How do we protect our sons from the manosphere?

[MyKindHiker]

Just this. I watched the Louis Theroux documentary with horror. What shocked me was all of these young men who have this horrible anti-woman ideology have mothers who loved them and specifically didn’t raise them with these ideas. How do we protect our sons and teach them decent values when they are coming across these attitudes online or amongst their peers?

Yes, that is what I am suggesting for boys. They are much more likely to be responsive to mentoring by men they look up to - looking the part helps lubricate that process.

These boys need to be provided with an alternative vision of masculinity that models what a good man is along with the discipline and status signifiers that they are seeking.

Do you object to adult men being healthy, trim and well presented?

No, but surely we need to de-centre stuff around appearance.

This is not a thread about academic concepts of respect. We are talking about protecting sons from the manosphere.

If you believe that you can be uncool, irrelevant, and not into anything that teens and young men are into, yet be able to compete with the influence of their peers and the manosphere, then all power to you.

None of my sons have done anything but laugh as these Manosphere arseholes... Keep talking to your sons and lead by example... It's not a magic formula.

I still don't get the issue with adult men being healthy, trim and well presented.

Which one(s) do you have a problem with?

Yes. It’s just about being an authoritative parent, not friend, and having a non-negotiable on sexism.

My other non-negotiables do also involve judging how much value someone has or how much you should respect them, based on what they look like.

I would not, inadvertently or otherwise, teach my children to only respect “ripped” men.

I don't believe I ever mentioned "ripped" men.

Which of the words "healthy, trim, and well presented" equate to "ripped" to you?

It’s funny, there’s a ‘not all men is ridiculous’ thread on mn and I do wonder sometimes do men/ boys see what women have and see how much positivity is there for them and start feeling negative about it because they aren’t being lifted the way we are? In that way I think it has to be up to men to show them that they can do anything/ be anything too and it doesn’t need to be a vs thing- that we can all be better/ do better and be content together (with compromise, hard work, communication etc)

I wouldn’t teach my children, of any sex, that respect is dependent on being healthy and trim either.

When your son starts bullying the fat kid, is that okay because we don’t have to be nice to people who aren’t trim?

Surely, you’re not being serious. If you are, you’ve swallowed at least half of a red pill.

@MyKindHiker
books on machivelli
the 48 laws of power
dale carngie how to win friends and influence people

the other question is How do we protect our sons from manipulative women too ?

Keep communication lines open, always. Talk to them about current issues, (age appropriate) ensure they respect YOU because thats where it begins and ends.
Keep an eye what shit they are viewing online.
Lots of affection and attention.
I was a sp to 2 boys who are now mid-late 20s and lovely respectful boys.

Yes, us women HAVE to do the fucking work. We are women and WE have to show our sons how we should be treated.
Simple really

Talk a lot about women's rights and human rights, privilege etc. I think our DS (14) will be fairly well proofed against those guys as he's genuinely sensitive to injustice, including towards women, because we talk about this stuff and why certain things aren't fair on various people.

I think there is a challenge with teenage boys that they do get a rough deal - seen as troublemakers, doing less well in school - I can see they see themselves as being treated worse in some ways as boys and think 'Well this stuff about men having an advantage must be bullshit'. Because they won't yet have experienced the advantages men do have in the workplace etc (not that most men recognise it either tbf).

So it's worth explaining that.

Gosh if only women had thought of this before. There would be no problems!

then all women would be perfect and not manipulate or set any bad behaviours to begin with ? so whats womens answers for being manipulative etc ?

@Echobelly you make a very good point. The advantages are later in life, in fact I would say boys are more likely to be victims of collective punishment and generalisations when kids and teens. The reality is the troublemakers are usually boys but that doesn't mean boys are troublemakers. A decent boy feels not only is he partially blamed for another kids behaviour but he also is forced to endlessly tolerate this behaviour too. I work with little kids and the boys are often more open with play than girls. The 'no boys allowed' attitude is much more common than the opposite. Girls who do this are basing it on their own limited experience of a rough boy who ruined their game but they generalise because they know no better. That's why as adults it's our job to shut it down immediately and never indulge it. It's the ones that grow up feeling wronged that seek connection elsewhere.

Not really, that all looks like normal parenting really, after all, you don't need to do all that in one day! It's incremental throughout their childhood. Start early, get good habits in place from the earliest possible time, and then "tweak" as the years pass and they morph into teenagers and then adults.

We start when they are very very young and we never stop.

Children need positive male and female role models, as everyone knows.

They need to grow up seeing decent behaviour. Hearing decent opinions. Watching dad change nappies and hoover, watching mum mow the grass (not get stereotypical gender roles drilled into them is my point, rather than those specific examples)

They need to grow up hearing unacceptable views challenged.
They need to grow up seeing consequences for unacceptable conduct.

They need to be protected as long as possible from inappropriate content. For example, I didn't let my sons watch things like mtv with the godawful videos and lyrics. The only computer in the house was in the living room and the screen faced the sofa. I controlled what they watched and read when they were young.

Small, simple, everyday things.
Building blocks if you like.

I don’t think women are manipulating their sons into being misogynistic arseholes.

I haven’t watched it yet but what was interesting when speaking to people at work who had watched it, who were all men funnily enough, said to just laugh at it because these men were ridiculous. I’m sorry, but I’m not finding blatant misogyny being peddled out on socials as funny? It just got me thinking, that if men are watching this and taking it with a grain of salt as they’re thinking ‘well, I don’t think like that’ then it’s a bit of a losing battle?

no but other women do and are manipulative

What’s that got to do with this subject?

Exactly!! I recognise you are being sarcy but we can't all blame the wee boys who eventually become grown ass men. They are borne through women. We have to shoulder a lot of the responsibility for the men they become, albeit with a few exceptions who are just born bad.

You cannot foster genuine kindness if you are simultaneously teaching someone to be hyper-vigilant or suspicious of others.

Building better men requires a foundation of trust and discernment, rather than fear-based generalizations. When men are taught that manipulation is a gendered trait rather than an individual behavior, it creates a defensive mindset that makes healthy, respectful relationships nearly impossible. To help men be "fully kind," the focus should be on identifying healthy boundaries and individual character, rather than painting half the population as a potential threat.