In laws

[OatcakeGirl]

My husband and I have spent the last 4 Christmases with his family, and they seem to expect that we always should. None of my husband's older siblings have to do this - they are allowed to alternate.

I'm 4 months pregnant with my first child. I'm not religious, but my inlaws are, and take Christmas very seriously. I told my FIL that I had been offered an antenatal appointment on Xmas Eve (in Scotland), and apologised that I'd have to miss their Xmas in Sussex this year. He spluttered "So you don't care about Christmas at all!" then slammed the phone down! I thought it was so rude.
From my point of view, my health and that of my unborn child is indeed more important than Xmas, but my inlaws think their Christmas celebration is more important. Surely being a good Christian is about thinking of what's best for others instead of putting your own wishes for a party first?

My husband has to spend a lot of time working in London, and we have flats in Scotland and London. I will be giving birth in Scotland, and that's something my husband and I are both happy with, especially as I want to have my mother around before and after the birth.

MIL phoned me to tell me I ought to be giving birth near their home in Sussex, because my husband will feel left out if he has to travel up to Scotland.

I didn't want to make my husband feel bad about his mother, so I didn't make a big thing of what she had said, but asked him if he was really OK about me giving birth in Scotland. He assured me he was very happy about it.

I hid that I was upset, and lightly said "I think your mum would prefer me to give birth in Sussex."
My lovely husband replied "Well,it's about what's best for us, not what's best for my mother." So if he is fine about it, why is MIL interfering like this?

Has your DH actually said this to his parents then? Why are they communicating with you and not their son?

YANBU, btw.

Wow, set the precedent now, before the child is born or you will be dragging the baby down to Sussex everytime they click their fingers. Your DH sounds very good though, let him deal with them.

This is what in laws do!

No matter how grown up and capable your DH is, to them he's always their little one. To paraphrase another writer, you are much more scary to them than they are to you, because you go bump in the night - with their little boy.

As DH has dine the right thing ("leaving" his parents to cleave to you), then could you let him deal with most of the phone calls, so he can have the brunt of the extraordinary bluntness; and also let him do the explanations of birth choices so he can stress (over and over again) that he's fine with it all.

Stay as calm as you can - these people are your DC's blood relatives.

YANBU about Christmas.

That said, is it possibly ILs are worried about being excluded from their GC's life? You mention having your mum around, but what is the plan for your ILs? Have you talked to them about how and when they will be able to see the baby? I would put money on this being an issue for them.

Is it possibly possible, I meant!

Thanks for your swift replies ladies!

I'll reply to each comment point by point, then would be glad to have your thoughts.

LoudRowdyDuck - MIL did say she knew DH was fine with it. So I know he really is! (but I would always trust him anyway, as he is a gem!)

SecretLemonadeDrinker - Good point - do I set a precedent now and upset people, or be tactful then find things will get worse?

Onimolap - thanks for the reminder to stay calm! Good advice - I'll try not to take any phone calls from them if DH is not around. They are quite capable of laying into him, as I've seen (and he's 35!) but this is the first time they've tried it on me.

NeverEatYellowTaintedSnow - Good question, but no - my inlaws won't be excluded from GC's life. Our flat in London is too small for a baby, and we in Scotand we use a small flat belonging to my family - also too small for a baby. My inlaws have a Sussex farm, and have offered a farm cottage to us, next to the main farmhouse. It's plenty big enough, and will be rent-free, and convenient for work in London. They have also offered to help with babyitting etc and will help us with costs of pram, cot etc.

But it means I will be completely in their debt! I'm not sure if I'm making the biggest mistake of my life....

Could you spend the odd weekend in the farm cottage? Not move there permanently but travel down at your convienience? Just so they feel that they are included. Even if you don't plan to exclude them, the parents of the father often feel that they are playing second fiddle to the parents of the mother.

I would hesistate to move there permanently and full time, but that might be because I've recently watched The Little House.

I would try to have a conversation with the ILs to make it clear with them how much you are looking forward to spending time with them once the baby has arrived and how you're sure they're going to make wonderful grandparents. If their unreasonable behaviour over Christmas is coming out of any worry about contact with the baby (and they could well be worrying even if you don't think you've done anything to make them feel this way) you might be able to solve things with a simple conversation very easily.

Honestly, you need to stand up for yourself. Your PIL are walking all over you.

think carefully about the farm cottage. check there are not too many strings attached. but it seems that dh can be supportive and if you are ok with the baby sitting etc, fine.

looking after your small child is important, i seem to remember that the baby that your pils are celebrating the birth of grew up to be quite cross at people who tried to push small children away.

mil is being silly to think you should give birth in sussex.

You sell the flat in London and buy a house that is big enough for your DH within commuting distance of London if at all possible. Unless you and DH are able to demonstrate that you can stand on your own two feet neither of you will ever be allowed a moment of independence.

It starts this Xmas, "this is our last xmas as a couple, we would like to spend it together and alone" You spend it in London away from your mother and your inlaws. You can rearrange an ante natal apt and at 5months missing just one won't really hurt.

Thereafter you alternate Xmas between your family and DH's family so that gps get equal xmas shares of the gc.

Reminded me of The Little House too, NeverEat!

