to think that most welsh people should speak some welsh

[mumof2children]

i am no way fluent in welsh by know very basic welsh.

but sould more welsh people speak some welsh

HT

personally I am waiting until they re[patriate the whole country to it's roots and me and my extended family can take up residence on the bridge..... think of the views.....

(Bet those bastards would still charge me more than a fiver to get home PMSL)

TheCoalitionNeedsYou - It's not a good thing. It incourages racism. Prejusdism. People down the local having a fight because they have an Enlgish accent (I have seen this happen). It encourages people to think that the problems of the rest of the world (famine, desease, etc) are nothing to do with them because it's another country.

Also, the Welsh Assembley is not a Government. Hence how can it be a country?

SanctiMoanyArse - I didn't think having a separate Football and Rugby team is was the be all and end all (mind you, no one has ever actually seen our football team, so maybe we should just join up into a UK team). I thought that the fact that all the finances and the militery being rolled into one across the UK was more important. But there you go.

I often wonder why it really matters so much to English people that Wales has an identity of its own? I mean, does it really bother you that much? What a waste of time and energy!

"Surely we want to minimise all the made up things that allow people to pretend they are different to other people like religion, nationalism and regionalism"

you may as well be saying that we get rid of the idea of England then? yes?

I am Welsh and yep it is a country.

I'm from Wrexham North Wales and i hear lots of people speak Welsh. In my village there is one english speaking school and one welsh speaking school and the demand for the Welsh speaking school is so high that another is to be built.

I can speak Welsh so can all my family. I have lived in England for 5 years and my Husband and my Son was born in England.

I'm gutted my son is not Welsh. We have a lovly culture and i perfer Wales to England. I find that English people are a bit funny about me being Welsh and i even had to change my name as English people can not say it at all!

I will be teaching my son Welsh and even my Husband has learned some.

No one should be force to speak it but why is the langue of the country you live in not allowed to have it as a subect and give as much respect as that of other laugues?

Yes

Oops - that was to DuelingFanjo.

Well yes I take the point on the footie - luckily my boys are rugby players (mind, given that two of them play for the SN team 'players' would be a very loose term indeed ....)

But the rest of it.....

if you go out in my home town with a Welsh accent you are as likely to get a mouthful as if you have an English one here. That's becuase some people are sods and if it's not accent (which doesn't alter regardless of nationality- think my Somerset slur, a North East twang) those idiots will pick on something becuase it's really about fear of difference: racism, disablism, whatever- same thing in different forms. It's not caused by geographical boundaries but people wanting to feel superior.

And the finances aren't all rolled up are they? Devolution etc.

WRT to the military it woks as a coalition: island defence. Makes sense.

Reality is, we're border hoppers here: sold our soul to the man in the bridge years ago. And the world doesn;t change when you skip over it. But the sultures are different- that's not a bad thing. Certainly where we are that's more about liking rugby and wearing a costume on St David's Day: no harm there. Other stuff- that's not culture, that's bigotry.

So... how about we get rid of the English Language too?

"How many Welsh people don't speak fluent English? yet to meet one!"

I know personally a number of older people who do not speak fluent English. I'm sure lostinwales will second the fact that when older first language people Welsh people are admitted to hospital they often need to be able to speak to someone who understands Welsh in order to express themselves properly.

It isn't just older people either, I know plenty of people in their 20s and 30s who express themselves far better through Welsh than English. I often find myself trying to think of a word in English that I can only think of in Welsh.

After all, there is no word for Hiraeth in English...

I'm in North Wales and the only people who speak english where I am are the english who have moved here (including me). All the locals use Welsh unless addressing us english thickos who don't have the courtesy to learn the local language

I really will learn it one day - probably when my 3 kids find out I can't speak a language that they can!

The culture i'm talking about is the mining industry, Gresford mining accident where 120 people lost their lives all from the surrounding villages.

The school i went to that was build in 1804.

The fact that my family has lived round churk for over 500 years.

