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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to distance my family from this man because of one outburst?

84 replies

EmmalinaC · 31/08/2010 13:13

Here's the outburst...

DH and I and our DDs aged 4 and 1 were out walking in Hurtwood with a friend and his two DDs aged 4 and 2. It's a managed forest and is popular with hikers, dog-walkers, mountain-bikers etc. We've only known this family a few years but because they lived close by and our daughters are similar ages we beacme close very quickly. Anyway, we were all straggling along the track - DH and I up ahead with the younger girls, our friend behind with the two 4-year-olds - when 5 young lads on mountain bikes came toward us. DH and I stepped aside, they thanked us, I called back down the track that bikes were coming through. Our DD jumped on to the verge, his 4 year old DD stopped walking in the middle of the path. As they passed by she gave an almighty scream - eveyone believed one of them had hit her. The lads on bikes stopped to check if she was okay but before this could be ascertained, our friend, her father, grabbed one of them by the scruff, fist raised, screaming obscenities at him, threatening to kill him. The lads were terrified, the daughter still screaming. I established that she wasn't hurt 'just frightened' but still he ranted, screaming at them all to fuck off again and again, until they all did, visibly shaken. And then our friend said to his daughter 'it's alright darling, you know Daddy will always protect you' Hmm

DH and I were stunned that a grown man could be so aggressive towards teenagers in front of small children, who were visibly shaken. If it hadn't been so horrible it would almost have been funny.

He later apologised to me for swearing but frankly it's not the language that bothered me - I'm sure they've heard the word 'fuck' before - it's the complete loss of control and subsequent justification of it to his daughter.

DH thinks I'm being a bit PFB about the whole business so I thought I'd check with MN. Am I being unreasonable to not want my children spending time with this man? Or should I give him the benefit of the doubt and put it down to a bad day?

OP posts:
Janos · 31/08/2010 15:36

smellmycheese - I have lost my temper and shouted at people as well on occasion Blush, but not without good reason.

However given the circs your reaction is completely understandable - they went into the back of your car!!

pigletmania · 31/08/2010 15:37

Hindshight is a good thig Emmalina, when he was tryig to justify his behaviour and apologised for it, you could have suggested he go for help, try Mind or NHS to help with his anger as this is not normal overreaction. Mabey you could bring it up with his wife and it might be better coming from his wife that he needs help.

blackberryway · 31/08/2010 15:41

Think people are going a bit overboard here - OP says that the man was behind her so didn't hear the boys thank her, just heard her shout a warning back. Her DD 'jumped' onto the verge - presumably because the bikes were bearing down on her quite fast and they continued on even tho the other lo was still in the middle of the path when they should really have stopped. If your child is screaming you tend to assume first that there is something badly wrong with them (in fact OP says they all thought that) so its hardly surprising he was upset. Of course his reaction was frighteningly out of proportion but it was probably a lot to do with fear.

ProfessorLaytonIsMyLoveSlave · 31/08/2010 15:49

If you think that there is something badly wrong with your child (and OP doesn't say that they all thought there was something badly wrong, just that they thought one of the bikes had clipped her on the way past) then you go to the child. You don't completely ignore her while threatening to kill a passing teenager, repeatedly and at length. You might, I concede, give the teenager a piece of your mind on your way to minister to your child.

amberleaf · 31/08/2010 15:54

I think he reacted to the circs [as outlined by OP], he obviously thought his daughter was hurt.

Why did she scream? if she wasnt hurt?

...and why the hell didnt the cyclists slow down to go past?? that would P me off tbh.

I wouldnt drop him over this one incident.

Janos · 31/08/2010 16:07

Don't think so Amberleaf - it's not unusual for people to scream if they have had a shock.

I can imagine a 'what the F H did you think you were doing?' reaction, but physically assaulting someone to the point where other ADULTS around you are disturbed by your behaviour?

Really?

Ephiny · 31/08/2010 16:08

I do get annoyed by cyclists bombing along on footpaths, and not slowing down to go past pedestrians, especially children. It would be fair enough for the dad to be upset and angry, but I still think his reaction is abnormal and worrying - he physically assaulted the boy and threatened to kill him! It sounds as though he completely loses control of his actions when something happens to upset him.

blackberryway · 31/08/2010 16:13

Why do people keep saying he assaulted the boy? He grabbed him 'by the scruff'. That is not assault, even if extremely unpleasant.

OrmRenewed · 31/08/2010 16:15

I think laying hands on someone in a violent aggressive manner could be classed as assault especially when accompanied by threats and swearing Hmm

LadyBiscuit · 31/08/2010 16:16

How does anyone know they didn't slow down? If the boys stopped when the little girl screamed they can't have been going that fast. Perhaps she screamed and stopped dead because she has been shouted at a lot and is a bag of nerves?

