AIBU to hate the line "why should people on housing benefit live in homes that working people can't afford?"

[standupandbecounted]

"Why should people on housing benefit live in houses that working people could not afford?"

I keep seeing this line being thrown about in the media. Along with stories about families, usually with an average of eight kids, claiming a shocking level of housing benefit.The government is going to cap housing benefit to prevent this. Reasonable, but not the whole story.
A a less publicised proposal is to drop the level of Local Housing Allowance(LHA) from the 50th centile to the 30th centile.Local housing allowance is currently set at the median-middle value- of private rents in your local area. In my area the LHA is nowhere near the proposed cap. The maximum I can claim for a 2 bedroom property (I have 2 kids) is 126.92 per week. For a three bedroom it is £150 per week. Shelter have estimate that the average loss for a for a two bedroom tenant in my area will be £12 per week.( I assume this is based on predicted rent levels)
Loss per area here

I am renting a two bedroom flat for myself and two children, aged 18 months and 5. There is no outdoor space, it is not large and not in an exclusive area. The soundproofing is poor and the tenants upstairs are fond of partying way into the early hours. Hardly luxury housing that working people can't afford. I believe this myth about HB claimants living in the best properties does not represent the reality for the majority of us. I have tried to find somewhere better but most landlords will not take HB or children. I have put my name down on the waiting list for council housing but have been awarded thr lowest priority level. I will never get one with that banding.

The thing that upsets me most is the "working people" bit, a lot of HB claimants ARE working people! Housing benefit is also available to people who don't earn enough to cover their rent. Most low income people cannot access council housing anymore. They are forced to rent on the private market, where rents are to high to be affordable on low incomes. This is the case in most areas, not just London.

So, AIBU to feel angry that people on housing benefit are being misrepresented and subjected to unfair cuts?

Amen Sieglind

OOPS! NOOOO!
Amen PastyEater

Oh that's where we went wrong Riven, somehow we've brought all this on ourselves.

Fucks sake.

I'm bowing out of this thread now, I can't stand it. I'm struggling so badly already without being told I deserve no help and am somehow responsible. :(

For some people the biggest factors are their fault. She didn't say all. It was a very good post. I work pretty hard and I earn reasonable amounts. That doesn't mean I won't be struck down ever with some awful disease but I have improved my chances of things not being too bad because of the types of actions on the list - mvoed away to get work, picked good career, had children I could afford and I try to eat well so I tend not to be ill although healthy eating is not the only thing which causes illness. However the poitns are good. If I doubled my weight to 18 stone there would be less chance I could keep up my ability to support my children in my 50s and even 60s.

I don't think anyone is proposing removing state provision of food and housing for those who are ni need. We are very lucky in this country that all political parties support the welfare state and most of us buy into it. All that is in questino is we have run out of money to fund it in the way we did and there will be some changes but the poor will be fed and housed. No political party will remove that.

the irony is when we've been in dire straights dh would have been entitled to about. £50 a week. No housing benefit, no nothing!

Because we didn't remortgage our house 10 times, because we didn't live beyond our means or keep up with the joneses when they were all buying (with mortgages) holiday houses, because we didn't put 12k down on a Bentley and finance the rest. Because we were utterly boring and sensible we got nothing.

We've always lived in commuter land, foolishly we should have found a house in Notting Hill and let housing benefit pick up the slack

No one has this crystal ball which is being tossed about, but the vast majority of people on mn are decent human beings.

What the issue is really about is piss taking breeders who benefit from our tax money by breeding more children than the taxpayers themselves can reasonably afford.

Not everyone lives in bloody london I do wish MN would remember that ...maybe I should just have found myself a rich husband

Completely agree with Alouiseg. I bought my first property 25 years ago, DH bought his a little later. We put them both together and bought a terraced house in London. We have almost paid off the mortgage, we live well but not extravagantly, we both work full time, the DC have had the best education we have been able to provide. We have a modest holiday, we rarely eat out, we buy few clothes and minimal gadgets, the house could do with revamping, my car is 10 years old. We do not have i-phones or laptops, the DC receive modest presents. Neither of us buy coffee, etc. There have been times when we have scrimped and saved to get by but we have no debt apart from what remains of the mortgage.

We had our first child at about 35 and have worked very very hard for every single penny we have. We have never had a single thing until we have been able to afford it, especially the children! Thought about, planned, wanted, loved and cherished. And most of all provided for by us not you or any other tax payer in this land.

