to want my DC to only have wooden toys? (Or is this a case of PFB Syndrome?)

[LovestoLove]

I don't think I'm generally PFB - I want my child to respect adults, eat with no fussing/faddiness (or at least no reaction on my part), have no quibbles about the step, won't give copious amounts of juice/biscuits, won't give into tantrums, etc.

But I really have a thing about the bucket loads of plastic toys that I fall over when at friends' homes.

I love wooden toys/puzzles, books, cloth dolls, make-believe things, fancy dress, etc.

Is it totally unreasonable of me to ask parents, in-laws, and anyone else who's expressed interest in getting a baby gift to get something wooden/natural? I know wooden toys are generally seen as more expensive but I've found some on Ebay and other sites that aren't bad.

Or am I going to be seen as crazy? I'm 30 weeks pregnant by the way with DC1.

Where do you shop InGodWeTrust?

piscesmoon, why be so aggressive in your arguement? InGodWeTrust has been nothing but polite!

Love your user name penelope

Hee hee

Good luck!!

lol

I have answered the question about age inappropriate games yesterday.
In our family we have always operated a wish list, so if someone asks I tell them what's on the wish lust, before they could express an opinion, people just bought what they wanted. And before anyone says anything the wish list is just that, not an expectation list.
What harm does the odd macdonalds and toy do. Ass someone else pointed out a little of what you fancy does you good.
Dcs are teenagers now, i really can,t see allowing them to have a plastic garage or kitchen did them any harm. In fact they are remarkably well balanced children considering the problems we have had recently.

bruffin - you are avoiding the point. i didn't say mcdonalds was poison or words to that effect. i was using the analogy to illustrate the suggestion of other posters that choosing wood over plastic toys was somehow 'controlling'.

however bruffin, we too in our family have a gift list and have done traditionally since my cousins and i were tiny. traditionally though, some family always ask and adhere to the list and some others always totally ignore it :-) our list system is reciprocal though and everyone is happy - no controliing here :-)

I think there's nothing as soul destroying to a child as being used to further a parent's agenda, be it in the area of general culture or toys or whatever. If a child's preference is going to be overridden or her wishes continuously dismissed as unsuitable (and I realise this is a bit extreme) then who exactly is all of this about?

Go against the mainstream yourself if it's that important, but a child is not an extension of your personality, and not your foot soldier. Your 'hideous children's programme' might be something magical and appealing to a child. Unless you are able and willing to keep a child apart from other children until adulthood, and continue to avoid exposing him or her to what most other children are exposed to in the general children's culture, the child will find out about all the forbidden things and feel left out and different, and perhaps not feel very good about that.

I didn't avoided the point. I have said time and time again that there is a point when parenting becomes controlling. If you chose what toys your child is going to have even before it is born, then tell people what they can and cannot buy (and there people on this thread who admit to it), chose to ignore your child's wishes or don't even allow your child to have some choice then you are being controlling.
Children need to learn that not everything is perfect, that some toys break easily or are as not as interesting as they first thought. They need to learn to do that for themselves. Mathsanxiety put it much better than I have.

I also don't see why children need to be forced to use their imaginations, what a very odd statement.

and I take back everything about DCs being well balanced. DS has just been dancing round the room, cuddling my head ( he is 9 inches taller than I am) singing the Match of the Day tune

I also don't see

THIS IS INTERESTING...

On Children
by Kahlil Gibran

Your children are not your children.
They are the sons and daughters of Life's longing for itself.
They come through you but not from you,
And though they are with you yet they belong not to you.

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.
You may house their bodies but not their souls,
For their souls dwell in the house of tomorrow,
which you cannot visit, not even in your dreams.
You may strive to be like them,
but seek not to make them like you.
For life goes not backward nor tarries with yesterday.

