(and I know this might be a little contravesial but) do you thing we're all being a little too judgemental?

[loopyloops]

There seems to be quite a lot of judging other people's choices going on (on here and in RL). Do people do it because they are genuinely concerned, or because they like to feel a little superior? Isn't it better to express your beliefs on things (ie. breast v bottle, smoking/drinking in pregnancy) without talking about it in terms of judging people?
Sorry if this offends anyone, but I wonder if the reason the media judge Mumsnet so negatively is perhaps because there is this culture of holier-than-thou going on?

Thoughts, please.

YANBU - It's not the judging that is so bad on here. It's the fact that a lot of some mumsnetters on here are so completely tactless when it comes to expressing their opinions in even a slightly polite fashion.

IMO it doesn't make any difference that I'm posting to people who on the internet and therefore faceless. They are still real people in real life !

I would never write a comment on mumsnet that I wouldn't say to someone's face in real life - be it stranger or a close friend. And I think a bit of politeness and tact when giving an opinion is just part of trying to be a kind, caring human being. I think there is also a huge lack of understanding on here sometimes too. Just because someone on here doesn't agree with someone else's point of view, doesn't make them right. And I do try to live by that rule myself! Unless of course, we're talking about mums blowing fag smoke in their newborns face .

The way some views are expressed by the judgeypants brigade on here just seem so unneccessary sometimes and, yes, that makes me sad also

Ah, now I drank (very much in moderation) with all three of mine. No-one told me not to TBH. The youngest is nearly 11.

I have to have some sympathy with smokers here, because whilst I'm not addicted to alcohol, I would begrudge having to give it up entirely. I don't know what I'd do if I were PG now. I guess as I'm very old and have had three 'normal' children, by the old rules, I would still drink. But I would drink less, and feel much worse about it.

Yes, quite, do we need any more guilt?

LL - no, there is no need to be rude. I think I would agree with Chathappy - if you wouldn't say it in RL then I wouldn't say it.

I have to disagree there Porridge. I think the beauty of MN is that we can dare to say things that we wouldn't always say in RL. Sometimes things need to be said, but we don't for fear of falling out with friends, or being punched by total strangers! The skill is not to take the privilege for granted, and allow it to descend into spiteful personal comments and overly judgemental insults. If we must judge, then we should qualify it rationally, and always try to remain calm and pleasant.

I agree with chathappy. You don't have to agree with someone but there is no need to be rude.

yanbu
we all judge
but sometimes like the nasty thread about a media person in chat, well we forget that no one is perfect

I don't mind that you disagree with me FN as your posts make me larf

Glad to be of service. It's the frustrated writer in me.

YANBU the judging is absolutely horrible, we are not perfect parents and do things that we ought not to at times. I dearn't reveal some of my true feelings as I might indeed get flamed, reported etc. Some on here are judging, they don't know the person or the situations, can totally put you off tbh, when at times you need to talk or want support.

I have only been a member on here a few months, but I still haven't plucked up the courage to actually start a thread on AIBU as I dont think I could hack the responses ! (and there are nearly always a fair few bad ones on each thread whatever the subject is !).

So, like the coward I am, I prefer to read everyone elses and comment on theirs instead

I like coming here for a good judge too Booyhoo. I can bitch and rant all I like.

The one thing that has stopped me doing this in real life is going to church. Not recommending that anyone goes to church unless they feel like it.

Regular churchgoing is a part of my life since my children became part of a faith school and I am ashamed to say that at 41 years old, I only now think about judging & stuff.

Hell, I still get drunk every now and then and it's all forgotten

pigletmania I have to say that whilst we may all get a bit judgey and po-faced in general terms and a bit vociferous in voicing our opinions, (it's a competitive parenting thing ) I can assure you that if you are feeling crap/alone/vulnerable/confused/sad there is no better bunch of women ANYWHERE to stick by you night and day until you are feeling better about whatever your trauma is. No judging happens on those thread, I promise. Doesn't matter what you've done or how low you've sunk.

I know Fellatio (nice name he he) I have received some wonderful support here on MN but dare I say it I used to smack my dd 3.4 when she was tantruming or shouting, I did it recently, I just felt so bad I ended up crying dd ended up crying too and saying dont worry mummy , just felt so crap and like a rubbish mum. I do suffer from PND and told my GP who was very good and pointed me in the right direction for support. I know that smacking is bad and not the way to go, but on here anyone who smacks is seen as a nasty vile child abuser on par with baby Ps abusers not a parent who needs help and support to become better, and they honestly make you feel that way . Dont need to feel more crap than what i feel sometimes.

pigletmania you are looking for help, the least we can do is support you in a kindly manner.

No-one should be making you feel worse than you do already.

