to think that truely feminist stance on prostitution, is to support legalisation?

[StuckInTheMiddleWithYou]

I recently moved to an inner city area.

There is a known brothel here and a homeless shelter.

I have seen some very sad, desperate sights walking past our home lately.

I wouldn't want any child of mine involved in this trade, however this does strike as something which desperately needs regulating - for the sake of the women, girls and boys involved.

Prohibition has failed miserably.

AIBU?

Aitch, if it's the same thread I'm thinking of, there were at least two WGs on it.

exactly alcohol is condoned, and it won't end any time soon.

People may like drugs, but if they can't get them, then they would never have found out that they liked them. If the drug supply is stopped, if the criminals are rounded up, then people won't get hooked.

Why shouldn't sex be a commodity?

Claig, what about the chemists who are inventing new, legal highs even as we type?

"claig - I swear you live in a parallel universe!"

No, I just don't read the fantasy world of the Guardian.

why wouldn't they admit to having worked as prostitutes, then? (assuming it's the same thread).

i'm with dittany on this, make the punters the criminals and send the message to everyone, women included, that our bodies aren't and shouldn't be for sale.

What about cigarettes then? Are they less dangerous than heroin? I am smoker, and stupid, as I am fully aware that cigarettes kill vastly more people than heroin. In fact - it is not even the nice pure heroin that kills you in many cases, it is the lifestyle, the dirty needles, the adulteration of the drug etc that accompanies it.

LOL,where are these chemists inventing new, legal highs.LLyods?semichem?boots?what conspirator theory is this

Methadrone which was banned is relatively harmless compared to the hundreds more which are in China just waiting to be drip fed into the British market.

Claig I am sure if it was that simple it would already have been done. Its dangerous, irresponsible and inhumane to suggest cutting off a supply of a substance that human beings are physically and psychologically addicted to, would cost millions of pounds and will never ever happen.

"Claig, what about the chemists who are inventing new, legal highs even as we type?"

You're right. That is a problem, but the authorities are usually aware of the distribution channels of these chemicals and how they are advertised on the internet etc. I'm not saying it is possible to stop every single drug, it is a battle, but it is a battle where we can eventually be victorious, if we decide to.

But if I wanted to sell my body shouldn't I be allowed to, after all its mine and if you tell me I can't then you are as bad as a "punter"?

Yes ciggarettes are less dangerous than heroin as you cannot die from a single hit of nicotine.

Aitch, on the thread I linked, they did; Mandamumu and OFFS.

scottishmummy, have you heard of miaow miaow? That wasn't grown, like cannabis and heroin; it was put together in a lab, by a chemist. (Not a pharmacist. ) There are people out there right now making slightly-different chemical substances, and we can't ban them till we know what they are, and they're already out there by then...

I have openly admitted on this forum several times that I sold my body for sex when I was addicted to heroin.

"What about cigarettes then? Are they less dangerous than heroin?"

yes cigarettes are less dangerous. You can't suddenly die from an overdose, smokers don't commit crime to get their next packet of fags.

yes ive heard of meow-meow.chemist to me=pharmacist.as in go to chemist for your prescription

so you are referring to stimulants gbh etc made in labs?

ok i get it

See, scottishmummy, if we legalised it, we could go to the chemist for it...

Look here

oh right, that wasn't the thread i was thinking of. cheers.

The red-light district in Amsterdam is more a tourist attraction than a real brothel, at least not a brothel so as the Dutch themselves use. Most brothels are private clubs. They advertise in the local papers for staff. They even specify what kind of girls or services they want the girls to offer. The girls are mostly freelance and choose which clients they sleep with. They may also refuse certain positions, services etc and the rooms have panic buttons, CCTV etc. A lot of the girls work on an ad-hoc basis and are students, single mothers, or topping up their income. Their attitude (and that of the punters) seems to be no different to those in the UK who go out of a weekend cruising bars or nightclubs for casual sex. The difference here is that everyone is up front about it - the men pay for the sex instead of spending the money on drinks.

My information comes from work colleagues. They were the punters so it may be skewed or biased. I worked for 7 years in a factory where a lads night out was frequently a trip to a sex club. Not all the men would go with the girls - some would just use the spa facilities and drink in the bar, flirting and chatting. Some even had favourite girls and would take them presents. They didn't ever seem to treat them as objects - more as friends.

I'm posting this because Dutch prostitution is not really comparable with UK street girls. It's more like being a 'high-class tart'. The Dutch do have street prostitutes too. They are illegal, mostly addicts, and are raped and murdered. They wouldn't be accepted to work in the clubs.

Some of the clubs are run by gangsters and use trafficked girls. Some aren't. Two in a local village were shut down last year (the licences weren't renewed by the council - I don't know why), yet the nearest one to me has a road sign provided by the council, the same as the local hotels and icecream parlour.

Another interesting point to note - the Dutch government owns casinos and the profits are used to fund gambling rehab schemes.

Salizchap made a good point earlier on

"Would hate the idea that it would be seen as ok for my future DP to visit a prostitute. Yuck!
Decriminalise, yes, legalise, not ever please! Paying for sex should always be illegal, and I would want any man of mine to be left in no doubt that it is not only wrong morally (for my sake), but legally (for the prostitute's)."

In the Dutch system, it is like a boys night out. After the pub, or after a football match and after a curry, men can easily choose to buy some women for sex. is that right? What message does that give to men and to women? Most countries do not have a system like that for a reason.

"The Dutch government owns casinos and the profits are used to fund gambling rehab schemes"
so they profit by taking punters' money and then they spend a small portion of the profgits that they have made to fund the rehabilitation of the poor saps who have been ruined.

Or perhaps one day, using the services of a professional sex worker will be seen as akin to having a massage. One without a happy ending.

Claig, it is indeed seen as a boys' night out. I'm not saying I agree with it, just telling it like it is. To be honest, I was shocked when I first heard them discussing it and thought it was a wind-up.

And Dittany, yes, you're totally right about Amsterdam. There is a real problem with gangsters and organised crime, using the brothels as a front. Some of the girls turned out to be trafficked too, hence the council trying desperately to sort it out/ clean it up. The windows, as they're known, have a very bad reputation.