Neither of us started out with privilege but were/are sensible and we were prepared to work for tomorrow and where necessary make sacrifices.

I haven't had a holiday for 5 years I haven't got an i phone we both work ,dp got made redundant at 53 so has a shitty job now {no doubt his fault} Do i Win ? need a bit of a helping hand from the state now ...oh wait I'm a lazy fecker

Smug smug smug ..decent people on MN? yeah some not all by a long chalk I'm all right jack anyone?

No, lazy feckers are those who have never tried, and done little work and yet still have a huge sense of entitlement. Those who do their best and are brought low by circumstances beyond their control need a safety net. Those in their twenties who have a serious sense of entitlement whilst not being prepared to work or wait for anything do not deserve the help of others at the expense of those who are in real need.

When my mother was a single parent when I was a baby her parents took her back in at a time when it was still regarded as shameful to conceive a child out of wedlock and then leave the husband within a few months of the birth. Yet they cared for both of us when it was needed most and this is what seems to have been lost.

I don't know what the answer is ..I will probably lose my job in the new year due to the cuts ..what do I do, you tell me? who will employ a 51 year old ..minimum wage jobs will not cover the cost of housing and don't pretend it will

Exactly what violethill said at 18.23

We need to get past the idea that we are all neatly divided into three categories:

The poor, who are totally incapable of changing their own lives so we must actually give them more money as an artifical way of stopping them being poor

The rich, who have always been rich and who will continue to always be rich by trampling all over the poor

And a tiny minority of people who were poor, miraculously became rich by some amazing stoke of good fortune, and now can't understand why everyone doesn't do the same -because it's easy.

Actually, most of us don't fall into any of those categories. It really isn't helpful to view it in such simplistic terms.

Thank you. It's refreshing when people actually read the posts, rather than deliberately (or perhaps ignorantly - really scary thought) misrepresent what's said.

I didn't say all the factors are within one's control. I said many of them are.

It is that simple though ...I changed my life came from fuck all, we ran our own business for years we lost it though ,we lost the big house and everything that went with it ..dp picked himself up got another well paid job he was made redundant after 10 years ..who could predict that? shit happens to all of us ..now we just about hang on ,to be told we are scroungers,should have worked harder should have moved ,should not have had so many kids

Yet they cared for both of us when it was needed most and this is what seems to have been lost.

I agree I think this what i find so hard to comprehend if my child got pregnant i wouldn't be marching her up to the council offices to get her name on the waiting list she'd be staying with me in her home to keep her safe.
I've heard of 17 year olds being kicked out for the sake of getting more benefits, never mind that a pregnant child is exposed to god knows what in a hostel.

How did you lose the business US ?

US Those kind of situations are exactly what the welfare state should provide for - but it shouldn't make it so comfortable and no open-ended as to remove any incentive to continue to look for work and get back on track.

We are not talking about situations like yours. Neither are we talking about situations where people are dealing with long-term debilitating illness or disability in the family.

I'd be marching mine to Marie Stopes.

Yes, shit happens to many of us.

I agree.

I have never said it doesn't.

I don't have the crystal ball which you referred to in a snidy post earlier.

I have lost money through a business, suffered from a very difficult pregnancy and birth, one of my dds has a disability... this isn't a thread about competitive hardship though. It's about the fact that the welfare state is unsustainable in its current form, and that its failure to discriminate between the genuinely needy who have fallen on hard times, and those who take the piss, has been a major part of the problem.

I have no problem with having a welfare state. If I lose my job next week, or get struck down by some god awful illness, it would be pretty helpful to have the safety net, no? What people do have a problem with, is the culture of dependency which keeps generations in a cycle of hopelessness, and totally discourages independence

That was in response to usualsuspects post btw

Lots of reasons mama ..mainly people owing us money going bust, you can't borrow for ever to keep a float

I know a couple of Dr's who's daughter got pregnant at 18 and they've brought the baby up as their own leading to successful outcomes for both mother and child.
Families will hopefully rally around more if the state refuses and everyone will be happier for it I bet.

No, true I say a prayer every time an invoice is paid.
It takes balls to have a go though, we're both self employed, because the arse fell out of both our industries we've had no choice but to create our own employment.

Look violet I don't care if you don't like my snidyposts its not personnel ..its just the internet

Personal, you aren't the HR department