Meningitis outbreak

[Flipitoff]

I’m freaking out a bit

DD has been here all day after travelling from uni yesterday. Her housemate is really poorly and now I’ve just seen the news about the meningitis outbreak at her uni.

Her housemate is in the house on her own now - I’ve told DD to call the uni and let them know. Worried that DD has been here with us all day in case she gets sick

On Monday I booked one at a Boots in Derbyshire for this afternoon and one at a Boots in Scotland for Sunday. As DS17 was at Boots today, the one in Scotland cancelled. We were told in Derbyshire they normally do one Men B vax a week. They cancelled 78 today. Sheer luck DS got his time slot.

@Sisublondie thanks ! No idea why the previous post went underlined.
Cancelled 78 !!

my little brother goes there, my dad confirmed yesterday that he’s okay. I wasn’t worried because I figured we’d all Been vaccinated until I found out that that particular vaccination wasn’t rolled out until 2015 which means non of us are really safe. My dc included, DS was born 2008 and dd 2012. I’m keeping an eye on it.

It would only take a member of the bar staff who is a carrier or infected, with poor hand hygiene serving drinks to effectively infect multiple people. Not everyone will develop the disease. It’s often an opportunist bacteria that will make its way into the body via an inflamed area of skin in the mouth nose or throat, a sore throat or a mouth ulcer for example. For most they will become temporary carriers or their immune system will deal with it. We are still in cold and flu season and viruses live freely in student communities so the conditions for easy infection by a bacteria are perfect.

Parties are perfect places with people sharing bottles and drinks. Another area would be sports teams who have communal water bottles. There will be a thorough investigation looking for common exposure. Another area would be fast food outlets such as MacDonalds often staffed by students and sixth formers and used by most party and night club goers on a Saturday night.

My son called in tonight on his way back to uni from a trip to Liverpool. I had a good chat reinforcing preventative measures. He was sat in his friends car and opened a box of mini rolls, took a bite then offered me the rest. The super vigilant cross infection control prevention professional in me immediately declined.

As a dentist I’m hard wired to avoid other people’s saliva. Under normal circumstances I probably would have taken it but he’s been to 2 big events in 3 days where large numbers of uni students from all over the country have been interacting. In all likelihood he is absolutely fine but it was a perfect opportunity to demonstrate how easily we spread saliva born infections.

This sort of reinforces that the supercarrier was probably a member of the bar staff at the night club. Not everyone they infected will have meningitis but many will have become carriers causing a wider network of infection.

No doubt the staff will be swabbed and receive treatment. It’s not their fault although hand hygiene will need to be addressed.

It really does go to show that we have forgotten the lessons of covid and the simple measures needed in the food and drink industry required to protect customers from unnecessary risks.

I can’t imagine how those who live in and near Kent are feeling, I am quite anxious about my university student child and I live hundreds of miles from that area and the risk here is no more than it was any other time

I'm honestly quite worried about this. 😢 I'm Gen Z and at uni currently, though not in Kent but London.

I'm being careful and I haven't had close contact with anyone, I don't drink or vape so wouldn't catch it that way. Still....

I wish my mother would agree to pay for the vaccine. She is an antivaxxer now and reluctant to as she thinks the vaccine will be more dangerous. I don't agree....! 🙄

I don't have a job so can't pay that way. I need to try & access my ISA, there would probably be enough money there.

How much protection do you have if you only have one vaccine?

But can they guarantee availability of the second dose required in 4 weeks?

I thought you could get it if someone coughs or sneezes nearby?

Please don’t over worry. Simple precautions will reduce your risks. Hand hygiene is first. Before you prepare food or eat wash your hands. Clean surfaces in communal areas including door handles, something everyone touches without even considering it a risk. Keep your toothbrush in your room rather than in a communal bathroom. Avoid anything that could have been in someone’s mouth.
Try not to put your hands in your mouth , nail biting for sample unless you are confident they are clean. Soap and water are perfect for killing bacteria on your hands, hand sanitizer can be useful if you can’t wash them.

The problem with the men b bacteria is that although it is not airborne it can end up on communal surfaces after coughing or sneezing particularly if someone coughs or sneezes onto their hand then touches or handles objects that can end up in others mouths.

If someone sneezes while drying cutlery then this could be a potential source. A bar worker coughing into their hand then handling open bottles around the neck/top of the bottle is a potential source. Bar managers should train staff to handle glasses and bottles in a way that they avoid contaminating any part of the drink with their hands. In practice this doesn’t happen. Watch how someone serves your meal and you can always use a disinfectant wipe to clean the container. Use a straw. It’s all about avoiding contact.

In practice I don’t spend a lot of time thinking about it. It could lead to obsessive behaviour so it’s probably better just to avoid take out coffees and food if it worries you.

Just think about day to day hygiene practices in your house or flat and make adjustments to reduce risk. The bacteria don’t live long out of the body so cups and utensils if regularly washed are not really a problem. If you see someone licking a knife while preparing a sandwich for you may be more of an issue.

There is a chance that any one of us could be a carrier. This will provide some protection since our immune systems are more likely to have some immunity to the bacteria but we could potentially infect others so bear that in mind when interacting with friends and family.

You are no more at risk now than you were before this particular outbreak hit the news.

I know hopefully it will be contained and it looks like it's moving that way, but there's no harm in being careful, especially when the risks are high if you do get it. Covid was less risk to the average student-age person whereas this the opposite.