Whatever happened, grabbing one of the lads by the scruff of his neck and threatening to kill him is not a normal and acceptable reaction, whatever the circumstances

NadiaWadia · 31/08/2010 16:16

But it can legally be classed as assualt even if you only touch someone. At least that's what DD told me when she was doing GCSE Law!

azazello · 31/08/2010 16:18

Blackberryway - it is assault. Op, can you get your DH to have a word? Otherwise can you have a quiet word with his wife to say you're a bit shocked about it and would prefer not to limit your contact with him?

traceybath · 31/08/2010 16:20

Well my first thought was god - those poor boys. I would have gone mad if someone had attacked my son like that.

He sounds seriously unhinged - he should teach his daughter to get to the side when bikes come through.

I would definitely avoid for all the reasons mentioned above.

QS · 31/08/2010 16:27

Yanbu.

I would ensure that my children are never in this mans presence again. I would also tell the wife this, so she knows the deal. Tell her that you need to protect your children from ever seeing such an outburst again, which is why you want the girls to stay friends and stay friends with her. She can make of that what she wants. I would also give her the phone number to Womans Aid and Refuge. I would also tell her that she can count on you for friendship and support, and tell her that I am very concerned for the safety of her and her children.

I would NOT let my children be in this mans presence just because your family has obligations to his kids.

laurely · 31/08/2010 16:29

I would be most unhappy at someone laying there hands on and swearing at my son and would be looking to press charges in this instance.

In no way would I want this man near my children and I echo what others have said about how he will react if his DD falls out with yours.

Goblinchild · 31/08/2010 16:29

I've been grabbed by the scruff by a male parent. The police considered it as assault and cautioned him.

Original poster
EmmalinaC · 31/08/2010 16:33

The child in question is always screaming, even if she is not hurt. She responded in the same way an hour earlier when her water spilt - an ear-splitting, high-decibel scream. It drives me round the twist but to be fair to her, her parents are frequently at loggerheads so she probably does it to get attention. It obviously works.

The boys really weren't going too fast. And they had as much right to be on that track as we did.

TBH I don't really want to discuss it with him but I might mention it to his wife, next time we meet. I suspect I might be telling her something she already knows but at least it will explain why I'm avoiding her DH. It's very difficult and a bit scary.

OP posts:
ProfessorLaytonIsMyLoveSlave · 31/08/2010 16:36

That is an assault, blackberryway. It may or may not be battery, but it is common assault.

cestlavielife · 31/08/2010 16:37

you know your child is really hurt when they are silent after being hit/after falling - if they can scream, they gonna be ok....

buy the wife a copy of "why does he do that..."
www.amazon.co.uk/Why-Does-He-That-Controlling/dp/0425191656

and have her read thru to see if he is controlling in other areas of their life - then you can support her if she decides to leave ...

chippy47 · 31/08/2010 16:41

'it's alright darling, you know Daddy will always protect you'

He wasn't doing a great job considering his DD was frozen in the middle of the track -probably overcompensating for not protecting in the first place. sounds like a jerk.

ProfessorLaytonIsMyLoveSlave · 31/08/2010 16:41

(you don't even need to touch someone at all for it to be assault; you just need to cause them to apprehend immediate and unlawful personal violence (so just raising the fist and threatening to kill him would probably do the job quite nicely even without the scruff thing).

5Foot5 · 31/08/2010 17:12

"TBH I don't really want to discuss it with him but I might mention it to his wife, next time we meet. I suspect I might be telling her something she already knows but at least it will explain why I'm avoiding her DH. It's very difficult and a bit scary."

If his wife already knows then this isn't going to have any effect.

If you can it would be better to say calmly to him that you were so shocked by his violent outburst and that you don't want your children around him for this reason. Let him know that you think his behaviour was unacceptable and unreasonable.

Perhaps hearing from someone else (other than his wife) that his behaviour is so out of order might be the shock he needs.

spikeycow · 31/08/2010 19:04

I have shouted at teenage boys before after they threatened to batter my 6 year old. They backed down without a fuss, even with their so called street attitude. But to put your hands on innocent children and terrify them is a disgrace. If the dad of the teens had walked round the corner knobhead would have backed down and quick. What a nasty nasty bully. I feel sorry for his Mrs behind closed doors.

LittleSilver · 31/08/2010 19:15

YANBU.

Would def be the end of that particular friendship for me. Godparent or no.

lazarusb · 31/08/2010 20:29

I hope the boys are alright. God help his wife and children.