to expect my family to be happy that I got married?

[beachtent]

OK, so, we planned a more traditional wedding, but my family drove us nuts with their various demands, so we cancelled it. We always wanted a small wedding, so we decided to do it all completely the way we wanted to - with two witnesses, and tell everyone afterwards. We knew our families (particularly our mothers) would be upset they weren't there to share the moment, but we thought that our own preferences for our own wedding should take precedence, so we decided to forge ahead with our plans. We got married, it took 20 minutes, we loved it, it was perfect. We had two friends as witnesses, then went on holiday. When we got back, we invited our parents round, opened some bubbly, and told them.

All seemed to be going well, until I was alone with my mum, then she started crying. I expected her to be upset and I too was sad that she hadn't been part of it all. But now her sadness about not being there, her feelings of being 'snubbed' and denied the experience of attending my wedding have dominated my entire family's response since. I expected some negative emotions in response to their lack of involvement, but the scale of the negativity is unreal. I'm getting shit from all angles. I've had my sister tell me she's 'never seen mum so upset about anything in my whole life', that she spent the entire day crying after we broke the news. My sister was crying, saying, 'how could you do this to her? How could you do this to us? We thought we were a close family' and reduced me to tears. My brother has just been on the phone and reduced me to tears again with the same kind of talk - 'what did you expect? You've denied her and she feels left out, rejected, snubbed' etc.

I'm so fed up of trying to justify myself. I got married, I didn't kill someone, I did something incredibly positive with the man I love. We've lived together for 5 years, we have a child together, getting married to us was no big deal. Both of us hate being on show, getting married felt like a very personal thing to do, and we wanted to keep it simple, short, and cheap. And we did.

My partner's family have all congratulated us and sent us gifts and cards. I've not had a single card from anyone in my family.

Have I committed a crime? I know a marriage is the union of two families, but having a child is more so (in my eyes), so we felt that getting married on our own terms in our own way wouldn't be such a big deal.

My mum now wants to take me out for lunch and buy me a present as a way of celebrating my marriage...

Thoughts, please! [bracing self]

The daft moo comment was for Marantha by the way, not expat!

That's what it was to YOU, Betty, is it possible for you to understand that that is not the case for all people, indeed, many elect to forgo marriage altogether, hope their parents aren't too 'heartbroken' about the choice those people are making that makes them happy.

And although you make a fair point expat, I can only assume that the OP's family are not of the type that you describe because they were upset.

BettySuarez No offence but I am not talking about YOU, I am talking about beachtent and she is the one who has cohabited, lived with and loved her partner for 5 years and had a child by him.
She even says herself that having a child is more of a big deal for her (than actually marrying), so I see no reason why you're upset by my posts.

Betty Listen I regard marriage as differing from cohabitation, however, most people nowadays don't so I do ask myself, if THEY don't see any difference, what is the big deal when someone gets married?
They're either the same or they are not.
And I do hope your 'moo' comment is light-hearted, else, it's not very nice.

Marantha myself and all of my friends bar non, lived with our partners before we got married but I don't anyone in my personal life who would describe their wedding day as merely 'sorting out the legalities'

How very 'Mrs Schrager' of you

YANBU at all. Completely agree with SlackSally's post of yesterday - so many people so het up about a wedding.

BettySuarez But this isn't about YOUR feelings it is about the way beachtent feels.

I quote HER: "getting married to us was no big deal'. It's not about how you (or I) feel.
Can't you see that?

FWIW, I happen to feel there is a major difference between cohabitation and marriage, but I'm trying to see it from someone else's (*beachtent's) point of view.

Forget whether or not there is a wedding involved (they seem to bring out the worst in people in RL and on MN).
Focus on the fact that you have upset your mother to the point of tears. Doesn't matter if you feel she has blown this out of proportion, she is in bits over it all.
Ask yourself how you are going to put this right. Because it is your job to take the first steps.

Of course I can see it Marantha. I too had a small but perfectly formed wedding with only my closest family around me (and they're a pretty disfunctional lot too!) infact they sound a lot wose then the OP's family.

But the op excluded (yes, excluded) her family for all the wrong reasons!

Yes, piprabbit's right, I think you should try to comfort your mum, but don't take any nonsense, either.

'I can only assume that the OP's family are not of the type that you describe because they were upset.'

Yes, but the OP herself was of that type.

And as to why some co-habitating couples marry, for some, it's a legal issue rather than being some special, gooey, make lurve day.

I know two couples who married and never told anyone, including their own children, to provide each other with the legal coverage tehy'd otherwise have to spend thousands of pounds on.

Still others are in long-term international relationships and that sort of set up cannot continue due to visa issues, so they marry.

All sorts of reasons.

My folks are very sentimental, but they're bigger people, they weren't upset DH and I eloped. It was my third marriage.

DH's folks weren't bothered, either. They were happy he married at all! They thought he never would, or have children. They were pleased.

agree with piprabbit!

expat, I can imagine that a third marriage does throw a slightly different light on things

but don't be so sure that your parents wouldn't have been hurt had it been your first wedding.

My MIL was devastated when her son (my BIL)got married without telling them but would never ever in a million years admit it to him. He proudly claims that his decision didn't hurt anyone at all, but the truth is quite different.