You are the bows from which your children
as living arrows are sent forth.
The archer sees the mark upon the path of the infinite,
and He bends you with His might
that His arrows may go swift and far.
Let your bending in the archer's hand be for gladness;
For even as He loves the arrow that flies,
so He loves also the bow that is stable.

couldn't agree more with mathsanxiety.

as an artist- some of the most inspiring things in childhood for me were television programmes. as a visual person, seeing stories come to life using animation particularly, was really important in my becoming an illustrator. TV and film are just another creative medium, as valid as painting and poetry. just because some programmes are crap and some channels have advertising doesn't mean there's nothing it can offer.

people need to get past their preconceptions of 'low art' or 'plastic tat' and look at the potential of everything as an opportunity to learn... children take things on face value and don't automatically attach stigma because it doesn't fit in with their aesthetic/moral agenda.

and recycling toys and buying second hand is an environmentally friendly way of providing toys for children, if that's your beef.

i effing loved barbie/sindy as a girl and couldn't get enough of my etcha-sketch. i also looooved a wooden garage and dolls house made by my dad. they all provided completely different entertainment but were all of equal value to me.

That sums up my feeling beautifully MsKalo.

Your so right Blinks. Both my DCs are turning out to have some talent as photographers.
DS has been placed in national competitions, won competitions at school and was 3rd in a local schools competition when he was just yr9 and all the other winners were 6th form a level students.

DD has just won her first school competition.

Now this talent has only been able to show itself because of computers and modern technology.
In the days of film, DS would not have been allowed to take 900 photos at the skateboard park. He couldn't have spent hours playing with photoshop. He is not a traditional type artists, cant draw but his art teacher describes his work using a pc as equisite. The Pc has allowed his imagination to run riot. My favorite photo he has taken is a combination of two photos he has photoshopped together. One is of a friend skateboarding, the other is her skateboard. He has cut her out and turned her into a silhouette and cut and pasted it onto the skateboard and changed the background to a brick wall. Hard to describe but it is so effective.
If you asked him to drawer or produce this in traditional crayons and paper, he wouldn't be capable. Modern technology has allowed to him to show his artistry.

yes, bruffin! it's all about making pictures... it doesn't matter how you get there and as you say, modern technology (do you reckon OP and the wood crew will whittle a wooden keyboard for their precious ickle fingers?) is just as valid as a piece of paper and pencil. by the way, that's how i got started in illustration- just mucking about with drawings/photos, a scanner and photoshop.

i think if you've got an open mind, your half way there.

i think you need some balance. some wooden toys are great. some plastic ones are hilarious. have a mixture. come back to the middle .

'I think there's nothing as soul destroying to a child as being used to further a parent's agenda, be it in the area of general culture or toys or whatever. If a child's preference is going to be overridden or her wishes continuously dismissed as unsuitable (and I realise this is a bit extreme) then who exactly is all of this about?'

I agree entirely. I don't think that I was being aggressive in my argument. I often quote the poesm that MsKalo quoted-I have done it so often that I feel people will be bored with me quoting it. I am only aggressive, if you take it that way, because I can't stand the way people think they own their DC's mind and can tell them what to think! You don't like plastic toys but your DC might like them. They won't find out with rigid censorship. Why can't the DC find out for themselves that wooden toys are better?
I love wooden toys-the best thing that we ever had was a brio train set. (the wooden abacus, mentioned earlier was a dead loss-it looked lovely as an ornament but I couldn't get a single DC to show an interest in it).However they had endless fun with plastic toys too and they do come without batteries and buttons!
By all means have lots of wooden toys, but it is obsessive and controlling to ban anything that offends your aethetic senses!
It is like McDonalds-I hate the place and thankfully never have to set foot in it now that mine are older but we went in on odd occasions and they loved the toy. Why not? What harm is there in a McDonalds meal about once every 6 months? It stops them hankering after forbidden fruits.
I remember the very first toddler NCT meeting that I hosted. I offered a biscuit to a DC whose mother shuddered and it was treated as poison. I though that I had put my foot in it, but the others had biscuits. All the DCs played quite happily without thinking about the biscuits, but guess which DC couldn't settle to play and was biscuit obssessed?

