To think that we should take turns getting up..

[Craftynap]

Hi
Long time lurker here, in need of some impartial opinions on a specific issue please.. if there are any men around yours would be particularly welcomed..

Bit of background: have DD (4) and I?m due no 2 in September. I've been on maternity leave for 3 weeks now, but before that worked a minimum of 3 days a week. DD is at nursery for those 3 days. I'm finding this pregnancy very hard work physically , have (not very severe) SPD.

He works physically very hard (window cleaner), usually 5 days a week, sometimes 4. He is up early on 2 of those days.

Lots of issues in our relationship, too much to go into here. I could fill a book...

DD has slept through twice, ever. Those 2 times in the last week. It's been a bloody nightmare really. I have done all nights since she was born, bar a handful. She is generally up for good at 6.45 ish.

What generally happens at the moment is that she comes in to get me when she wakes and I get up with her. Quite often (this has only started recently, in the last 6 months or so) on a Sunday I persuade her to go and get daddy, and I get an hour or so lie in. P usually stays in bed until he wakes (apart from Thursdays and Fridays when he gets up early), usually an hour or 2 later. For example, this morning I was up with DD at 5.00 (briefly) then up for good at 6.45. P got up at 8.45, went to work.

I don't think this is fair at all. I think that we should take turns getting up with DD when he is not getting up early, and this should mean him actually getting up when she does, not waiting for me to send her to him, after having spent half an hour up anyway persuading her to go through.

He thinks that is as it should be, as he works physically hard most days, and brings in most (by no means all) of the money. He says I don't understand or appreciate what it is like to work hard, and the responsibility of being the main earner.

It's not really the getting up that does my head in, it's the unfairness. If he got up at the same time as me I would not have a problem. I have been hugely resentful about this (on top of loads of other things) for months.

So. Am I being unreasonable? I intend to show P this, hence the request for male opinions, as he thinks you're 'just a lynch mob, basically'. I am totally prepared to admit I am wrong and shut my gob.
I'll try and get back to this later on today.

hmm tricky one. I know exactly where my DH stands on this matter. Whilst i'm on mat leave and he is working (so weekdays) he will expect me to do nights/v.early mornings so that he isnt a wreck in the office. To be honest I agree with this, considering the type of job he has (i have the same job and i know i can't function properly doing it with little sleep, considering the high stress of it already, any mistake can cost a serious amount of $$). On weekends he sees that as his time to let me have some rest, take over the night duties and give me a break, also means he gets to bond a bit in those hours. Obviously if i'm unwell this needs rethinking but generally i think its a fair way of doing it and would do the same in his shoes.

However i must admit in your situation you DH could easily get up at 6am with your DD and entertain her before work. Especially if he has had a full night of sleep!

I'm a SAHM. On days when DH has to get up for work, I do the night time waking and getting up early. At weekends we get one lie-in each. If he's off work, we take it in turns to get up.

We're both parents and that is a 24x7 job which is just as tiring as any other job. When DH is out at work, the childcare is my full responsibility. When he's not working, it's 50/50.

DP and I took and continue to take turns.

It's the only fair way IMO, it doesn't matter how physical your job is once you get used to it, you won't be any more tired.

We've always had the arangement that I get up with DD on week days (am on maternity leave and DH works full time) and at any time in the night if there is a problem, which is admittedly very rare. Then we alternate on weekends, so DH will get up with her on Satuday and me on Sunday (or vice versa - it's not an official rota).

DD is a lot younger than your DD though, and I go back to bed when she does for her morning nap and have a nap as well.

I'm on our husband's side for the most part here - you definitely should be doing the nights/mornings when your DD is in nursery because you can catch up on your sleep during the day. You should alternate on weekends so you both get a bit of a break though.

I don't get the argument that the blokes have to be "alert" for work while it's acceptable for us SAHMs to be exhausted while we have total responsibility for a walking accident machine. You NEED to be rested as a parent so that you can keep up with your kids and make sure they aren't eating wires, drinking bleach or attempting to cut off their own ears!

My DH have always shared getting up responsibilities, especially now that I'm pregnant again. I try to do the most that I can but I'm just too knackered sometimes and DH needs to help.

I was a SAHM mum. The theory with DD1 was for me to do the nights when he had to get up in the morning and he would do the other two, ie. Friday and Saturday night.

In practice it never worked. I believe men are wired differently and he never heard her crying so in the end it woke me, I then had to wake him to go and sort her out and it all seemed a bit pointless in the end.

With DD2 I did it all, even though I had a 4 year old at the time.

Why does your 4 year old not go through the night?

Although when you're both working you should take turns, missed that bit!

I agree with pjmama.

