to think that DS (11) doesn't need to be taught about paedophiles?

[LadyCad]

He's had SRE lessons in his last term of Y6. He is now full of questions about paedophiles; why?, where?, how?, what would they do with me afterwards? and so on.

The teacher approached us in the playground last year when DS was in Y5 telling us that DS didn't know the meaning of the word paedophile and we might need to explain it since thay had now "done" it in school. He was 9 then. He said he was the only child in his class that hadn't heard of paedophiles.

We have taught "stranger danger" from a young age, but we've always said stuff like "people might want to steal you and you'd never see us again, or they might even want to hurt you". We've never felt it necessary to go into such detail.

Now he's clearly disturbed, and his younger sister (9) is hearing all the questions too.

Have we been naive?

"Seeker, I will be quoting that to my DS in 2 years time. But for now, I don't think he would comprehend "sexual feelings" He's not the most mature of 11 year olds."

I'm sorry - you need to talk about sexual feelings before that - he's 11, he will be having them soon, even if he hasn't already. And he will have seen them on telly, and his mates will be talking about stuff.

Kids need good, clear information. Ignorance and innocence are not the same thing at all.

Yes agree with you there seeker.You can't leave "chats" until they're 13 or 14- there is no need to sensationalise, it's just coomon sense.

I'm going with YANBU.

Which doesn't fit in with my attitude that I believe it best for children to be brought up from the start with an open approach to talking about sex and their own bodies, or what my own DD (5) already knows.

The reason I think YANBU is the way it seems to have been handled in school. I have no problem with them talking about personal safety in school. But I'd be very unhappy with the following facts:

• parents having no idea that a sensitive topic was coming up.
• the fact that the teacher didn't feel comfortable explaining to your DS what the word meant when it was used; if they can use it in class they should be able to explain it. How do they really know that the other children who have 'heard' of it actually understand what it means?
• that these two put together make me really worried about how the teacher would have handled a child disclosing something about abuse in the class situation.

I also think that there is a danger of using things like 'stranger danger' and describing people as 'bad men/women' to talk about risks with children. It distances them - when a sexual predator is far more likely to try and develop some kind of relationship with the child first. So you either need them to distrust everyone because they could potentially be a bad person, or your warnings will be less effective. I completely agree with Hecate that its far more useful to talk with them continuously about everyone having a right to their own personal boundaries, nothing ever removing that right except the person giving consent, and what to do if that right is breached. And that you don't need to keep a secret if it makes you uncomfortable, you can always speak to who you trust about it. It doesn't have to take away innocence - it applies as much to being teased or tickled by someone, as to hitting another child, as it does to sexual abuse.

Very sensible time to teach it in my opinion as many will gain more independence with the move to secondary school (eg walking a distance home without parent, catching bus etc).

He's 11, he's not a little boy any more. I think you need to find out what the school have told him if he seems "disturbed" by it and is not just asking questions to be curious/reassure himself. You need to emphasize that it is quite rare and very unlikely to happen to him, but that if he thinks someone is behaving inappropriately towards him or his friends then he should tell a trustworthy adult. The school may not have handled the issue sensitively enough for a nervous DC - I know my DS would have found all SRE quite challenging at that stage.

This is the problem with not telling your DCs things before they are covered in school, I'm afraid - you don't get to choose how they are dealt with. But IME the school are probably experienced enough to know when is the right to time to teach things and if everybody else in the class knew what a paedophile was last year then it was certainly not out of place to cover it in an SRE lesson.

Unless you have home educated your child in a bubble he WILL have heard the word before. And he WILL have heard stuff from other children. He is far more likely to be 'disturbed" by playground chat than a SRE lesson!

I worry about fetishising 'innocence'. Knowledge protects and 'stranger danger' is a diversion from the reality of abuse by family and friends. If your son didn't already know, then shame on you for not preparing him.

I have never had to use the word paedophile when having the chat, as our Chat was about keeping your body safe, private parts being your own private business and ensuring an open dialogue where DD can ask questions and talk to me about anything without me going off the deep end.

btw; the OP says her son was 9 not 11.

Not that being 9 means that conversations about these things shouldn't be had - but 2 years can be a big difference in what knowledge and language is appropriate for individual children.

9 when it came up in school - obviously not now.

yabu, I knew about "perverts" when i was much younger than 11, kids need to have some sense of why a very few adults might want to hurt them, and how to spot those persons.

I just wanted to say thank you for this thread. DD1 is off to secondary school in Sept and I have been wondering if I ought to have a chat with her about this sort of thing. She's familiar with sex education as I've always answered her questions as they arise, she has a book that she refers to often aimed at her age group etc. However we've never talked about paedophiles, just about not keeping secrets etc.

Having read the thread I do think I will talk to her as she's about to have a whole lot more freedom than ever before. A big thank you to Seeker for her post way up about what to say.

No - the OP's ds is 11 - says so in the thread title. Younger sister is 9. Doesn't matter anyway - 9 year olds need information too.

