Mums of boys - what do YOU do?

[Didu]

Slightly depressed by the recent upsurge of chats about men's depravity - from individual celebrities to seemingly 50% of world population. With full respect to women's experiences (and could contribute my penny's worth), I am really keen to know what I can do, as mum of two teenage boys, for them not to be part of the problem.

To kick off:

• I've always tried to be open about sex-related conversations - not batting an eyelid when they report their latest sex-ed lesson at school, normalising body changes throughout puberty
• Related but slightly different: encouraging them to enjoy their bodies beyond sex - eg taking baths or long showers, not minding them nicking my skincare, encouraging sport/exercise and emphasising functional and health benefits rather than looks
• At the same time, open convos about toxic masculinity, eg watched together and discussed latest Louis Theroux documentary

It all feels pretty textbook to me, and yet there's a niggling worry that it's not enough, or that it's inadequate in the face of prevalent culture. What do / did you do to raise your sons to be respectful to women, yet aware of and comfortable with their own sexuality?

Having a decent man as a role model, preferably their dad, modelling respectful attitudes towards their mum and all females; not objectifying women and celebrating their achievements.

I don’t know but I’m interested to hear ideas. I think as yours are teens this is a really great time to have a discussion about what’s in the news - it directly addresses consent, which is the massive one currently, and broader topics like treating women (and all humans) respectfully, age gaps, actually thinking about ‘banter’ and calling out behaviour if appropriate. If nothing else this is a real-life example of what happens when you don’t consider these things, not a theoretical what-if, or a PSHE lesson they can ignore

My son is only 4 so having a current affairs chat with him is not on the cards but it’s brought it to the front of my mind that I’ll be bringing up consent early and often

their peer group is important in this regard
also if they’re very young teens reduce / limit access to
the internet
so much toxic shit on there

It’s the dads make the difference, imo/e. Which is hard to hear for mums doing their best in the face of no/crap dad.

We had conversations around consent, sex, contraception, abortion, responsibility for children born of unwanted pregnancy even if having the baby wasn’t their choice (and how it shouldn’t be) that sort of thing. Also how women sometimes don’t feel safe(for good reason) walking (especially at night or remotely) when a man is walking behind them. How they walk with keys between their fingers etc. Toxic masculinity, the manosphere etc. We also talk about politics and current affairs, culture wars etc as these all feed into how young men see the world. He is 20 and pretty switched on. He is very respectful of me and his gf which is a good sign.

He is quite horrified by what was acceptable in the 1980s and 1990s in terms of of sexism, misogyny and age gap relationships to name a few. He thinks Andrew Tate is a twat. While there is still a way to go, there has been a lot of progress since then.

To be honest I think the lessons are for girls & boys. My parents & extended family modelled relationships & behaviour that meant I had high expectations of men. My DH also had a very hands on father so he is a hands on father. Our dc see we both work, contribute, roles aren’t decided by gender & as they get older we will discuss consent etc

I think one of the biggest issues though is how women are treated by the media, that often contradicts the message we are trying to teach.

This is most impactful thing tbh.

Don't have children with a sexist bloke.
And don’t break your neck to be the model of a 1950s housewife yourself.
Don’t ‘mummy’ them.
Help them become independent.
Sit down and play Xbox with them. Have a laugh with them.
Teach them that women are humans that they can safely be friends with and vulnerable with.
Teach them empathy and kindness.

I chose a good man to create them with. Surround them with positive male role models. Monitor the media they’re consuming.

exactly
when we left, mine was 12 yo
I heard so many times, ‘boys need a father,’
hollow ringing words
and visibly untrue

That locks it into a vicious circle though, doesn't it? If recent activity on MN is to be trusted, there are very few of those - so many women describe their experiences from casual verbal mysogyny to various degrees of coercion. So while I agree that role modelling is foundational, it's almost how I, as a woman, who is a receiver of inappropriate behaviour can role-model being respected while not shaming or denigrating men in general...

1 be very clear, very early about healthy boundaries. Yes, your penis is good. No, people don't want to look at it at the pool, motorway services, dinner table, etc.

2 make sure he has a twin sister who shouts "girls are strong!!" At random intervals and doesn't take any crap. BoyTwin once chuckled knowingly to me "a boy in my class said girls aren't as strong as boys, but I know he's wrong - look at GirlTwin!"

I have three boys. I was also a victim of child sexual exploitation in grooming gangs. Honestly I’ve never had to do anything to raise my boys to be decent. They follow our example. It helps they have healthy role models including a dad who treats me very very well. My oldest two, one is 15 and the other 18 and both are just lovely lovely people. Respectful lovely men.
Thinking it through I guess we have always talked about boundaries normally when as children they pushed each others boundaries. Reminded about touch and consent in those ways “he said he doesn’t want you to keep doing that” sort of thing.

See I disagree with the last bit. It’s ok to acknowledge that physiology is different. There is no way am I as strong as DH but that doesn’t mean I am less then.

Last point:
If you want to bother.

Otherwise, very valid.

What does ‘don’t break your neck to be a 1950s housewife’ mean? In terms of subservience?

I’m hopeful of today’s males - I have 3 DS ranging from 24y to 14y.

We have talked a lot over the last few weeks about Brand and now Walliams. I feel their attitude is much closer to what society expects today.

We’ve always sat and talked about current affairs, life and had open opinions as a family. I think it helps a lot that I’ve always insisted on sitting down together for our evening meal.

A good male role model always helps and good peer groups.

Basically, let them see me take absolutely no shit from any man, including my husband and them themselves.

I’ve got one adult son, and 4 adult grandsons. Both lots had good role model fathers. And other strong women around them. None has ever been a problem. 👍

The poster made some valid points.

I am not sure what you mean by a vicious cycle?

The rest of your post i couldn't really comprehend.

I only have DDs but I do have two brothers who have grown up to be decent men/husbands/dads
Looking back at our childhood I would say it’s having a Dad who was a good role model, was present and involved and treated our Mum well. Same with our grandfathers.
Also my parents didn’t treat us that differently with regard to doing housework and what toys we played with. Just let us be individuals.
There was also obviously no permanent internet access in the 90s either, we didn’t have smartphones, teens couldn’t really access porn unless it was a magazine or on a tape/DVD and then they would have had to watch it on the main family tv!

Ours is still a toddler. But we make sure he is aware of consent and boundaries at this age (obviously not in a sexual context).

My husband was raised by a feminist who at one point was the breadwinner in the family. So my husband has been raised with those standards and is very hands on. He cooks and does housework. He has also cut off friends and been cold towards colleagues who have done terrible things. Even though I know it would be easier to turn a blind eye like most seem to.

We read loads. Books are one of the best ways to build empathy at this age. We read lots of books with female protagonists.

I shall be reading the replies on here in earnest. We want him to grow up to be a kind and conscientious man. But I also don't want him to grow up with a negative view of himself just because he is male. It does worry me that misandry is so excepted in some circles.

Yep fair enough. I didn’t particularly have twee rules about empathy/kindness myself, it was more a basic ‘don’t be a dick - treat others as you would want to be treated’ way of life in our house. For the adults as well as the kids.

In my experience, the men who have the most ghastly views of women invariably come from a household that either has no father figure, or one in which the parents modelled an unequal relationship (i.e. SAHM).

Yes, my sons were brought up this way too. It seems to working out ok that they treat men and women with the same respect.