To think that those who persistantly start Muslim-bashing threads should get a life.

[GothAnneGeddes]

I'm sick of the same names spewing the same arguments, with the same inability to use Google to find out what other Muslim women think (as any Muslim women who post are not deemed sufficiently Muslim to matter.)

I'm sick of Saudi Arabia always being mentioned, when only about 1% of the world's Muslims live there. Talking about Saudi Arabia to condemn all Muslims should be viewed in the same manner as Godwin's Law.

If you are that concerned about the wellbeing of Muslim women, give some money to the Pakistani flood survivors.

I agree but you should maybe post your comments on those threads.

Id love to meet muslim women who dont wear the hijab and speak to them about it.

I am concerned how people of any faith can read something in a religious text and choose to ignore it-how do they justify that to themselves and ultimatly their creator? to say that for example well islam has to evolve and change with the times, well why does it? if Allah created the world and rules an laws o live well within that why should they just change because we have decided that well its not the middle ages any more times have changed wear what you like?

I have read the quran, all i could find was dress modestly and cover your hair and arms, nothing else...modesty changed depending where you are in the world, but islam dousnt change depending what country your in. dressing modestly except when your on holiday for example lol

Scurryfunge - Done. But I was that annoyed that I thought I'd start a thread about it.

I agree but,

a) Think you should post on those particular threads or hide them

b) Think that we should be able to distinguish between objections to certain articles of clothing and 'Muslim-bashing'. They are very often not the same thing.

ALL religion is bollocks IMO, just to preface this.

but i dont understand why people get so riled by the sight of someone in a hijab. i personally dont agree with the reasons for wearing them, but then i dont agree with little girls in tshirts saying 'daddys little princess'. how a person dresses and their reasons why are entirely up to them. do i get abuse if i wear trousers to work? no. its personal choice.

My best friend at school was stopped from playing hockey by her mother when she found out that people could come and watch the game and her daughter could be seen with uncovered legs.

When her mother fucked off to Pakistan for 2 months at a time she was expected to cook clean and keep the house going- at 13 - while the older male family members sat on their arses.

She was supposed to be greatful that she got to go to uni before being married off to a cousin she'd never met who grew up in a tiny village without indoor plumbing.

At least she doesn't have to worry about childcare though because he brought his mother over to live with them so she looks after her DS whilst my friend goes out to work to support them.

This isn't Saudi it's Manchester. And that's what being a muslim means to a lot of British girls and women.

I agree that the degree of general muslim-bashing, and indeed all-religion bashing, makes it hard for serious debate of intersting discussion to flourish. It will all brew up again as the Pope's visit approaches, doubtless someone will be kept awake by Eid celebrations this weekend, and so it will go on.

I agree, yanbu Goth...

'I'm sick of the same names spewing the same arguments, with the same inability to use Google to find out what other Muslim women think (as any Muslim women who post are not deemed sufficiently Muslim to matter.)'

For me there is such a diversity in what Muslim women think, and no obvious divide, as in Christianity, Protestant/Roman Catholic for instance, that it is difficult to get a handle on what they do really think. I have a couple of Turkish Muslim friends who think differently to Muslim women I've met elsewhere. Who is right?

Scaryteacher - Exactly. Muslim women are not the Borg. Like all other groups of human beings we agree/ disagree on many matters, for many reasons. That's why those threads that talk about Muslims as if we're a homogenous and awful mass are so annoying.

There is nothing to stop people from meeting Muslims, looking on various sites around the internet etc, to find this out, but instead they'd rather ask the same old questions, over and over...

narky that is one person. It isn't all.

I knew girls from a few different faiths who had the same kind of problems (especially the being treated like slaves bit), and I knew muslim girls who were given lots of freedom and were encouraged by their parents.

Yes, it is one girl. I knew others who didn't have this problem, some of whom were positively spoilt. None of them were allowed to talk to boys or visit non-muslim friends houses. All of them knew that it was their parents who would be picking their husbands- even though they could say no in theory the consequences were unthinkable.

I'm not a Muslim, yet have every respect for Muslims and Islam.

And yet, MN would be a very much less interesting place if we didn't all so freely venture to share our opinions, even if narrown-minded or ill-considered.

I'd rather take the risk of being offended my some threads (and any religion-bashing thread really upsets me) than advocate bland tolerance, political correctness or censorship...

There are many aspects of the misogynist religions I disagree with and I will continue to object, I am a human being and long before religion was invented humans existed.

You think it's bad here?

You ought to try living in a supposedly modern majority muslim country to see how piss-poorly western women are treated.

Only then will you understand what religious discrimination.

The converts, oh sorry reverts were actually the worst offenders.

Hissy - what country was that?

It was Egypt. LMHF lived in Egypt and hated it and brings it up in every single thread about Muslims to prove how bad and wicked we are.

Back to the topic at hand. What I dislike about such threads is that they involve the same posters, asking the same questions and making no attempts to educate themselves.

YANBU! Also i think many of these people are not that interested in actually listening or learning anything from Muslims to challenge their views, they are just happy to criticise all the time because they have a problem with muslims/islam, so really that is their problem. Luckily not everyone is so narrow minded.
Narky some of that is cultural not religious (the girl doing everything while men sit on their ass)

AIBU is about education.

I'm pretty surprised at that experience in Egypt tbh...have worn Hejab in Syria and have received nothing but positive reactions to it. I have had people tell me more about Islam as a result of it, but it is so well meant and they are keen to help me as a convert and I'm happy they are keen to help

I actually went shopping alone in Damascus one day for a present for my mum, got a taxi back to SIL's house and was offering my money to the taxi driver and he refused it - he pointed to my hejab, smiled and just would not take the money. I was incredibly touched.

I should imagine the Egyptians are very similar. In fact, all of the Egyptians I've met have been lovely. I think you need to go to a country with an open mind and an open heart...was wondering in the old city in Damascus on the last visit and happened to pass a factory where they make the Moasiac boxes that are so common in that part of the world. I was fascinated as to how they were made - was invited into the factory, given a tour, shown all the different wood, how they made the boxes, with DH translating and DS asleep in the pushchair. They were so pleased that someone was taking the trouble to learn more about their lifestyle and culture - its what you make of it I guess!

I've never seen so much porn and so explicit as I did in Athens, truly shocking and sold on the streets at every corner. And such a shameful exploitations of it's incredible history, I guess that's what poverty does. Although the most frightening place to be, as a Western woman, was Marrakesh....the most shameful Pataya, Thailand.

fortunately,have great muslim pals and colleagues and happy to share their hospitality and humour,lumping everyone as a homogenous group is a bit lame-like all the working mums are dis and dat threads.is annoying to see same ole clichés trotted out as if fact

I guess they already have a life but worry that the way they live it is being threatened, or at the very least is having to make too many accomodations?

Unless of course you are talking about the threads where people pick on the muslim religion directly? Report those to MNHQ for deletion.

Not bothered either way to be honest. Just thought I'd post on yet another thread attempting to close down debate.