to absolutely hate the anti GP/doctor bashing mentality on MN?

[macdoodle]

When most if not all the doctors/GP's I know personally and professionally have a lot of training, and are doing the best they can, despite ridiculous government rules and beuarocracy, and dont get paid a fortune, far from it!

In fact I know IANBU, so much so, that I am taking a break from MN because the lot of you dr bashing makes me feel slightly ill, and some of those calling their GP's twats make me feel so angry I may say something I will regret

i think there are good ones, too.
but it is not easy to find them.
th gp's one of the skills must be empathy i think. some of them lacking it.
and i saw a few of them constantly taking notes while i talk. i dont know how can they manage to do that while trying to understand the problem.
i saw in the past some of the notes, i got quite shocked. they had nothing to do with me, i felt.

"However, the GPs at my surgery work 8.30am-6pm with a three hour 'paperwork' break in between".

Why the quotes around 'paperwork'? Do you think it's actually just time to nip off to the golf course? My DH is a GP (so shoot us both...) with about 2,500 patients on his own list. His working day is generally arrive 8.30, start looking through test results, letters that have arrived from consultants, referral letters that need writing, piles of policy documents etc. 9-11.30, 15 patient slots of 10 minutes each. He usually finishes these at 12.30-1ish (often being shouted at by the patients who've had to wait for their appointment, because he always takes as long as a patient needs - half an hour for a complex mental health issue? Sorry everyone else, you'll just have to wait). Then phone calls, more looking at 'paperwork', visits. Lunch in the car on the way to visits, or at the desk. If he's back at the desk by 3 to start his afternoon surgery that's a bonus but often he's still out doing visits. Another 15 '10-minute' appointments in the afternoon, then after surgery's over getting on with more phone calls, and the rest of the lab results, referral letters etc that have come in during the day. If he's home by 8 in time to say goodnight to dd that's a good day. On the days he's on extended hours, or duty doctor for the practice, it can be 9.30. And then yes, he does bring paperwork home.

How much more work would you like him to fit into the day? Of course some evenings he's out at the hospital having meetings for his GP specialisms, he could always do those every evening I suppose.

noraa - taking notes while you're talking - erm, how else do you expect them to remember everything that's said during a consultation? Wouldn't you rather that than that they tried to remember and then got something wrong?

"How would the NHS bashers feel if the staff lumped all patients together in one group? It would lead to another bashing I think."

You know what xstitch, it is exactly how it feels sometimes. When I went to see my GP with DD4 who had a lot of blood in her nappy (a lot of blood in a lot of nappies, that I took with me to show) and was told "you mothers always worry for nothing" it is actually being all put in one group and being bashed.
Turned out it was not actually nothing and that she had food poisoning (campylobacter). Same GP took months to refer DD1 for a scan because she had a big lump on her arm (she still does 8 years on but now we know what it is)because accordong to him "it was a reaction to the jabs she had" (3 month previously !?!?)

No need to be quite so defensive, JJ.

Your DH chose to become a GP, presumably? If you're trying to highlight the hard work that goes into his working day, well yes, it is clear to me that being a GP isn't an easy profession. He does sound like he puts a great deal of effort into his patients, but that should be expected, TBH.

I think it depends on what you mean by NHS bashing. I have been lucky. The problems I have had with health services have been minor inconveniences that hardly register as issues. I know others who have had appalling treatment and have good reason to feel aggreived. I also know others again who have had no real problems but whinge to high heaven about the small issues that most rational people take in their stride. The latter wind me up but they have the right to express their views - best to ignore them though.

macdoodle - I think that some of the older GPs are inferior to the younger ones.

I am going to guess that you are in your 30's or 40's - you'll have been trained in more modern practices - eg checking understanding from the patient - intelligent listening/questioning etc.

I think that GPs would come across a lot lot better if they made sure that in each consultation they:

a) expressed compassion for the problem being discussed ("eg - I can see that it is tough to put up with that awful sore throat whilst looking after your toddler") and

b) making sure the patient knows what to look out for and what type of criteria would mean they should come back

c) hand out more of the patient information leaflets

To be honest when I realise I need to go to the GP my heart sinks as it all seems such a palava - building up to the rushed 10 min conversation and knowing that you won't get to the bottom of the issue.

Also I can never see the same GP it seems as they get so booked up.

Yabu. If you don't want to hear that people have low opinions of HCPs who have treated them shoddily, then don't read those threads. Some people have had awful experiences - people have died because of mistakes or omissions, and HCPs can sometimes be as unpleasant as any other human being.