As a rule of thumb, it seems sensible that if one parent is at home, and one working, then the SAHP takes responsibility for night time waking and early mornings. Not because being at home is just 'easy' (it isn't!) but because at least at home you haven't got the pressure of having to be on 100% top form, meeting clients, delivering a service to a required standard, or possibly doing a physically demanding or risky job. On the absolute worst days, after a rotten night, you can at least stay in your pyjamas and feed the kids sandwiches. Where one parent works part time, just adjust responsibilities on a pro rata basis. If both parents work equally outside the home, take it in turns. This worked really well for us. I worked part time when my kids were small, and took responsibility for nights and mornings when I wouldnt be working the next day. Other nights we divvies up equally. While home on ML I did all the nights and early mornings. Weekends, do one day each.

Squitten Tue 03-Aug-10 10:39:51
I don't get the argument that the blokes have to be "alert" for work while it's acceptable for us SAHMs to be exhausted

Couldn't agree more

i'm a sahm. during the week i do all the getting up during the nights(less so now as they are 4 and 6). i get up early to get dc ready for school etc so normally up for 0645. on saturdays i get up early to take dc to football so dh gets lie in and easy breakfast as we are out till 1045.
on sundays he gets up
when ds2 was a really bad sleeper we would take it in turns because it really was bad
by the way you are working very hard growing your baby!

X Post with Violethill

Problem is when you're pregnant with SPD (which I also had and even in its not-severe form it was soooooo painful) even getting a good nights sleep without a waking 4 year old is difficult, or it certainly was for me.

My now 2 year old DS2 is also no way going to let me stay home in my pj's and feed him sandwiches.

I feel it has to depend on the child and if yours is demanding then the parts the other parent is home for should be shared.

It's not an argument about 'blokes' and SAHMs though is it?

I feel the same whichever parent is working or at home.

At the end of the day, being at home is not the same as working. Of course you have to prevent your children from coming to harm,that's stating the obvious.

But you don't get performance management for playing with the kids, cooking lunch or doing the housework. No one;s going to give you a bollocking if lunch is ten minutes late or you don't get round to doing the laundry, or the kids are in their pyjamas til 10 am! There are totally different pressures in the working environment, precisely because you're being paid to do a job, and no one will make excuses for substandard work just because you've had a sleepless night. And in many jobs, you cannot safely function if you aren't alert, on the ball - oh and smiling too.

On my most challenging days on maternity leave, with a newborn, a toddler and a 4 year old, the most stressful thing I had to do was get them all out to walk to school for ten to nine. Hardly comparable with doing a days work.

Regardless of what's 'fair' or not, surely your DD should be sleeping through at 4 - what have you tried to deal with this? In the morning she is old enough not to disturb you ... has she got a clock so that she knows what time she can come in to your room? Has she got things she can quietly do in her room rather than waking you up? Do you allow her to get up on her own to watch TV or a DVD?

I'm a SAHM so do any night wakings and get up in the morning monday-friday. Main reason is that DH has to drive an hour to work and I would worry about him doing that if he was lacking in sleep and exhausted.

We had a lie in each at the weekend before DD2 was born 6 months ago, but now I have to get up to bf the baby at 6am-ish so I just get up with them as I can't get back to sleep at that time anyway. Once I stop bf i fully intend to get my weekly lie-in back!

Parenting is a full-time job and should be shared IMO.....especially when you are pg and need to get as much rest in while you can! He's being unreasonable to lie-in every day IMO.

6.45 is an acceptable time to get up

she'll be at school soon and you'll need to get up anyway to get her and your new baby ready

do you sleep in separate rooms - is that why you tell dd to go and wake your partner up?

One partner shouldn't be getting no sleep while the other gets to stay in bed til 8.45.

He's a window cleaner ffs

Disclaimer; nothing against window cleaners

Yeah...I don't get that 'he needs to be alert for work', either. I am on summer holidays with DCs 4 and 2.10. DH works, but gets up with both every morning, does breakfast, etc. It's the only hour he gets with them apart for when he's home in the evening, and I'm with them all day, so it's a 'break' for me, and quality time for him.

We take turns having a lie in on weekends.
Working for either parent is a choice. Parenting is not.

it isn't about blokes at work vs mums at home. I have exactly the same job as DH and i know if i am not 100% it is easy to make a mistake and if that mistake costs $500k to rectify it is a massive issue. I'd rather be a tired SAHM for a year than have my DH making expensive errors at work or making a bad impression when meeting clients etc.
I appreciate SAHMs do a job too, but it can be done at 70% aletness, and if you dont want to tidy today you dont, and if you skip the trip to the pool you do...it is very different and non gender based! If my DH were a SAHD and i went to work i would make him stick to the same standards!

