more family issues - how would you respond to this reply from PIL?

[silverfrog]

Right, I fear this will be along one, so here goes.

we have a (at best) fractured relationship with dh's parents. they are toxic in the extreme, and we are currently not flavour of the month.

this stems from a big row last year, where we travelled a long way for their Golden Wedding anniversary, were treated appallingly (travel not easy for us, as dd1 (ASD) doesn't always cope well). due to several factors, but mostly dd1 being upset after the journey (overnight drive to the other end of the country), we missed seeing them for afternoon tea the day before the party. obviously the biggest crime in the world . we were due at the party the next day, family lunch at their house the day after that, family lunch at the place we were renting the day after that. plus we were staying for the week after, to see more of them too.

this led to FIL ranting at my step-children, who popped round with a box of chocs and a bottle of wine to apologise (dh and I were still calming/comforting dd1). step children were then 19 and 17, and were physically scared of their grandfather, who shouted a lot of abuse, and slammed the door in their faces. dh asked for an apology, this has never been forthcoming (sorry, just trying to give brief background to where we are now)

fast forward to this year, and PIL have been stirring things with dh's brothers. we don't get invited to BIL's 50th celebration. dh speaks to BIL, who confirms this is the reason behind non-invite.

dh is obviously hurt and upset, but trying to carry on even a fractured relationship with his parents.

so, we are holding a Christening party for our dds. sorry, but there is back story to this too. we originally didn't have dd1 Christened, but had a Naming ceremony (religious differences between dh & I, couldn't decide (amicably) which religion to go for, so hedged bets)

PIL not happy with this, and ranted on at us for years about how dd would be consigned forever to Purgatory if she died un-Christened . honeslty, FIL brought it up in every conversation we had.

dd2 came along, and we were still undecided about what to do, and also in the middle of dd1's ASD diagnosis, etc. lots of shit going on, really. so poor dd2 didn't even get a Naming.

last year, we had them both Christened, privately. dh & i had sorted out our differences, and the opportunity came up while staying with friends - there was a priest staying too (you couldn't make this up ), and he organised a quick service for us - all legit. we told PIL this last year (after the fact - it really was a spur of the moment thing, no-one was there apart form friends we were staying with)

anyway. back to today. we are finally holding a proper Christening party for the girls. It's more than that, really, as we have had a tough few years, but dd1 now settled at school - we fought the LA for that and won. we have been moving around alot to get the best school for dd1, and have recently moved again. life is feelign settled and good, and it's a time for celebration, for us. we decided to have a Christening party, as it would be a good reason to get all of dd2's Godparents together (who all know that they "missed" the Christening, as such, and are happy with this) - they haven't met as a group before.

so, we send an invite around, pretty much saying all of the above.

and PIL reply:

"Hello MrSilverfrog:
We ought to be grateful to have been copied into the many e-mail
addresses of your friends to join the celebration.

It is a great relief to learn that you eventually decided to have your
two girls christened. We have prayed for this to happen for a long
time and would have flown to anywhere to join this baptism.

A belated party for this event at such short notice is not the same
and does not convey the same spirit.

Your loving Parents."

the party is being held in 6 weeks time - a bit short notice, i suppose, but not like it's tomorrow.

dh is fuming. it just feels like such a kick in the teeth, especially following on from not being invited (due to his parents bitching) to the big family even that was his brother's 50th.

so, what would you do?

what casserole says - they haven't said whether they're coming or not in that reply to be honest

make sure the rest of the family comes and yout reat them well though

ah, now diddl, don't get me started on the whole 2nd wife thing

a couple of Christmasses ago, PIl were staying with us, and over Christmas dinner, and in front of my step-children, they decide to have their little rant about how second marriages aren't valid.

the punchline? MIl is FIL second wife

they are so fucked up it's unreal...

I totally understand that the Christening might be important to them - it is to both dh & I, which is why we wanted to talk it all through properly beofre proceeding with either religion, so we were both comfortable with what was happening.

the service we had suited us and our circumstances, which is the most important bit, tbh. PIl would have insisted on a full-on church thing, which by necessity woudl have given them chance to claim one religion over the other...

I agree with honeymoo that taken on it's own, I can understand why they might feel a bit frustrated by the Christening - impromptu Christenings aren't exactly common (sadly- great idea), so it probably feels like they were more excluded than they were. Iyswim. I presume they're also annoyed to be invited in a general email, rather than given advance warning.

Which doesn't mean that they're not a nightmare - just that (as these things do) their current behaviour is being viewed through the prism of previous crap-ness.

I agree that a calm, serene, rising above it email which is accidentally circulated to all to show your poise and warmth would be ideal

I do know what you mean about not wanting to ignore, but I just feel that the email doesn´t need/warrent a reply tbh.

I would perhaps be prepared for them to turn up on the day.

They sound like the type of people who would look to take offense no matter what.

I'd go with notquitenormal's idea

then ignore them

Have a fun time

but deepdarkwood - they weren't offended by the Christening (it happened over a year ago. probably nearer 18 months.) they were happy we had held it at all.

and I don't think this can be taken on it's own. we are coming off the back (only a few weeks ago) of them being instrumental in having dh not invited to his brother's 50th (BIL said as much)

rest of the family naturally invited, but probably won't be able to make it (live abroad, etc)

"PIl would have insisted on a full-on church thing"

So they might have taken offence anyway?

In which case, sod them!

I just feel any reply to the email & they are drawing you in to their "games".

Hmmm, I'm wondering which aspect of the christening was important to them... If it was the welcoming of your children into Christian church then you'd think they'd be happy that it had happened and leave it at that? I realise this point of view is probably not helpful

I agree with the "you're very welcome should you wish to attend" approach. It will have the dual effect of being a nice, polite and very reasonable response but will also probably piss them off enormously. Ideal!

