To not see why 'cunt' is a worse insult than many others?

[HeathcliffMoorland]

I never hear anyone outraged at someone being called a cock/dick/scrotum...

If there's something I'm missing and someone can tell me why I'm BU, I will happily change my ways.

An extraordinary thread. Am speechless.

'We will always need a word which has the power to shock and offend'

I agree with that tethers. But I think the reason we have to have that is because otherwise society will disintegrate.

Why don't we live in a progressive, hippy, anything goes world, where there is peace and harmony and love and where there is no such thing as offense and shock, where sick comedians like Frankie Boyle can say whatever they like on our TV channels. The reason is because that would be the path to destruction, it would give free rein to the anything goes liberals and would result in the law of the jungle and the survival of the fittest. Society has boundaries for the protection of the vulnerable and for the protection of all people and society itself. the first line of defence is swear words such as cunt. If those barriers are broken down by the "ground breaking, pushing the barriers" progressive comedians, then society will become much, much crueller and the vulnerable will end up suffering.

There are many words just as bad imo but it is not a word I would use, and although both my teenagers have used swear words in front of me I usually let them go (after telling them off) but they do know that if they use that word around me then they will be in serious trouble, I just don't like it.

'Most people agree it's the worst word. But that doesn't explain why.'

I tried to explain why I think it is. Why do you think it is?

No, not all children who swear are lawless criminals. But I am not a progressive, I believe that society has standards for good reason. I do believe in the slippery slope and the potential avalanche.

Can you please respond to the fact that slippery slope is a so crap it's invalid argument [cries] if you believe that swearing leads to the disintegration of society you need a DIFFERENT argument to get from swearing to lawless society.

You do realise the popular press will LOVE this thread!??

not sure I am fully understanding what you are asking. I think that transgressing society's rules over when and where it is appropriate to use swear words such as cunt, will lead to transgressions of other rules of society.

Any child who refers to a headteacher as cunt to their face, is likely to transgress other school rules as well. Breaking these barriers will lead to the search for new barriers to break. I think it destroys the respect that people have for their society and for other people. I think that rappers using terms like bitch and ho for women, changes their mentality and destroys their respect for women. Once respect is destroyed and society's rules of respect are destroyed, then anything goes and people treat each other with disrespect and cruelty. Some people piss on the cenotaph, some people laugh at disabled people and attack them. Their sense of decency has been destroyed and society is the loser.

But I'd a child calls a teacher a cunt they are breaking a school rule not to swear.

If in the street they call the friend a cunt they are only breaking societies taboos.

You will find that there are far fewer who are willing to break specified rules than there are who don't mind breaking taboos (especially if they don't agree with them) so it doesn't follow that a child that says cunt would even be prepared to say it to a teacher, let alone break other laws (such as racial hatred ones) in the way you seem to think they would.

I'm sorry about the odd typo it's the iPod autocorrecting.

First line is if not I'd.

The English language is rich and varied, if you can only think of a swear word to use then it shows a total lack of intelligence and good manners.

I hope that the word never becomes mainstream in our language.

It's bad enough to have to listen to women being described as bitches or ho's or the word ask being bastardized into axe .

Fanny isn't an offensive word, in the US they use it for bottom, even pussy, which isn't a word I use, is benign and quite friendly sounding.

The correct term for female sex organs are vulva, labia and vagina - why call them anything else?

Bloody hell claig, I use the word cunt but I am not morally corrupt, and my dd doesn't hear me say the word.

I am fairly sure those who swear do not do it around children (much) nor would they be happy for their children to swear at school.

We all know that everybody swears. People swear with their friends and down the pub etc. etc. that is OK, because it is not breaking society's rules.

But in general they don't swear at strangers, although that is becoming much more common. Cameron doesn't use swear words on TV because that breaks society's rules. But movies and pre-watershed stuff are increasingly allowing swear words, when they were not allowed 50 years ago. This is encouraging more young people to use such language in situations that society disapproves of, not just when having a laugh with their mates.