I think the reason that this thread is getting a bit heated is not because anyone is particularly passionate about wood or particularly passionate about plastic per se. Like most parenting decision, it raises more complex issues about parenting style and whether that style is good or bad or better than someone else's style.

Someone made the comparison with cloth nappies and babywearing and I think this is interesting. I use a sling - my 15 month old has not been in a pram since he was 6 months old. I don't like using a pram and I would like to see more people using slings because I think it is convenient, enjoyable for both mum and baby and fun. I have used cloth nappies since 8 months old - I would like to see more people use cloth nappies because they are soft, comfortable (I hope!) and good for the environment. These are simple and basic reasons why I do what I do and would recommend these practices to anyone who asked for my opinion. However, it is impossible to escape the feeling that my way is best. Anyone who says that they don't feel this way about their parenting decisions is either lying or is a very rare and open-minded person.

We all do what we do because we think it is the best thing to do - this inevitably means that we think that those who don't do this are NOT doing the best thing. For the purposes of this argument, I am willing to admit that I sometimes feel smug when breezing up the stairs past a queue of women with buggies waiting for the lift. I feel that my way is the best way.

Wooden toys is one of that general "genre" of parenting decisions. People who are vocal about wooden toys will often be vocal about other, non-mainstream practices like babywearing (I hate that word by the way!) and cloth nappies. And people will often react to discussions of these sort of practices with negativity because, as another poster said, they perceive it as someone saying "My way is better".

It is. Of course it is. This is why, while I will advocate my way of doing things if asked, I will not start a thread saying "AIBU to wonder why more people don't use slings and cloth nappies". Most AIBU threads are posted by someone who already has a strong feeling one way or the other and thinks that many others will agree with them. When it is a thread about a parenting practice or decision, I think it is pretty inevitable that the OP thinks their way is best and is hoping for a good old chinwag with a whole host of other posters who have the same idea, possibly with a bit of smuggery about those who don't do things the same way. The AIBU section is pretty unique as far as parenting forums go - most forums will slap down a thread phrased in terms of "I think x - am I being unreasonable to wonder why other people think y".

As far as this thread goes, I read the OP and some of the other comments very much in this style - a fixed idea about the type of parent who uses wooden toys, and a fixed idea about the type of parent who uses plastic. I think the problem with applying this sort of decision-making to something like toys is that toys are something that are purely for the child, and there are a lot of fantastic plastic toys out there that cannot be reproduced in wood. It is an area of parenting where, in my opinion, it would be silly to exclude some brilliant, fun things because of a parental ideal.

Sorry for rambling on....

I agree, kunngfupannda,('babywearing' is the most dire term!!). I think that the big difference is that slings or buggies are parental decisions as are the type of nappy and the DC isn't in a position to give a preference. I think that toys are different and a DC wwill have a preference. It shouldn't be wooden or not wooden-the material is unimportant-it is the play value that counts.
I get fed up with people who say 'I do such and such and this is best'-it is only best for them. One size never fits all. If a mother doesn't want to carry her baby in a sling all the time, she is not going to be a good mother if she forces it. People should do what comes naturally to them.
Toys are different-buy the ones you like-we all do it -but if your sister gives you a bright plastic sorting box it is mean and rude to say -take it back I'm not having it in my house-get a wooden one! (I am not suggesting they would be so rude, but even the polite version is not on- to me)and it is silly to hide it away from the DC who might get a lot of pleasure from it.
DCs are with you for a very short time and they are not possessions. People would be horrified to have DH who thought the same as his mother on every matter and yet seem to think that their DC should think the same as them (forgetting entirely that the DC may take after MIL!)
I hate the control issues-they crop up all the time as in 'I am an athiest-I don't want my DC to hear about God. or I am a Christian-my DC will be a Christian-how on earth to you know what your DC will be?! Of course we bring up our DCs to our own beliefs and we encourage it, but there is no reason why they cannot be exposed to different beliefs and make up their own mind. How will a DC know that wooden is best if they don't get alternatives?
I think that people are talking about very young DCs and will have to change as they get older-the fact that they have little understanding of DC influences and crazies is shown by thinking they have grown out of toys by 10yrs. (I expect they have if they are still on wooden only and bored!).