I was a bit surprised at that too, Boys2mam!

Most people doing a days work would be up at 6.30, maybe 7 at the latest and out the door by 7.30 or 8 (in my experience anyway!)

I agree that if the working partner very late starts, then it makes sense to negotiate. The OP did mention that he does two early morning starts though, so perhaps by this she means really early, such as out at 6 am, in which case maybe he sleeps in longer on other days.

I think the biggest factor for the OP though is a 4 year old not sleeping through. That would worry me a lot, and needs dealing with. Maybe she's put to bed too early? hopefully starting school will wear her out and improve things

Exactly coraltoes. It's not about a competition to see who works hardest - it's a simple fact that when you're at home, you don't have to meet certain targets.

When the day arrives that an official arrives at your door, checking that the children are washed and dressed by 8 am, that lunch is on the table not a minute later than 1 pm, and indeed, observing the parent playing with the child, and scoring them on interaction, creativity etc - then being at home with children will be the equivalent of paid work! It simply is a different role - one that can be hard, stressful and tedious at times, but ultimately one where you aren't being measured and required to perform to an exacting standard.

In my line of work (secondary school teacher) I need to be 100% on top form. A class of 30 teenagers can be very unforgiving if you arrive unprepared, or tired, or just having an off day. On the other hand, I could always function at home on about 75% if I needed to.

Couldn't agree more with Violet

Surley if you are at home all day you can catch up on a snooze at some point? Or even just a lie down for an hour while DD does something quiet?

I always did weekday early mornings but I would just bring her into our bedroom, where she had a few "quiet" toys to play with. By the time she was 3 she had a clock in her room and knew not to come out until 6.30,unless she was upset etc.

Your DD should beable to entertain herself in her own room, till a reasonable time. She also should be sleeping through the night. You need to sort this out before the new baby arrives, or your life will be very difficult! Try a reward sticker chart, with a great big bribetreat for every 3 nights she doesnt wake.

Good Luck!

In the main, when he's working full time, then I get up in the night times. But we'll share the early mornings, some mornings he'll be with ds until it's time for him to go to work, so mornings I'll give him a lie. And weekends we share, depending on what we're doing. We treat each other with love, respect and honesty and so if one person is knackered, the other will step in and vice versa. Or if I'm getting naptimes to sleep in during the day, he'll have a lie in and do some of the housework at night so I can sleep in a naptime. It's just caring for each other. It shouldn't have to be a battle of who is most tired or does the most important work if you love each other.

My dp recently got made rendundant so I'm working fulltime and he's looking after ds. Been an eye opener for both of us. He know appreciates how exhausting full time child care is, and I now know what it's lime to come home after a day of work to a knackered partner! I'd reccomend it to everyone, has made us love and respect each other more!

I would work on getting your daughter if not sleeping through then entertaining herself till a certain reasonable time of day, at that age.

Whilst he probably has to be reasonably alert at work, you also have to be reasonably patient with your toddler during the day (if you are severely sleep deprived, and she is challenging you, things could go wrong in a way you never quite anticipated).

You are also growing a baby and that can give a certain level of deep bodily tiredness that simply working hard or getting up early cannot.

You have plenty more getting up in the night aahead of you.

Therefore, work or not, I feel your DH should step up a bit even if it means you need to draw up a "shift" pattern that is slightly in his favour.

"Surley if you are at home all day you can catch up on a snooze at some point? Or even just a lie down for an hour while DD does something quiet?"

Hmmmm...have you never been a SAHM??

Sorry, I don't care how stressful your job is(I was a secondary teacher in a rough school...was good at it, and didn't need to be 100% all the time). Most people work with adults, can go to the bathroom alone, have a few minutes to eat lunch in peace, and get to drive home in relaitve silence.
My DH works a very stressful job, but it ENDS. Staying at home is relentless...especially when the kids are small.

I am not arguing that SAHM is harder...won't get into that, but I still think that partners should share nighttime responsibilities no matter what their work/staying home situation is. The OP is pregnant, which is exhausting on it's own...add a 4 year old to that, and it's doubly so.

Generally as a SAHM / carer i'd get up if Dh working and I do all the nights anyway due to BF

down days could be shared but tbh its nice to get up together but that's just us

However

in this case:

OP has been working until very recently and is presumably fairly heavily pg + spd

so he should be sharing based on that imo

and saying she doesn't get what it is to work hard is just a bullying tactic

but you see we dont know enough about the other issues and that matters- is he someone who habituallly puts people down to enforce his will? (if so run); are the relationship issues based on trust prioblems from a specific event (in which case this couls be classsic poweer struggle)

basically, issues dont exist separately: look at the whole to understand this