My parents did exactly the same thing and it was my dad's family that hit the roof (namely his father).

30 years on they're both still absolutely convinced they did the right thing and wouldn't change a thing, despite my dad admitting that his father never quite forgave him for it.

In fact my mother is so happy with the way they did things she already knows dp and i plan on the same sort of wedding and has told me 'Just as long as we can all go for a nice meal afterwards i'll be happy'

Congratulations to you, your dh and your dc

So... some of you seem to be saying that if we view marriage as something different to co-habiting, we should have invited our families to our wedding? Is there some logic there I'm missing?

We got married. We didn't commit a sodding crime. We did something really positive, in our own way, and we offended some people by doing so. We fully expected it would be difficult for some people to swallow, given that our approach broke tradition. But I seriously thought that my relationship with my family was strong enough to cope with something like this in a balanced way. So, yes, to deal with the negative emotions, and yes, to express them (I certainly did not want my mum to hide her feelings, I've never said I expected to, I don't feel the least bit shocked by her sadness about the event, just surprised at the total lack of acknowledgement of my independence and freewill, and lack of acknowledgement that I've fundamentally done something very positive).

And no, my mum is not an alcoholic but we've had a rocky relationship in the past, perhaps things would have been different if we were closer but I can only imagine. However, I always imagined getting married just the two of us, I've always seen marriage as something that is about two people cementing their connection, and have always found all the protocols and obligations around marriage to be a bit on the ridiculous side.

But I do know that my mum doesn't see it this way, obviously it was wrong of us to think it would be easier to accept our decision after the event. We didn't see it as being selfish unless being selfish is the same thing as being true to what you want to do.

My dh really didn't want his mum there, and while I actually would have been perfectly happy to have them there, he was really dead set against it. In fact, I was so acutely aware of how much it could hurt my mum that I was trying to convince him to let me invite her only a couple of days beforehand. I actually would have liked to share the experience with them, partly because I know how happy it would have made them, but I really didn't think that if my dh was so against it that I should in any way pressure him in to changing his mind. It was his wedding too, after all, and tbh I really didn't think that it was cause such a massive problem (although, as I've said numerous times, I was perfectly aware it would cause some ripples).

So - as you can see, the story gets ever more complicate the deeper you delve. And it is my ambivalence about balancing their needs with his desires, and me underestimating the level of upset it would cause, that means I'm struggling to deal with the guilt of having caused my mum to be so sad about something that I really wish she was happy about.

You've done nothing wrong, beachtent. You know it's you and your (now) husband that married, nobody else. How you do it is your prerogative. As it is always (or should be) the prerogative of everybody who marries.

Nobody should tell two other people how they (the two other people) should get married. It's not on.

'but don't be so sure that your parents wouldn't have been hurt had it been your first wedding.'

They weren't at that one, either.

I've read a lot of wedding threads on mn and the overall impression I've got from them is that it's the marriage that's important not the wedding day. Seems that's only true, for some, if it's not their child getting married.

"IF cohabiting 'nowadays' IS as good as marriage then why do cohabiting couples boher to get married at all?

Could it possibly be that it is still regarded as someting special, to be treasured. A commitment to the person that you love?"

For some it's sorting out the legalities that's important. It seems easier to get married and sort everything out in one fell swoop then to have to go to solicitors and draw up lots of documents and will to say who will get what in the event of a split/death.

My love for my children is unconditional and that includes continuing to love them even if they decide to get married with only a couple of witnesses, it's about them not me. If it happened the way it did in the op's case then I hope I'd understand they did it the way they did so that family could not hi-jack it again.

I've skimmed through the posts, but just to give my two pence....

YANBU to have had the wedding of your choice. Of course not.

However, I think the way you have handled things has been poor at best. If you knew your mum/family would be upset, you should've told them before to buffer the hurt. You didn't need to invite them, you could just have said you wanted to go off and do something yourself in the way you wanted. It would've diluted the reaction you've had now and would've made your mum feel more included as she was 'in on the secret' so to speak. And I agree with whoever said if you couldn't trust your mum to keep that secret then there are other issues here....

Honestly, you're coming across as a bit childish. I totally get why you did what you did, but the way you are posting now makes it sound less like a personal choice and more like a child who couldn't get their own way flouncing off in a strop. It's besides the point that you should have your own way (because that goes without saying!), it's just the way you've gone about it that's the kicker.

Like I said, I think you were totally in the right to go off and have the quiet wedding you wanted, but I just think the way you've handled things is a bit iffy.

Congratulations on your wedding though!

Ah, I see expat put it better (about the legalities) than me above.

I do wonder if there's some other event that people would be expected to shell out hundreds/thousands of pounds for in order to have a day they don't want when it would cost considerably less to have the day they do want.

Yes, I agree it can be about sorting out the legalities. Perhaps I am too cynical, but if a couple have lived together and got children- I struggle to see how getting wed is going to change anything other than to sort out the legalities.
I mean they've already done all the traditional marriage stuff.
So, yeah, I can completely understand why a couple pop off down the register office with a couple of mates to make things official with minimal fuss and hoo-ha.

To clarify, I think the reaction from your family is a bit excessive, but I understand entirely why your mum is upset.

God that's really sad that you tried to get him to have her there and he wouldn't allow it.

No wonder you feel so guilty about the whole thing.