I understand your point, claig- without a word to shock and offend, society would have to 'up the stakes' as it were, and start to shock and offend with actions instead of words- have I got that right?

I'm not sure I agree, although I can see where you're coming from. People need to identify themselves as people who transgress boundaries, who are not conservative, and words serve this purpose in a safe way. I am less sure that the word becoming acceptable would lead to offensive actions; I think the commandeering of a new word is a more likely result.

The point I am making is that what the word cunt signifies is what is offensive, not its dual meaning, which is somewhat incidental. Nobody is up in arms about the word twat or pussy, as has been pointed out. This is because what is signified by these words is less offensive.

Cunt signifies something which is part of human nature/experience, and it is this which is offensive- ergo, cunt is serving its purpose very well and is in fact the ideal choice of word.

I think it has it's place. Sometimes no other word will suffice! I don't like the way it implies that female genitals are despicablethough.

SantosLHalper, I use the word cunt too, but often correctly when applied to some progressive or other.

I am talking about comedians and movies increasingly using it on public TV and making it acceptable in other situations. I don't think that is good.

'I understand your point, claig- without a word to shock and offend, society would have to 'up the stakes' as it were, and start to shock and offend with actions instead of words- have I got that right?'

yes tethers, that is right.

"The English language is rich and varied, if you can only think of a swear word to use then it shows a total lack of intelligence and good manners."

What utter rubbish. Swearwords are a part of the rich and varied English language. If you want to offend everyone in the room but don't have time to construct a sentence, then 'cunt' is the perfect word.

"I hope that the word never becomes mainstream in our language."

If it does, you will have nothing to worry about as it will have lost its potency and ability to shock and offend. It could well be the 'twat' of the 21st century.

I imove from down south to the north and quickly found out that people up here find the word twat far more offensive that down south.

It is almost, but not quite on par with cunt.

Interesting as it demonastrated to me how society creates the level of offense a word holds, and that it is not inherent in the language.

I think first the words would get worse and the insults would get worse. Words are just thoughts, and as words get worse, thoughts get worse. The next step from thought is action and actions will get worse. Obviously , this won't apply to everyone, but many people will lose their sense of decency, the upbringing that we teach them, and will treat people with disrespect.

Words count and thoughts count. Why do you think that people are so easily swayed about scroungers etc? Newspapers air these words and the thoughts enter people's heads and their respect for their fellow citizens diminishes. We know that the press can whip up hatred of minorities if they feel like it. Breaking of society's rules leads to disrespect and potentially worse.

"I don't like the way it implies that female genitals are despicablethough."

You see, I'm not sure that it does any more than 'pussy' implies that female genitals are cowardly or 'twat' implies that they are silly, or 'trunk' implies that an elephant has a wooden nose covered in bark.

I sort of agree with you claig- I would like to see the word 'cunt' retain its offensiveness, although for different reasons to you I suspect.

What we want as individuals is academic though- it will change its meaning organically (if at all) over time, based on the consensus of English speaking societies.

agree with tethers, it doesn't imply that female genitals are despicable. I think it is about respect and decency. It is considered indecent and impolite to use cunt as an insult because of what it means. It is not impolite to talk about female genitalia, but it is impolite to use them in terms of an insult.

It is also impolite to use the word "bitch" as an insult, but it is fine to use it in its proper sense.

I think its just a horrible word but then again I don't like the word bastard.

You tit.
You cock.
You twat.
You arse.
You bellend.
You nob.
You cunt.

I think that there is no real reason that cunt is considered any different to the rest. Just a word.
btw I don't tend to swear at other people,
or use obscenties as insults, though I will turn the air blue whilst muttering to myself.

Yes, I think I want it to retain its power as a barrier and you want it to retain its power as a word representing the ability to express an offensive, powerful thought. I think we are not too far apart and it may just be two sides of the same coin.

I agree it is society that will decide whether it loses its force and whether another word takes its place. The increasing use of the word on TV and elsewhere will probably mean that it does begin to lose its power. It will be intersting to see which word takes its place as a signifier of the greatest offense.