I think YABU. As others have said, the chances of being sexually abused by someone you know are much higher than the chances of being abducted by a stranger. So warning children about strangers only is really misleading as to where the actual dangers lie. This also then feeds into rape myths when children get older - it feeds into the belief that the danger is from people lurking in alleys, which is generally not the case.

There is certainly a convicted paedophile living in my village, and according to my neighbours, a child sex offender on my street. I know this because I live in a tiny place where everyone knows each other. Many people in towns and cities also know sex offenders - they just don't know who they are.

Your child is a boy about to enter puberty. Learning about consent and about what to do if you feel uncomfortable with someone else's behaviour is essential knowledge not only for his own safety but for the safety of girls and boys he may become involved with as he enters secondary school. I say that as a mother of a boy and a girl of similar ages to your child.

I agree, as sad as it is they do need to know.
If anyone was abusing my daughter Id want her to know exactly what that person was and that it was wrong and ok to tell me.

At 11 the other kids will defineitly be talking about this at school in the play ground. i would always prefer my children to hear the truth from me before they heard inaccuracies in the playground.. on lots of subjects not just peodophiles.

erm, it does. Right here:
"The teacher approached us in the playground last year when DS was in Y5 telling us that DS didn't know the meaning of the word paedophile and we might need to explain it since thay had now "done" it in school. He was 9 then. He said he was the only child in his class that hadn't heard of paedophiles."

I did say when it first came up - and yes, it would have been much better to deal with it then knowing it would likely come up again the next year (as it did and he now has more questions).

I'd rather my child learned about paedophiles in the safety of his classroom than find out about them from first hand experience.

Forewarned is forearmed!

knowledge is power and it absolutely staggers me that any parent out there would not protect their children by making them aware of this issue by age 11.
By doing so you are not keeping your children 'innocent' you are keeping them at risk.

OK. A few things to clarify.

DS hasn't been brought up in a "bubble" at all, he is familiar with all the usual playground talk from children of that age and we've always talked openly about sex and relationships. I've overheard him chatting about sex to his friends for a couple of years now, all fine and he's been quite happy about it.

The "stranger danger" talk wasn't exactly as I portrayed it, I made the mistake of saying in my OP "we've said stuff like" instead of explaining clearly how we've approached it. We've said that strangers might want to take you to be part of their family and then questions such as "will they hurt me" have followed. He's been aware from the earliest age about not letting people touch him in inappropriate ways/ways that make him feel uncomfortable.

I do accept that we perhaps have been a bit vague and woolly about the peadophile thing, but actually he has been aware of paedophiles and associated danger since the talk in Y5 (in fact our response was along the lines of the much-feted seeker's, ie "something wrong with the way their brains work") , it's just that the questions have come up again and I fully admit I'm finding it quite hard. He's a boy that likes to know everything, but he is quite immature emotionally/socially (he's a summer baby as well). He's just very "young", iyswim. I don't think we're guilty of keeping him so, certainly not intentionally anyway. The fact is he is disturbed by the talk at school, despite me answering many, many questions as clearly as I can. He isn't disturbed because we've kept him in an over-protected bubble, he's disturbed because no matter how hard I try to explain and how much I reassure him he simply cannot comprehend it.

But then, paedophilia is incomprehensible and disturbing I suppose.

Having read through the thread I think that possibly IABU but I do think the school should have let us know what they were going to cover in the lessons last year. I would much rather it had come from us first.

I am now wondering what the school has actually said. As you've told him all about inappropriate touching and my "much feted' (first time for everything!!) definition, and he's aware of sex and sexuality, I'm not sure why his questions aren't answered by "Well, the proper word for the sort of people we've we've warned you is paedophile" If he's still worried, then it does sound as if the school has said something else that's bothering him.

Maybe.

He's a boy that thinks a lot, I suppose you could say over-thinks things sometimes. E.g. in the petrol station yesterday afternoon;
"So do you get paedophiles in the animal kingdom Mum or is it just in humans because it's associated with loving feelings? It must be to do with loving feelings because people only want to do sex with people they love, don't they?"

This is fairly typical, I then go on to explain about how paedophiles are wired up wrong and he asks "So is it like mental illness then? Shouldn't we be helping them rather than putting them in prison? If they had thoughts about sex with children but didn't actually do anything could they see a psychiatrist to stop the thoughts or would they be arrested just for having the thoughts?" This is all without a pause for breath and whilst I'm trying to ask the cashier for a VAT receipt for the petrol.

He does suffer from anxiety on and off and I think this is a topic that he's just finding it hard to get to grips with because he wants to understand.

But we can't understand it can we?

This thread has helped me to think it through myself without shirking the issue and brushing it off with "he's too young"...so thanks

I think if he's asking the questions then he's not too young for the answers. They are pretty smart questions he's asking, to be honest -- he sounds like a bright boy. And it's great that he feels able to talk about it with you.

as someone who was assaulted at 8 years old by a paedophile. Yes i would agree with them learning about what monsters are out there and how they lure young children into a false sense of security. They are everywhere,in schools,churches,you name it ,they are hiding in some guise somewhere.