Ds is five and can’t use cutlery

[toohotwiththeheatingon]

He uses his fingers generally; it’s awful when you see him grabbing fistfuls of food 🤢

I’ve just lost it with him after half his dinner ended up on the floor. Seriously feel like I’ve got a weaning baby.

Not sure what to do tbh.

Being silly and deliberately making a mess is a separate issue and I definitely wouldn't use any punitive / sanctions approach to helping him get to grips with learning to use cutlery. That needs support, enablement, facilitation, encouragement !

I like the Montessori approach - if he is a bit old now for doing the activities on their own you can make it into a competition - who can transfer the most spoonfuls of rice without spilling any / who can get the most cocktail sticks back in the pot etc. These would also subconciously promote being neat and tidy and not making a mess.

Make Playdough pizzas and cut them into slices with knife and fork,

You could also get him to cut things up when cooking - there are functional but safe plastic knives that kids can use. There is a brilliant TikTok or Reel, Cooking With Carter where a 4 year old kid makes various simple recipes - he slices cucumber and fruit with a plastic knife that looks like this QincLing 5 Pieces Plastic Kid Kitchen Knife Set, Nylon Chef Knife Children's Safe Cooking Knives for Baking, Fruit, Bread, Cake, Lettuce Knife, Salad Knife : Amazon.co.uk: Home & Kitchen

I’m sure he will pick it up. It’s just something I noticed yesterday.

Perhaps speak with your child’s teacher about this and ask what advice they can offer or help your child with, on developing fine motor skills.

iI wonder how many of these kids that can’t use cutlery have similar issues when using gaming handsets or iPads etc. My guess is a lot of them would be ok.

He doesn’t game or use an iPad, so I don’t know 👍🏻

He doesn’t game or use an iPad, so I don’t know 👍🏻

Surely the first thing to do is to actually teach them before bringing in the big guns?

How is he holding and using pencils etc? I would ask about this at parents evening and how his writing skills are shaping up.

if its a problem / challenge it could be he needs his fine motor grip skills and hand / finger strength improving. We did this with DS and the OT by hiding things like little animals, beads etc in putty / play dough and made games of trying to pull it apart to find it etc which really helped

DS struggled with using a knife and fork at the same time. It was a long process but he can now, although he uses them in the opposite hand to most people. We've always eaten together and set the expectation on table manners and using some sort of utensil and not cramming it all in (he was also a v fast eater) As he got a bit older (now 10.5) we also hammered home the expectation of good table habits at school, going out etc, which seemed to have been the turning point in the last cpl of years.

You can get a toy set thats wooden food velroced together that comes with cutlery to cut them apart, its very good for cutlery practice. But anything fine motor skills will help.

Or be like us, most of this household is South Asian so we mainly eat with a hand.

So because one child figured it out without direct teaching, you what, won’t teach the other one who’s struggling?

If one person is naturally a great reader and didn’t need teaching and the other doesn’t pick it up, do you not teach them? Start shouting and punishing them for not doing it?

You already called your own parenting of this slovenly and the fact you didn’t teach your daughter and she still learned is a totally bankrupt reason not to teach your son.

It’s a basic, essential life skill. If he cannot do it you need to put a lot more effort into teaching him. Not punishing him, teaching him.

🙄

He will pick it up - but it sounds as if he needs practice and encouragement, not just leaving to pick it up. Because if that was the case he would have already.

@SynthEsjs I don’t think it is a sign of my bad parenting to be honest. There are any number of things we don’t explicitly teach to our children; they just naturally pick them up. Speaking is the obvious one but there are many others, and I certainly don’t have a memory of anyone ‘teaching’ me how to use a knife and fork, although possibly they did but I doubt it.

It is difficult when you have a child who is a poor eater (which ds was until around three and a half, maybe) as anyone who has been in that position probably knows you just do anything that means the child eats. So I probably let a lot go that I wouldn’t have otherwise. Sitting at a table can feel very intense and awkward for poor eaters and they just get down straightaway so the mealtime is spent battling with them!

Ds eats well now mostly and a lot so it’s a good time to address table manners is a broader sense. I’m grateful for the suggestions and for the links especially; have ordered some. I do think it’s a combination of laziness, fine motor skills that probably aren’t a strength and a tendency to be silly. All those can be addressed without being punitive or insulting him or me 👍🏻

So why are you losing it with him?

I did explain, if you read my earlier post. And my ‘losing it’ was shouting at him, after several polite requests to be more careful and stop dropping food everywhere went unheeded. It does rather sound like you’re after an argument though; apologies if I’ve misinterpreting your intention.

You know you have to teach kids stuff like this yes ?

I’m not sure we do, actually.

Some stuff is taught explicitly and other things - quite a lot of things - are taught by showing not telling.

But the thread is becoming increasingly adversarial so I shall lay my knife and fork on my plate and thank you for a nice dinner; may I now be excused?

Slouching etc can be a sign of a weak core, which can make handwriting and scissors work more difficult, along with cutlery. All go hand in hand with dyspraxia. More common in boys apparently. I would do some research on the condition and speak to his teacher.

He may well be dyspraxic but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t be more directive to him around not over filling his mouth and using his fork etc. practice will build strength and improve dexterity.

Our DC with dyspraxia still has an “interesting” way with her cutlery as an adult’

I don’t think he has dyspraxia. I have some good ideas to try, and will be more proactive in encouraging proper use of cutlery - hopefully the ones I’ve ordered will help. I don’t think there’s any need for several more pages berating me although <sigh> I am sure they will continue …

Apologies, when I re read those posts the latter in particular wasn’t as critical as I had thought: sorry. Feeling a little defensive after some ‘robust’ posts.

Is there any chance he has joint hypermobility in the relevant joints? My DC4 has joint hypermobility in most of his joints, all of their motor skills are a bit behind where you'd expect them to be. They're our second child so we see the difference a lot between them and our elder child at the same age. They're not in school yet, and I'd say they use cutlery about 50 per cent of the time. Only just starting to attempt using a knife and generally leaves a bit on every plate because doesn't want to scoop up bits with their hands but can't figure out how to scoop the last bits onto the spoon or fork. They usually ask for help with that and we do help and also show how to do it. They also struggle to sit at the table nicely, it's to do with their joint hypermobility though, and associated poor proprioception. Ive meaning to buy them a wobble cushion for ages but don't know what's a reputable place to buy one, if anyone has any suggestions? (Sorry to hijack!)

I do think you need to formally teach cutlery skills though tbh, we did with both our children. Eldest has always had particularly good fine motor skills but we still had to show and assist many times before they could confidently use a knife and fork or spoon and fork. My niece is like your DC2 and very able at 2 but that's because they go to nursery full time and have been taught there. Mine only went 2-3 days a week so we had to teach them the bulk of their cutlery skills (and rightly so).

Why are you 100% sure he can’t be dyspraxic? DD wasn’t diagnosed until 16, had amazing balance, can run like the wind, taught herself to ride a bike before she was 4. However, fine motor skills are another matter!

Hypermobilty could be a factor too.

Its logical if a child finds something extra difficult most will avoid it rather than willingly practice.

Hopefully the new cutlery will help and he won’t be resistant to trying his best.

I’m not … I did say ‘I don’t think he has dyspraxia.’ I’ll happily explore it if concerns are raised but it does seem more likely he’s got into some bad habits.

It might not be - could just be habit and I understand how this happens as I also have a poor eater and you worry about putting them off the small bit of food they will eat

but if you notice any other signs it’s worth getting support as it leads to issues elsewhere with anything to do with sequencing (including maths)