When will people realise that pensioners have paid for their state pension.

[notsafeanymore]

Every time there is a debate about the cost of living pensioners get a bashing.
And some have also paid for a private pension.
It's people who have never worked that should be targeted first.
I'm not on about the disabled. It's people who are benefit cheats and have never worked.

Yes the civil service job page have a Google.

Oh and family that work in the NHS and civil service.

Do you have source that they dont?

Why so prickly?

Why so rude.

What was rude about asking for a source?

Calling people prickly when they provide one. Although I suspect you are being disingenuous to boot.

Here is a source

https://www.nhsemployers.org/publications/nhs-pension-scheme-member-contributions

Meanwhile, a 10% employer contribution rate is seen as exceptional in the private sector.

Yes they were part of the lucky cohort who were able to do this.

never happened before
won’t happen again

and doesn’t help anyone who has yet to retire

It was a genuine question but I've learned my lesson. 😱I google it btw. It's a deferred benefit. Do you think they don't deserve it?

How did they retire at 50 whilst not having worked much? Apologies if you've already explained this, I have scrolled back a few pages. I mean even taking into account that people used to retire much earlier, this is really very young.

They get some public money but that has nothing to do with my comment
’we pay to attend’
staff are not employed by the state

I've said this before on similar threads.

The basic entitlement that I and my 2 DC get to live on from Universal Credit is £238 a week, which I gather is exactly the same as state pension for a single person.

(Obviously I work, but as I'm self employed my income fluctuates, and how that works is that in a good month most of what I earn is taken off UC - as it should- but if I have a month or two where work dries up, money is taken from our monthly payment as if I had earned a certain amount, leaving us with as little as £6-700 for a month).

So yeah, I think I'll survive just fine on the state pension 😆

Well they probably didn’t retire as such it was easier to claim dole 40 years ago
Then do a few cash in hand jobs
Then move onto state pension with few questions asked

I'm sorry to hear that.

It's OK, it really is.

We can even afford to go on holidays, albeit camping rather than the "£5000 for a week's AI" so many Mumsnetters seem to feel is necessary 😆.

But I just wanted to offer a counterpoint to the "Why are our pensions so pitifully small when benefit scroungers are handed barrowloads of cash to sit on their arses and pop out kids?" (as an aside, how can you pop out a kid while sitting on your arse? 😆) narrative.

In reality, we're raising the next generation of taxpayers on far less money than pensioners receive, all the while being berated as lazy scroungers. It's not very nice.

It's been said quite a few times. There was no need to pay in as much as they took out, they paid for the people getting pensions while they wor ked. Those younger than them paid their pensions. Because of inflation the amount paid in has always been less than the amount taken out by any individual.

The system would continue to work if we didn't as a country spend more and more on a society where having no work and lots of children makes economic sense, and where anxiety is seen as a reasonable excuse to never work.

A wonderful example of precisely the attitude I refer to in my post above.

I agree. It’s not nice. Well done btw 😊

I agree. The horrified reaction from some off the most wealthy pensioners to the withdrawal of the Winter Fuel Allowance was ridiculous. The difference in the narrative around pensioners (plucky, deserving, hard-done-by) and benefit claimants (scroungers, feckless, work-shy, lazy, cheats) is so stark as to be utterly ridiculous. This is fanned by the right-wing press and in the hierarchy of people in the UK who are 'destroying our country,' benefit claimants come a very close second after immigrants/asylum seekers.

I didn’t see horrified reactions from some of the most wealthy pensioners

here's an insite into the breakdown of opinion

The Wealthy: While many wealthier pensioners felt the loss of a universal benefit was unfair in principle, it was the "stigma" of being pushed onto means-tested benefits like Pension Credit that caused particular distress. Many retirees with modest private pensions were angered by the policy.

The "Just About Managing": The loudest outcry came from pensioners who missed the benefit cut-off but were still struggling to meet their energy bills. An estimated 2.5 million pensioners who lost the payment were deemed "too wealthy" for government help but too poor to live a dignified life.

General Sentiment: The decision drew heavy criticism from across the political spectrum, with reports of severe anxiety regarding "heat or eat" choices. The situation was described by many as "needless and cruel", forcing many older people to drastically ration their heating and hot water

I think there can be many reasons- far more social housing - people I know who got virtually full housing allowance for years and then bought for peanuts when they got family to help or had a small inheritance, cash in hand jobs much easier as you say, far less questions asked, people ‘on the sick ’ for years with bad backs - the idea everyone was working hard 16 to 60 full time isn’t the reality - it was for some, but certainly not everyone- my fils partner ( sadly RIP) very nice lady but never worked more than 8 hours a week after 23 ( 1st child) till she died mid 70s - she wouldn’t have got full pension due to lack of contributions once kids over18 but certainly got some and was in situations where her ex H and my FIL were in a position to fully provide with full state and personal pensions etc -plus cash from a divorce

Thing is I don’t see them getting angry that young families or singles often with similar income after paying child care, rent , mortgages, bills didn’t get any such allowance, unless on very low income -and plenty of those moaning that I saw were on minimum £2200 a month income into household, without many of the costs younger families have in particular .

£2200 still has to cover most of the bills that they paid before retirement. You're saying families with income AFTER paying the bills. They have that BEFORE paying the bills.

There were plenty of wealthy pensioners who moaned about the WFA fiasco. I’m related to a couple who did, and they are still not eligible to receive it even after the u-turn as they have an income of more than £35k a year. They wil never forgive Labour for taking the £200-300 away from them.

Yes the cut off did affect a lot of pensioners who were not rich as the cut off was too low at £12k a year or whatever it was, but even if they had originally set the threshold at £35k (which is still quite high imo) there would still have been moaners. Just less sympathy from the general public as we would have known the people complaining would have been on at least £35k.

@crackofdoom nowhere did I say that working mothers should get less money. You're being over sensitive. I do think that there are many people who could work but won't. As a society we are short of money. Some people on here think we should address that by taking money from pensioners, I believe that we could do more about the amounts paid to the voluntarily workless. Remember this is a forum where people are allowed to politely express differing views.

The allowance re heating for everyone else didnt change though
It stayed as always
So why would it be even mentioned when it was just this one allowance cut

I think the threshold for getting it is £35,000 whilst at the time the threshold for pensioners was going to be far lower even though they suffer health wise with the cold. Now of course the Govn agreed to raise that threshold to the same as everyone else