Sharing stories somewhere anonymous like MN is an important part of dealing with a bad experience for some people. People are allowed to complain. Sometimes, it stops bad things from.happening again, and in.my case reading similar stories helped me to go back to my GP again with more questions and feeling more assertive.

However, I will.put my hands up and say that the last GP appointment I had was wonderful and I got the referral to a consultant gynae I had been after for, ooh, about a year. The Dr who saw me was kind, patient (npi) and really listened. I actually cried because it was such a relief to be taken seriously.

Maybe you could start a thread about sharing great HCP experiences.

mango - yes, he chose to be a GP. When he started training 15 years ago it was the branch of medicine that meant you got patient continuity of care, built up long term relationships with people, and you got to balance it with seeing your family, in return for a sensible salary (but not a ridiculous one, that was surgeons at the time). Now he has to work very long hours, never see his daughter, gets paid a lot but get all this abuse for it. He does work very hard but as is clear from a lot of threads on here, people don't just expect hard work, they want something impossible. It's true that some (not the majority) of GPs aren't perfect but how is it fair to abuse the rest?

JumpJockey yes it sounds like your dh works very hard indeed. That isn't the norm though, not every gp does the hours your dh does.

I think you get good gps and bad ones. I thank god for the lovely gp my mother went to see when she felt breathless and had a pain in her side. Her saw straight away that my mother was very poorly and took the time to write a long referal paper and sent her straight to A&E.

Turns out my mother had double pheumonia and was put on a ventilater for a week in intensive care. Had the wonderful gp not seen this, my mother would have died that night due to her dangerously low blood pressure. So i thank god for Dr French! He saved my mothers life.

MsSparkle - what makes you think that isn't the norm? The hours advertised for surgery don't bear any relation to the number of hours the doctors actually work. It really isn't just a case of Turn up, Work through appointment times to the minute, Go home.

JJ. I don't think anyone has personally critisised your DH on this thread. (Or abused him!)

Many folk work long hours, and very hard long hours at that.

I don't think it is fair comment to say people want the impossible. I think this is highlighted in tabouleh's post excellently. Actually I feel this whole thread is about people not expecting the impossible, just to be listened to and diagnosed correctly!

if i earned that much money (£100 000) i would do my best.

The thing is JJ is that lots of jobs have changed over the last fifteen years and lots of people work hard and do long hours.

I don't think expecting people to do their job correctly is out of order to be honest. If a shop assistant was rude, abrupt and tried to hurry me out of the shop i'd be pissed off too. Yes i'm sure said shop assistant was busy and stressed but he or she should not treat a customer like that and customers would not expect to be treated like that. Why should it not be the same for GP's?

I have seen lots of threads on here moaning about teachers or shop assistants etc. People don't like it if someone doesn't do their job properly it is as simple as that. I for one am not talking about all GP's but the ones that aren't doing their job properly and the worrying thing and probably the reason people are angry is because a GP can be the difference between life and death.

and i would expect more empathy from a gp than a shop assistant for example. because it is directly related to human health, etc.

Because i think if every gp worked from 8.30am to 8pm thereabouts then we wouldn't have the service we do. Not all gps work full time either.

Imo, gps should work 5 days out of 7, so that includes weekends. So they still get two days off a week like most people, just not every weekend.

If you work in retail or the hotel trades etc, you work 5 days out of 7.

Yes it's true that the fact GPs are making life and death decisions gives them a huge responsibility - and that's why they get paid a lot (and not because they have some kind of magical ability to remember every single word that's said to them during a consultation!). And yes it is unfair that not everyone has a really good doctor. I'm just trying to put across the view that saying things like "I'd never let anyone I know be alone with a doctor" isn't exactly helping the ones who do do their absolute best to feel appreciated.

No I agree that is not helpful.

I don't really care if my doctor feels appreciated, I just want her to listen and know what she's on about!

OP there needs to be a balance doesn't there? There is a range of people with different levels of competency, and different strengths and weaknesses, as in any profession. GPs are no different.

jj,
i agree they can take notes.
but the things they write sometimes look so absurd.
yr dh maybe one of the good ones. as most peole say there are good ones and bad ones.
i really appreciate good ones, we know their job is not easy.
maybe the system is not good.
they have only 10 mins for each patient.
and when we build up to solve our problems in 10 mins, and not even be able to get the empathy for our pain, if feels really disappointing.

sorry but I will call the doctor who walked out of the room when my dd was nearly dying a twat,
but my GP is lovely