone......But I come close to making an exception for her!

We clung on and paid our mortgage, but we struggled to buy the basics, even food sometimes. Many, many didn't and lost their homes.

but what I meant was, if you do a politics degree, I would have thought you'd be able to understand the notion that people don't just base their political opinions on what has happened specifically to them, but rather on whether they actually ideologically support what is being done.

Otherwise no-one who wasn't in the army, for example, would have cared a flying fuck about Iraq!

And demented - bit harsh to base your view of all the miners on one unpleasant woman't comment!

I hate her.

HTH

MollysChamber -yYeah yer right, sorry to all you guys out there - no offence .

One of the most important points of feminism is that what one woman does, says, thinks, achieves etc does not represent all women. So, although I am feminist who dislikes Mrs Thatcher's political career, I do not by any stretch of the imagination think that all women politician will be exactly like her and therefore would be very happy to have more female PMs as long as they have political views that I support!

Wales?

God love yeez but does no-one else remember the polltax that was tried and tested in Scotland before anyone else?

FFS

I shall dance on her grave.

My dad (who is a lifelong Labour man. And Scottish!) claims that you can blame Maggie for everything that's wrong today.

Broken Britain/kids stabbing each other etc? There's no such thing as society.
High house prices? Selling off council stock
MRSA? Privatising the cleaning in hospitals

You get my drift.

It's become something of a family game...

I despise her, my husband loathes her with a passion I have never seen . We're in NI if that makes it clearer. Don't give him an excuse to chant "Thatcher Thatcher Milk Snatcher"

ifancyashandy: I do hope you have laid your champagne down..that cork will be terribly dry...

There's no similar hate figure on the Left who makes right-of-centre people foam at the mouth quite so much, to the point where they say they are looking forward to their death.

Why does the Left despise the Right so much more than the Right despises the Left? Is it because the Left think they have altruism on their side, and therefore some kind of moral high ground? As a political non-tribalist I find it fascinating.

So is your query, why isn't there anyone as hated on the Left, or why are the Left so good at hating, or why are the Right less likely to hate, .....?

UQD, do you think so? I think 'Tony Bliar' is quite a hate figure tbh, certainly with my acquaintances who hunt (bizarrely, considering how hard he fought to try and prevent the elected majority putting the ban through). Though Cherie seems to be the one they all go for in a weird foaming way. Female again?

She stole my milk :(

The unions at least contributed to the mines by their short sightedness and opposition to mechanisation and rationalisations which, whilst it would have meant some job losses, would have kept the mines profitable for longer (although they wouldnt be by now so it was just a matter of timing- we cant compete with other countries with big, high quality seams that can be mined by longwalls).

By the 1980's it was cheaper to mine a tonne of coal in Australia and ship it to the UK via Rotterdam than to mine it in the UK.

Whether the (loss making) industry should have been kept going at the tax payer's expense for social reasons is an entirely separate debate.

My hatred has nothing to do with her gender.

It has everything to do with her self-righteous, smug 'fuck the poor' attitude.

The effect her policies had on Wales / the North East / Scotland / the North West is still being felt.

There's a vast amount of outrage at 'the Benefits Culture' but people forget that she and her policies created this situation by taking away all employment from areas (mining / ship building / steel etc) and replaced them with nothing - instantly putting families who had worked in those industries for generations on the dole.

If there is no employment in your area, you have no option but to claim benefits. If your children have only ever seen you and the rest of the family and friends on benefits, then all you learn is that 'that' is your option.

Go to the old mining areas of Wales. Then you truely understand the concept of recession.

I fucking hate her and what she did to the people of this country.

It wasn't just the policies though was UQD. The tory party at the time seemed to take real pleasure in sticking the knife in. She might not have lasted so long if it wasn't for the Faulklands war.

MrsKBPW your father is a very very wise man.

What ifancycandysaid.

She did did create this 'me, me, me' society and I for one think that the country would now be a better place if she had never been in power.

I also fancy a shandy, or a glass of wine, or a cider or...

Not true, UQD. Think of the nasty opprobruim invariably attached to Tony Benn when he was an active political figure.

And to several union leaders.

The right has tried it on with 'Red Ed' too, but he lacks the charisma and, frankly, the left-wing status for that to work.

There just hasn't been an effective front-stage leftwinger for the right to hate-fix on in recent decades.

the mines would have closed anyway with the move towards cleaner renewables. Same with heavy industry and the move to I.T. Society and its industries change - its why we don't do much weaving and copper mining etc these days...
the reaction of the mine unions was badly thought out and the strike illegal - the miners were failed by their leaders IMO.