48% of Britain's would refuse to fight for their country

[cakeorwine]

So a new headline today

Daily Telegraph
Half of Britons would refuse to fight for their country

Half of Britons say there are no circumstances in which they would go to war for their country, a poll has found.

While the pollster Ipsos found strong backing for increased defence spending, some 48 per cent said there was no situation in which they would take up arms.

One in two Britons would never fight for their country | Politics | News | Express.co.uk

It was not that easy to find the data set but I've linked it below and shown the data from the question

Original data here

Despite rising support for increasing defence spending, half of Britons say there are no circumstances under which they would take up arms for Britain | Ipsos

War-trends-final-weighted

Would be interested to hear your opinion on the survey results

As would Sir Humphrey

I can safely say that there are no circumstances where I would be willing to kill another individual who is equally forced to be fighting in a battle that they did not want to be a part of 🤷🏻‍♀️

How many young boys were killed on both sides in the world wars because men who weren’t willing to undertake the fight themselves forced them to be there? It doesn’t bear thinking about

Absolutely correct.

if you want to know how people would really react in the event of a national emergency/ existential threat, don’t look at hypothetical polling. Ask a Ukrainian instead.

I’m too old really but hypothetically I’d need to know who’s war and why?

Would I fight if Russia was trying to invade Europe- probably

If Farage was in power and demanding we stand on beaches shooting at boats and shouting at the RNLI absolutely not!

Because they would not understand the lack of patriotism.
If they were not patriotic and wanting to defend their country they would not have held out for so very long.
No, normal people do not want to participate in wars. Unfortunately, when you get abnormal leaders in the World who want to blow your country to bits then you kind of have to respond.

I definitely think boomers should be the cannon fodder if such a thing is warranted, we need the young!

I am not a boomer and I didn't raise my children to abscond their responsibilities towards their families. I did grow up until nearly teen in an occupied country. I did have a cousin staying with us because his parents were political prisoners. He peed himself when much too old to do so. I didn't know at the time, he told me later. I'd shame him if I would know. First time I've seen anyone non-stop touch and cling to someone ( my mum in this case). Really ALL THE TIME. I think he slept in the bed with my mum.

Just to say there have been lives lost in conflict since WW2. To people saying otherwise. And that no Boomer has lost a son or daughter nor had anyone maimed. Not so. Have a thought for those that have lost their sons and daughters. Or that have been maimed.

Surely it depends on the alternative? What if you fight or you are invaded and your family is raped, tortured and murdered?

Yep easier to demand others do it.

I'd interpret it as "under no circumcstances that I'm willing to consider".

Fullscalle boots on the ground enemy invasion is invonceivable for a big part of Europe. However, if the enemy landed a ship/plane of soldiers at our neigborhood, what choice would we have?

The issue is, that the wars of today are less well defined. Cyber, hybrid, sabotage, ... afaik it remains unclear how much was the Brexit vote influenced by another state actor.

I'm not sure how much is patriotism and how much is neccessity.

2022 invasion wasn't a new thing - there was Crimea before. And the rest of the relatively recent history with Ukraine being a victim of huge famine managed by Russia.

Ukrainians generally don't want to fight (meaning being happy to), they just understand that not fighting would be much worse - Russia would occupy them, cleanse the ones who might make troubles (they had lists ready), and conscript the rest to send them to attack further to the Europe... better to fight to protect one's choices and independence than being enslaved to fight for your enemy.

"TBH I don't really believe this. Polls can be made to say anything. What is the purpose of the commissioner of this poll, is probably more interesting to ask.
Whenever I discuss this with people, everyone who starts off saying they wouldn't fight is imagining another totally optional US style war like Iran or Iraq. Abroad somewhere for obscure purposes.
As soon as you say would you defend your children if the soldiers are coming down your street, they change their view."

The poll is absolutely right

And you're right, polls can be made to say anything

I just asked you if you had any thoughts on the question?

You absolutely understand how polls can be manipulated so I was interested to hear your views on the actual question.

Why do you believe I am spoiling for a fight?

@Pallaska

But even in the case of Ukraine- hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian men have fled Ukraine to avoid military service. Equally Ukrainian women are exempt from mandatory military service or conscription.

If you were a front line Ukrainian soldier you would be asking the question of why am I fighting and putting my life at risk for people that aren't prepared to do the same for their country.

Nobody wants to fight. But they have always had to fight the Russians.
Watching footage of the starvation of the Ukrainians by the Russians in the 30’s was vicious and within memories passed down.
They are a dignified nation.
Trump wants a puppet in place of Zelensky. A ‘yes’ man.
I have nothing but admiration for their stoicism and endurance.

It's fascinating how most people are discussing the headline data without actually looking at the survey and the question they asked.

The point of the OP was to see how people react to a headline. People can see the reaction

Do people think they could ask a question that could get a much higher result than 48%?

If so, what would it be?

Some inspiration

I was actually thinking about this last night and how different the country is now compared to when we had conscription in WW2. Much simpler times when PM speeches and the media tried to keep morale up, compared to today when people would instantly take to social media and This Morning would choose guests with various opinions

Many boomers will have seen conflict and served. Been maimed and died.
Anyone who served in the Falklands would have been a ‘Boomer’. Just one example of one conflict/war.
How horrible for anyone to read your comment if they did lose their son/husband or they were injured.

Surely its not surprising.?
A survey in 1939 might have come up with the same results but people had no choice but to fight.

TBH it is all a bit immaterial. If war was imminent, then conscription would be brought in. I’m old enough to remember conscription, very unpopular - but off they went regardless.

But people today do have a choice. If their country is at war then they can choose not to fight, leave their country and seek refuge in another country.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/article/2024/jun/29/i-am-not-made-for-war-the-men-fleeing-ukraine-to-evade-conscription

Awful thought. Hopefully we won’t see that.

That question is poorly written. “Go to war for Britain” has connotations beyond self defense of the country.

what do we know about the entity running the survey? Was this likely bias designed to garner a response or was it simply poor design?

I’d be interested to know the demographic make up of the poll? I mean, many of the YouGov ones are SAHPs and retirees doing them to earn M&S vouchers, and if you did a poll in Harringay or parts of Birmingham or Leeds, ie with a large ethnic community or an impoverished white working class community …I’d be completely surprised to elicit any other response, really.

I’d really love to see what a poll amongst Reform supporters would get - ‘cos I suspect behind all the nationalist rhetoric there’s little willingness to actually serve one’s country.

That said, if the enemy was actually at the door, shooting your neighbours and burning down your community, people’s perspectives would shift.

National service only applies to men, women are more than welcome to volunteer for the military and many do.

@Monty36 how are you defining many? Bearing in mind there are 13million plus boomers?