The welsh folklore we tell our son.

The values and belifes i have learened from my Grandpearents.

Its not bigotry to be proud of where you live where you come from and the hard work your family has done to stay alive.

I have nothing agenst any other country or culture but i'm still Welsh.

"In general though, anything that strengthens national or regional identities is a bad thing"

Why?

My national identity is part of who I am. It doesn't mean that I discriminate against anyone who doesn't share my national identity as I respect theirs in the same way that I expect them to respect mine.

No witchcat that's not bigotry at all. I applaud that.

Bigotry is when people are anti others for being from a different culture.

That's the difference.

DS4's culture is here, all he's ever known. Dragon flags, welsh cakes and the like

The older boys are mixed though; and we make an effort to acknowledge that- we still do the somerset carnivals, for example. It's good to keep in touch with your roots- as longa s you don;t start thinking those roots are any better than anyone elses.

Mind you if we could hand back the Ruder Cup I wouldn;t mind......

(PMSL- freudian slip; we've been cut up by that many BMW's this week we are indeed calling it the ruder cup here....)

Well personally I would rather the funds be put into my local hospital. I live in one of the bigger towns in Wales and they have been talking about closeing our local A+E due to lack of funds this means Thousands of people where I live have to travel 30 miles for the next nearest A+E.

This will cost numerous lives I would rather my son and thousands of other children have hospital facilities within 10- 15 miles than S4C.

I heard about the school closures today Sancti what a palaver!

Nice point domesticsluttery, there are quite a few people I know around here of all ages who are obviously much more at home in their native tongue of Welsh. And I love the word hiraeth, it's perfect!

SanctiMoanyArse are you around my way? (North Pembs?)

Of course Wales is a country, what a ridiculous comment to make.

I am Welsh, born in Wrexham & now living in Yr Wyddgrug & the majority round here speak Welsh, I am taking lessons to become fluent & my ds is learning himself in school.

I am extremely proud to be Welsh, & why shouldn't i be?

Leaving this thread now as some of the comments are downright fuckwittery.

We used to have three hospitals two have been converted to nursing homes.

LIW- we've vchatted before, when I ws Peachy - Grandad from penmbroke

School closures- ah eys,. yet roads are dead quiet and cup is going on until Monday now anyway it seems! We're unlucky though- we're on one edge of the course, and ds3's SNU is precisely over the other side of it.
So trying to work out how abd it will be to keep him home Mnday and avoid risk of traffic jams.

(Not commenting on S4C as we can't even get it, still receive ITV west here, but I certainly would ahve liked the funds spent on said cup to be spent on hospitals (our hospital was declared a risk and the maernity unit closed a day after ds4 was born- thank goodness we ahd a homebirth!), social services, the fact that DS1 is one of a large group wanting a very tiny number of palces at the specialist AS comp.. oh so many things....)

I mean, would it really have affected the golf if the hadn't forked out for blue lights under the motorway bridges? (I did ask DH, a lighting designer if he could swicth them to red which woudl give an entirely different message, but apparently not. Dammit )

Sorry rant voer, will go amke dinner PMSL

Df - I think the Indians and Americans might have something to say about that.

Well, if you really think that having cultural identity equals racism, I have to accept that we will never agree on anything. I cannot think of having such a low sense of my own identlty that I would ever form that opinion.

What is interesting about reading this thread is that I'm feeling a lot of respect and affection towards the posters who have defended the Welsh language and identity, but instead of hating the ones who want us all Anglicised, I just feel pity that they are not confident enough in their own identity to accept that the UK has more than one language. I know my own culture, my own identity: I don't need to put anyone down.

I'd like to invite you into my school in SE Wales into classes where teenagers are taught Welsh against their will.It's all so pointless. At GCSE time with my two eldest the common refrain amongst parents when waiting for results was that they didn't care whether their kids passed Welsh or not. You try working with dyslexic kids who ask you what the point is because English looks like Welsh to them.