because judging by the reaction of the old 'dears' around me, I fear that maybe I am ...

[plonker]

Ok, so let me set the scene

Me and the 3 dc shopping in ...no, I'm not telling you where in case it clouds judgement

We are at the end of the 'big' shop and have loaded the shopping on the belt. Dd's have some sweeties (unopened btw, just clarifying) and have sat down on the seats opposite the till whilst I load the shopping.

Dd2 (7yo) and dd3 (3yo) have an, ahem, altercation, resulting in my angelic 3yo pinching her sister whilst mt equally angelic 7yo boots her in the shins in retaliation. Juuuust your typical shopping trip

Anyway, I took the sweets straight off the girls (obviously) whilst they protested their innocence. They were told quite clearly that fighting children do not deserve treats. The children apologised after a few minutes and apologised to each other giving each other a hug. All going well, yes?

So (and here is the part where I think I must have committed some huge faux pas), I accepted the girls' apologies and gave them back their sweets

Dear me, the tutting that ensued from an elderly couple behind me because that "never happened in their day ...naughty children shouldn't get rewards ..."

Was it really so bad to give the girls the sweets?

Was I unreasonable?

Go on, give it to me, I can take it

I think what you did was fine. Sweets were a little reward for well-behaved children, they stopped fighting and behaved, you gave them bakc the sweets.

No point making a big deal of a tussle at the supermarket.

you were right,old folk don't have anything else to bother about just ignore them and do what you think is right you knoe your kids they don't.

Actually I mentioned on the first page I thought sloany had a point and I do use chocolate as a reward occasionally. Having listened to your POV sloany I totally get it.

I'm not saying I will change overnight but me and ds had chinese tonight - we do this once a month on a Friday. He asked me if he had been good today and when I said yes he asked if he could have a chocolate. Thinking about what you'd said I answered he could have 1 but not for being good he could have a sticker for being good and if he got 15 he could have the water pistol he saw in the corner shop tonight. He has been a saint since then Gotta be something in this earning a reward thats for keeps not one that can be digested in 5 minutes 10 seconds.

so can I clarify - if ds asks me for a snack (usually offered fruit/toast etc) and I offer chocolate as he's been really good/ helpful etc is that giving food as a reward?

Thats not a dig genuinly interested.

Mumbar - It is if you say "you can have chocolate as you've been such a good boy today".

If you give the chocolate without saying a word about behaviour or anything related to it, then its not, regardless of why you choose to give it.

See I tend to give chocolate if its been quite a while since they've had any and I happen to have some in, and perhaps if I happen to want some myself. It would probably also have to be at a time where I was satisfied they'd eaten enough of the other food groups (chocolate is a food group in its own right y'see) as well as it would possibly take up room in their tummy and stop them eating something of more nutritional significance. But sometimes I dont think about it too much.

So the decision to eat something like that is based on various factors that aren't known to them - but never on behaviour or lack of good behaviour.

pjmama - yes, that's basically how I saw it.

Maybe with hindsight I should have withdrew the sweets for the day as a consequence of their bad behaviour.

To be fair to them though (and I'm not justifying their behaviour ...) they didn't moan at me taking the sweets off them, they handed them straight to me, and it was a good couple of minutes before they apologised so it wasn't a knee-jerk reaction to get the sweets back, they'd genuinly apologised to each other. Anyway, that's quite besides the point ...

Good to see we're all in agreement re the nosy old tutting buggers

... ahh but they made you think, didn't they ?

oh yes, they certainly did that ...I thought lots of thoughts when I was listening to them

If the apologies were real ones and not ones where the child is forced to lie (if they don't mean it it's basically lying imo) then I would have given the sweets back too.

I quite like the not using rewards thing though, Alfie Kohn writes some interesting books about it.

Plonker - I wouldn't have given them the sweets back at that stage no. I would have told them they could have them later if they behaved themselves, but that would have been the same regardless of what the 'treat' was.

Sloany - I admire your attitude to food :)

Plonker - simply because I think they very quickly learn to 'apologise' to get the 'treat' and not because they mean it - and because I would have been annoyed with them 'showing me up' in the shop

If you hadn't given the sweets back to the kids the old dears would have said how mean you were being when they'd kissed and made up! You can't win!!

Hmm, I see what you mean chipping. But the apologies were genuine. I'm sure of that. I get many insincere apologies off them and have become an expert in spotting the difference

As for them 'showing me up' why do they insist on doing this?!

You were rewarding the forgiveness not the naughtiness and fighting. Had you not given the sweets back, there would have been no reward to continue the apology, and the fighting would have continued in another form.

Children need to know their boundaries, but that doesn't mean unecessary further punishment out of spite or "teaching them a lesson" (that they won't understand) A punishment must have an end, and for a small squabble, I think you dealt with it very well.

Because they can

I am always coming across old people who do things like this, especially in supermarkets. The best thing to do is just ignore them. They obviously have nothing better to do and need to make their day more interesting. I can just hear them later in the day talking about it to every person they come into contact with. I wouldn't worry about it if i were you.

Oh why do people have to go on about old people doing stuff like this? The age of the rude person is completely irrelevant!

Yes, I'm really enjoying this thread, especially Sloany's thoughtful posts, but could we avoid "coffin dodgers"?

Although, seeker, I suppose one could argue that the commenters made their age an issue with "in my day...".

tbh, if the promose of the return of the sweets meant that my kids sat quietly whilst i paid and packet and got to car - id have done it.

however my moral highground part of the brain (whichhas shit all to do with how it happens in reality!) says that once sweets that have been took offf kids shouldnt be given back, and in front of the old dears you should have said to the kids " you have proper shit your luck with me now" give em sommat to tut at

TSH - when you're my age, 60 suddenly doesn't look so elderly!

Actually in my experience, the only tuts and insensitivities I have experienced have been from 20/30 somethings. But if I was to post about it, I wouldn't mention their age because it is irrelevant!

tscc - Oh well done you! Well done your nethers! Well done Frankie!

(now are you sure you've go the right name .....)