If they are shit to you, and shit to their grandchildren... Why do you speak to them? Tell them, one more time and that is it. And mean it.

diddl, i agree re: being drawn into games, but if we don't reply at all they will think they are right, and use it as further example fo how we are always wrong (twisted, and embellished, no doubt, in the re--telling)

belle - well, quite. surely the point of their argument over the years is that it should be done? well, it has. and they're still moaning. in fact, dh & I could argue that the Christening was all the more about the Faith side if things, as there was no "show" about it. just us, as a family, the friends we were statying with (who kindly lent their conservatory as an impromptu service area) and the priest involved.

thanks for all the good wishes, btw. it will be a fun day (even more so if they are not there, if you ask me!), and the girls will love it.

sanielle - not my decision to make.

I don't speak to them anyway (or rather they don't speak to me)

But I own't issue ultimatums to dh. they are his family.

(I have said they are not to stay ehre until we can trust FIL temper, which isn't going to happen in a hurry, so an ultimatum of sorts, I suppose, but would never ask him to cut off contact)

I've only read the OP, but my first instinct is for you and your dh to be very grateful to have reason not to have these people in your lives. Honestly, I would just do my best to ignore them for the years to come.
If anyone else in the family has a problem with that, a calm and concise list of the things they have said and done ought to do it, and if it doesn't then that's sad.
I would not give such nasty people a place in my children's lives.

Perhaps as others have said then just reply "if you do feel able to attend, feel free to"?

Trying not to put "please" be there or "sorry" that...

Do you think DH will put up with it forever though, or is his camel full of straws (or something to the effect)?

Of course it´s up to your husband re his parents, but as their mother, it´s also up to you if your daughters have contact.

Especially if things are nasty/abusive..

There are some people who you don´t miss anything by not seeing.
(That´s how I feel about my ILs, anyway)

You say your stepchildren are involved in it - they're not, though, they're 17 and 19 and so can decide what to do without taking sides. I think you should talk to them about it and not think of them as involved.

I do think too much weight is being given (on the thread) to the fact that the PILs felt the Christening was so important. It still doesn't excuse their behaviour before it and now.

I think your dh should reply: "Sorry you feel that way. I struggle to see how a celebration such as this could cause offence, but I can't control how you feel about it."

And NOT leave the door open to them by saying 'come if you change your mind' - he will fret and it'd be awful if they did turn up. Not to mention that it is too 'nice' a thing to offer them.

Reminds me of the father of an American pod cast chap, quite funny pod casts and I find the ones about his Catholic father rather interesting. Kieth and the Girl fyi.

Oh that´s a good reply, MintyBadger, although I´d leave off the first sentence.

He is sorry, though. Just not apologetic sorry (I HOPE!)

Your poor DH. If IL's ridiculous has caused you to be not invited to BIL's party, it's obviously the way his family work. From the sounds of it if it wasn't you and your DH, they'd pick another family member to get worked up about instead.

You can't change them and you can't make your DH disengage from them. If this has been bad since you got together and you've had time to have two DDs I don't think he's suddenly going to change how he responds to it now. You can't protect him when he keeps allowing them into his life despite their behaviour.

Rather than getting angry or upset on your DH's behalf I would take everything they say as white noise and just smile and get on with your life. As for the christening party, I'd call and say, "Thanks for confirming you got the invite. Are you planning to come as I really need to nail down numbers for the catering- I'm terribly worried about the quiche?"

I would stop doing any running around after them/letter writing/phone calls, etc. Let them do all the running in trying to maintain a relationship with their son and grandkids. Be polite but cool towards them and keep them at arms length. You may find they start been nicer if they become scared that they might lose you. They are being toxic and if they think it isn't bothering you they are less likely to continue.

My brother stopped talking to our toxic mother for 2 years. He's resumed contact again now and she is a lot nicer to him.

I can´t help thinking if you reply saying "sorry you feel like that.." then it shows that you are bothered & I don´t think that that is a good idea with these people.

It just shows that they can behave how they want imo.

It sounds like you told them at the time.

I'd either ignore or send a 'sorry you can't make it' e-mail.

I decided years ago that there are some people (my SIL included) who you can't really react to in a normal way as they are prepared to be so much more unpleasant than normal people - best just to leave them.

minty - unfortunately, stepchildren ARE involved. they want to see aunts/uncles/cousins, so they go along. they then get to sit and listen to serious bitching about us and their siblings (always done in fornt of children) - this is not nice fo rthem, but they want to see relatives/be involved i family events. they are not able to stand up for us (neither would we ask or want them to)

I like your rpely - might change it to "it is unfortunate you feel this way...." to lose the apology link (agree, dh is sorry they feel this way, but not apologetic, but diddl is right - any mention of the word and they will see it as dh apologising for whatever slight they wish to make up)

narky - exactly. if it's not us, it's another family member. seems a bit more serious this time around, though, what with the row last year etc. we are the first to issue any kind of ban on staying etc - usually in the past it has been a case of "wait it out until favour returns", but this time dh has said he wants an apology for dss and dsd. this will never happen, and so I guess we won't be visitng them/trhey won't be staying with us anytime soon.

I see what you are saying re: protectig him while he allows this, but the whole family are seizing on me as a reason for their current behaviour. dh & I have been together 10 years, married for 8.

I don't think dh is ready to completely cut them off (would end up being huge rows, andprobably his brothers as well as his parents, the way things are at the moment). and i think he would end up resenting me for it, despite me not asking for it to happen - before I came along (and then the dds), the family games went on, but in a more generalised fashion.

I am the first DIL to say I won't have them around my dds if they behave in this way, and stick to it (aside form public party events, where they would never behave badly towards dds - too much at (public) stake). this makes it (in their eyes) my fault.