When do you get to spend Christmas with your parents?

You and your DH need to sit down and plan how you are going to live your lives once you have a baby, making it fair for both sets of grandparents, and then stick to it and be firm with grandparents about how it's going to be.

hmm, yes. The plan was to move there, and use the London flat as and when necessary, but after this, I'm feeling worried about living there. One of the problems, though, is that we won't be able to afford childcare when I go back to work, so my inlaws' offer to pay for childcare (conditional on living in Sussex, not London) would mkae life easier.

But the way I'm feeling right now, I think a massive bank overdraft for childcare would be preferable to being controlled by inlaws.

My own parents are being so nice and discreet - they never pester my DH, and they've accepted that they will eventually be living hundreds of miles away from their only grandchild, while my inlaws already have lots of grandchildren.

Get caller display on your phone and only answer when dh is in the house so you can say to il's, hang on I'll just check that with dh when they say such things again

Enjoy your Christmas with your Mum this year :)

Why can't you live in a house in Sussex that you buy yourselves?

Well, sadly I won't be with my parents, as the idea of me missing Christmas caused so much upset with inlaws that I cancelled my antenatal appointment. I felt I had to.

Sell both the flats, find a nice small house for yourselves to have as a family, and don't go back to work so you don't have to find childcare?

I assume it's not possible for you to permanently relocate to Scotland? By this I mean your DH's work mainly.

Just to clarify, the antenatal appointment in Scotland was to have been on 24th Dec, so I wouldn't have got down to Sussex in time. I explained to FIL about the antenatal appointment and he still slammed the phone down, so I really had to cancel it. I'm not happy at all about it, but I didn't have much choice.

FIL is estramged from his eldest son from his first marriage, and MIL, while not exactly estranged from her daughter from first marriage, has an uneasy relationship with her. The daughter (my husband's half-sister) wouldn't speak to her mother (my MIL) for many years, but she does now, although she tries not to spend time with her.
Both inlaws get on best with my DH out of all their children, so I guess that's why they are being possesive. And fortunately DH is very aware of his parents being tricky - he warned me before I met them for the first time. So he will always support me, but I don't want to push his loyalty too far....

In light of your last post, I would not be moving into their farm cottage. They do not sound like easy people to get on with and if they're already making unreasonable demands then I can't see that getting any better.

IF you can have a really honest, open discussion and say that as much as we want you in our lives, that there are boundaries that need to be respected - on both sides - then you could theoretically make all of this work.

This relies heavily on them being amenable and sensible.

I can do this with my mother, if DH can do this with his parents, and you only need support him on this, then it could be a good temporary measure to take the house. But it requires them to be respectful of your boundaries.

If you are both around mid-30s then this is the decade that you both learn to stand up, find your voices and say "No. That's not going to work for us." before this time, it's hard to have the gravitas to get away with it.

Ultimately, you are in the right. If your IL sit down and think sensibly, they would accept that. Don't try and second guess what you think you ought to do. Do what is right for you and your family and calmly, without emotion confirm that your plans are decided.

Convey this in a manner that reinforces your confidence in your abilities to make your own decisions and stick to your position. There is only so far they can take it then, without being abjectly rude.

OatcakeGirl - what is your DH saying to his parents about all this? Is he happy that you cancelled the antenatal appointment to appease his parents? I don't think you had to cancel it btw - I think you were emotionally blackmailed into it - hence why I am asking about your DH's opinion on how his parents are behaving and why he didn't stand up for you (or maybe he did?)

i don't think you should have cancelled it, i think you should spend this christmas in scotland, as a way of getting some distance and time to yourselves before deciding about where and how to live. also, once you have the baby you will have much much more pressure to be in sussex every christmas, how are you going to manage that without excluding your own parents - those who shout the loudest should not get their way all the time!!!

I haven't lost my temper at all - I've been endlessly polite to them - which is why I'm venting here! Mumsnet is very useful!

I think I might just stay in our tiny London flat, and visit them at weekends.

Thanks ladies for your support - I'm breathing more calmly already!

P.S. Scottish flat isn't ours to sell - we just have use of it. And the London flat is so tiny, it wouldn't go far towards buying a house...but maybe we can make it work.

You sound pretty calm on here, I have to say!

Ah, i revise my comment, in light of your last comment.

You ARE being emotionally blackmailed.

FIL has pissed all the other kids off and they won't talk to him...

And then there was your DH and you....

This is not about being supportive of your DH or him being supportive of you. Sounds like you and he have it exactly right and are great for each other.

You need, both, to understand that with IL like yours, whatever you do will be wrong. He HUNG up on you? because you have a Doctor's appointment?

Bugger that.

You get on the phone first thing on Monday and get that appointment back.

Don't you DARE let your FIL bully you into cancelling antenatal appointments. How bloody dare he. Tell him due to the next available appointment not being convenient, you have decided to stick to the Doctor's plan.

He has shown his true colours, this is foot down time. Not angrily, not confrontationally, but matter of fact and just stating a fact.

you'd think that they would have learned their lessons having practically lost 2 DC already, to try and NOT piss off your DH and you... clearly not.

Don't feel guilt, this is their doing, they are being U.