I think it might help to have
On Children
by Kahlil Gibran stuck on the wall-especially

You may give them your love but not your thoughts,
For they have their own thoughts.

Picesmoon - I was going to make the point about forcing the use of a sling, but I had waffled on for too long!

kungfupanda - twas me with the alternative parenting comparisom.

i do on the whole agree about not thought policing our children BUT - my dd is 1! all her toys have been chosen by someone else, even if that person wasn't me!! of course people ask ME what to buy her for xmas/recent birthday - she can't talk!

she was given this by my friend for her birthday. it is now called the 'baby magnet' because it drew in her 5 baby friends instantly :-)

But if the same toy was made of plastic would you have given it back or given it away, even though it would have exactly the same play value. There are posters on this thread that would have. There a parents on this thread who would get annoyed because a relative bought a toy for their child that they didn't approve of.
DS's friend has always been a rather camp little boy, he wanted a barbie, but I don't think his parents were prepared to buy it for him, but his aunty and uncle bought him a barbie princess and carriage, he was apparently thrilled and his mum and dad were not annoyed as they realised how much pleasure it bought him.
She is only 1 but when she can start talking and state preferences or visits a friend and takes a liking to a toy surely, you would take that into consideration rather deciding DD will have this type of toy whether she likes it or not.

Love your post Kungfupannda!!! Very well put! :)

sungirltan - I think my point about the relevance of your sling comparison is more about the reasons for making choices, and particularly the reasons for talking about them, then about the choices themselves.

Every choice we make as parents says something about our overall style and about the type of person we are and the views we hold. So I don't think there is anything contentious about you praising the toy you linked to, saying you like/prefer wooden toys for whatever reasons.

What I think people do find contentious, is the way the OP and some other posts have been presented - as though there is something inherently trashy about plastic toys and that choosing wooden toys is fundamentally better and more worthy. I think Barbie is a bit trashy - but that is not because she is made of plastic - I just think she is a bit of a tart!

It just seems a shame to choose toys, which are such a massive part of childhood, based on adult ideals. When we grow up, our choices and preferences are to some extent limited by what other people like or find appropriate. Childhood should be a time when you are free from that sort of thing - if you want to wear pink and purple stripes with a green hat then you should be able to do so without your mum grimacing and insisting on Boden. If you want to play with plastic, noisy toys and imagine that you are a rocket captain, then you should be able to do that without your mum grimacing and passing you the wooden blocks.

I see the point about a small child not knowing what they are missing if they only have wooden toys, but if a parent starts off with that sort of restriction, then are they realistically likely to suddenly say, when the child is 6, "OK dear, plastic tat is now allowed."?

There is nothing wrong with having a preference, but setting it up as a goal, with associated feelings and judgements, seems very artificial.

i don't know tbh, bruffin. 90% of my friends/relatives ask me either what to buy for dd or they tell me what they have in mind and ask for approval - as i do with their children - but that seems v normal to me - if nothing else it prevents duplicates! i ask the child if they are old enough what they would like but i wouldn't buy without chekcing with the parent - thats just rude in my opinion unless they ask for something inoccuous like a book.

i dont have rules about wood/plastic though. everyone i know, knows my rule is no disney for the time being. i fully accept that i can't enforce this when dd gets older but until then, thats how it is.

Oh lord, Disney. I am with you on that one. My first job was in the Metro Centre in Gateshead, working on a little stall right outside the Disney Store. I know every bloody word to every bloody song - even the obscure ones like "Colours of the Wind" from Pocahuntas.....