What advice have you been given? A friend of mine has an anger problem and has also smacked. The only things I could think of suggesting were to count to ten when DC makes her cross before doing anything at all, in order to calm down and think through your response. Either that or walk out of the room. The NHS should be able to offer you some teaching on anger management techniques.

Thanks loopy the GP said that MIND run anger management courses so I will call and find out about them, I have anti depressants. She had several tantrums today I just walked out the room, or just made myself a cup of tea, believe me smacking and shouting does not work just makes your dc feel bad and you too. Had a meeting with the teachers at dd nursery a few weeks back about her lack of communication at nursery, and tantruming instead of talking, and I told them about not being able to cope at times and smacking, and the headmistress and head of nursery were so supportive, I was worried that they would brand me a bad mum and call social services. DD is being assessed my an Ed Psych to see how they can help her at her nursery and is seeing a SALT too. It makes us feel more supported especially me who relies on it more.

The SALT said that dd had a social communication difficulty and is putting us on a 15 week course called 'More than words' which will help us to communicate with her more effectively.

you sound great. None of us get it right all the time, and admitting that you need help is a hugely brave and selfless thing to do. Many many people have resorted to smacking on occasion, but would not admit to it (esp. on MN) for fear of being labelled bad parents - don't think you are that unusual. You are not. Sometimes reading all the very judgemental stuff on parenting can help you get a view on what's generally considered acceptable and what isn't, and can help you shape your own expectations/aims for yourself, but it is only opinion, and there is always more than one way to skin a cat, you know.

So long as your child feels secure, safe, and loved, and listened to, is (reasonably) well nourished, has a good understanding of right and wrong, and is encouraged/supported in education, the rest is all window dressing really. Sometimes taking MN opinions too much to heart can make you feel like you can never be good enough - but it's not true.

The media judge MN to be judgemental and unkind because they choose to only report on the threads that go that way. As in rl most people are genuine and helpful, but they would not make good press.

Thanks Fellationation , AIBU is not necessarily the right place to go for advice as people tend to be quite harsh and sometimes nasty. I have recieved some wonderful support on MN in different forums.

We are not perfect as parents and children have a habit of bringing out the best and worse of you. I think to admit that you have a problem and try and get help is a good thing. I have noticed that my dd behaviour is actually better for not smacking and screaming at her like a demented woman . I have seen the smacking thread on here and have smacked that I left a mark, dds marks very easily, even when I have picked her out of the bath i can see my hand prints on her skin for a min. I am not saying its right cause its not thats why I had to talk to professionals. Its lovely that they did not judge and saw that dd was very loved and cared for that i just needed some help and support. I was scared that if I told someone my dd would be taken away from me . That would finish me off it really would. I think its that fear that people sometimes dont want to.

I even confessed to the headteacher and head of nursery at dd school when we had a meeting about dd non social communication, it was a low point, I was in the meeting and just burst into tears [embarrassed]

They were so kind and did not judge, they are providing help for dd at her pre school. My GP was very good too.

YANBU - agree with chathappy, a bit of politeness and tact never goes amiss

pigletmania - smacking (in moderation) was a totally acceptable/normal part of child-rearing until relatively recently, and some people still advocate it in certain circumstances. We cannot all change overnight - re-education on the back of new research and evidence can take a couple of generations to become 'normal' behaviour. There is a difference between the occasional smack, and regular cruel beatings by a bullying parent, so don't make yourself feel too bad. I too, have left a handprint on a very stroppy tantruming three year old, when I was struggling with a new baby and PND. (many years ago now - the three year olf in question is nearly 18 and a lovely polite non-violent young man.) So I know how you feel. It makes you feel like shit and a total failure doesn't it?

But looking at yourself 'out of body' as it were, it's easy to see the triggers and to understand how you and child get to fever pitch with one another, so learning coping strategies in advance of challenging situations is hugely helpful. If in doubt, lock yourself in the bathroom for 20 minutes and cry and scream! I am full of admiration that you are able to be open about it, and are working to improve things.

I think politeness is the key to avoid going from a discussion to an stand up row / argument. I have recently posted in a drink related thread and there were times I could have responded with "Oh well you can shove that right up your arse and you can fuck off whilst you are doing it!" However, sometimes mediation is called for and a thoughtful answer. The thread has possibly come to a conclusion now but there were a number of valid points made and the discussion was good, it could so easily have turned in to a shut up or piss off thread.

Judging on forums is nothing new, I have been in and out of forums for longer than I care to remember and it's always been the same. Someone may post a real issue and be looking for advice or a considered response and someone will just pipe up with "stop being a twatt and grow a pair". Similarly people will post an outrageous question just to get a response out of boredom at times it seems.

Most people would not say quite the same things in real life but online people do and say what they like with no fear of recrimination.

Agreed that if you post in AIBU then expect all sorts of mudslinging as the topic invites it and carries warnings on the tin.