Precisely what I’m thinking! Boots has sent a perfunctory email confirming today’s Vaccination took place, and that they “will email when it’s time for him to get the next dose”.
I am not medical, so don’t know if the Booster/Round 2 vax is different to Round 1… in which case I guess that those who were able to get Round 1 will get the second. Because maybe it’s useless on its own…?

Thank you, this is really helpful.

I mainly have uni meals rather than ones cooked myself, but when I do cook, I'll be careful. I've never been keen on shared utensils anyway.

I like eating out but I'm wondering if I'll just avoid for a few weeks while seeing how the situation shapes up.
I suppose I was a bit confused over whether it's airborne or not, but I understand better now. Otoh why are people at Kent Uni wearing masks if the risk of airborne transmission via coughing alone is low? I suppose in hot, crowded places like nightclubs/public transport it would be higher?

My mother's not fanatically antivax. She mutters about the risk of 'heavy metals' from it but I think if push came to shove and she saw it was really worrying me, she'd agree. I think part of the issue is she thinks the risk is low if you're careful with vaping/drinking (which I don't do), sharing utensils/kissing etc. Arguably that's true but I think underestimates how serious it is if you do get it.

Although masks are not much use they can provide a barrier if someone was to cough or sneeze while stood close it’s more of a direct barrier rather than a passive barrier. In any case simple masks are pretty useless. We use them at work to stop gross fluid splashing on our faces. Once they have been on for 30 seconds they are pretty useless as a microscopic barrier but great for stopping blood, mucous and saliva splashing onto your face. Bacteria and viruses can pass through but on the whole being covered in blood or saliva splatter is not pleasant. They are easier to replace quickly in a clinical Novak environment.

The face visors are more effective in preventing contamination via splatter. But with all PPE they need to be clean d thoroughly after use. Because handling a POE visor covered in bodily fluids is no different than direct contact with those fluids. Wiping your face with soap and water or a wipe is probably more effective.

The other use for a mask is to stop you transferring contaminants from your hand to your mouth, proper physical barrier. I often think that this was why masks in covid worked to some extent. While you were out and about any hand contact with contaminated surfaces was mitigated by wearing a mask and stopping you transferring the virus to your mouth or nose. It didn’t stop the airborne viruses but did stop the hand born viruses.

I’d be really worried too in your situation, especially with something like meningitis being mentioned in the news. It’s completely understandable that your mind is racing a bit.
From a mum’s point of view, I’d probably focus on staying calm but cautious. You’ve already done the right thing by asking your daughter to contact the uni—that’s important, as they’ll have the most accurate guidance on what to do next.
I’d suggest keeping a close eye on your daughter for any symptoms over the next few days—things like fever, headache, stiff neck, sensitivity to light, or feeling unusually unwell. If anything feels off at all, don’t hesitate to call a doctor or NHS 111 (if you’re in the UK).
It might also be worth asking her to limit close contact with others for a short while, just as a precaution, and to keep up good hygiene (handwashing, not sharing utensils, etc.).
I know it’s scary, but try not to panic—being exposed doesn’t necessarily mean she’ll get sick. You’re already doing exactly what a caring parent should do by staying alert and taking sensible steps.

But you have no idea what the boyfriend in that article was doing in the nightclub. He’s 20 and was likely there with friends. He could have been snogging other girls there. Sharing drinks or vapes with friends. In nightclubs it’s often loud so you get right up close to your friends to shout and talk to them etc. He might have had drinks from an infected bar staff member etc. I don’t know why you’d think a 20 year old non student would be “safe” in the club but 20 year old students wouldn’t was my point. The fact that 20 year old and his 22 year old girlfriend were not students is irrelevant was my original point.

But close and prolonged contact is not a staff member opening a bottle with infected hands.

If it was then there would be more instances like this.

The BBC article posted above was interesting, as it says all the things (people partying/vaping/sharing drinks etc) happen up and down the country every day and yet this spread has never happened so quickly.

Meningitis typically occurs as isolated one-off cases. It's now rare in the UK but occasionally there are small clusters, such as two infants at nursery, external in the north of England in 2023.

Bigger outbreaks have happened before. In the 1980s, there were 65 cases of MenB, including two deaths, in Gloucestershire, external but those cases were reported over four-and-a-half years not less than a week.

@Crwysmam I'm not a dentist but I avoid other people salvia !
I've tried to drum this into my DC.

It might be worth speaking to your GP to make sure you're up to date with the rest of your vaccines if your mum was an anti-vaxxer.

As you may be missing some if you haven't already got the catchups

To reassure - I did read it does not survive very long on surfaces outside the body . I do think we are all a it traumatised by Covid but it’s important to understand how the virus behaves.

It is close and prolonged contact. The vapes and snogging at an issue as that is when the saliva is fresh and the contact is more prolonged.

You wouldn’t get it sitting in a restaurant or in a room doing exams.

They don’t know the reason this strain seems more infectious. There’s a theory that lockdown might have reduced some natural immunity in the population. Which is worrying.

Thank you. The antivax thing is quite recent, it happened post-2020- I'm pretty sure I'm up to date on the ones you get as a baby, I've had HPV, but I will check..

I think until there has been multiple outbreaks similar to this there’s no reason to think this is the case. Otherwise why would it only be now in this one area? Why not last year? Why not in say Leeds or Manchester? If it keeps happening then it’s time to look at a whole population reason. But as a one off isolated incident (as it stands now) I wouldn’t be thinking about whole population reasons.

See I think the lack of natural immunity due to COVID is a better reason, than the thought it has mutated to be more contagious.

The argument against it being because of lack of immunity is that you would expect it to be happening already, at least in smaller clusters. Similarly the vape sharing, it happens everywhere, so why have so many people caught it this time.